The sustainability of this defense...

[PDub80]

(11-07-2023, 11:00 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: I can't say I'm "worried" about this defense, but I think it's worth talking about.

This defense has been good, but they haven't been "good" in the traditional sense. A BIG part of why they are good is because of turnovers, and red zone turnovers at that.

They are currently in the bottom 5 of the league in pass and rush yards given up per game. They are also in the bottom 1/4 of the league in total yards given up per game. Statistically, they aren't as good as they were last year where they hovered right around league average in yards given up per game.

Now they are only giving up 20 points per game this year compared to 20 last year, so that is about the same. The big reason for giving up such a low number of points is because of those red zone turnovers, though.  

I am just wondering how sustainable this "bend don't break" style of defense is going to be. IMO -a lot of those red zone turnovers are as much luck as they are "players making plays". I just hope we can tighten up our defense overall and not have to rely on turnovers to stop teams from scoring...because it will eventually catch up.

I need to look up the BHC & AHC stats on the defense. Before Healthy Calf & After Healthy Calf.

The Browns game is kind of a throw away due to the rain.

I think this defense has shown itself to be very very good. It reminds me of the Bills defenses in the early 90s. Bend don't break.

[casear2727]

(11-07-2023, 05:10 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: My point is that we are limiting points, but it's because of turnovers...especially red zone turnovers. Is that sustainable? To have teams continue to drive the ball down the field on us and count on red zone stops or turnovers to prevent them from scoring? 

Giving up yards but limiting points is what we have done this for the last 2 seasons.  How do you forget this?  Turnovers are icing on the cake and those come and go. 

[007BengalsFan]

(11-07-2023, 05:30 PM)PDub80 Wrote: I need to look up the BHC & AHC stats on the defense. Before Healthy Calf & After Healthy Calf.

The Browns game is kind of a throw away due to the rain.

I think this defense has shown itself to be very very good. It reminds me of the Bills defenses in the early 90s. Bend don't break.

Even the Browns game, the defense held Cleveland to just 13 points going into the 4th quarter.  It wasnt until the Bengals decided to go for it on 4th down, not getting it and handing the ball over to Cleveland at the Bengals own 18 yard line did that game get away.  The defense kept the team in that game and the offense did absolutely nothing.

[QueenCity]

Last three years the Bengals somehow keep making a defensive turnover in the 4th quarter... would love to see how many turnovers they produced.

Some see this success as not sustainable which is why you get posts like this.

Bengals currently lead the NFL in Turnover differential at +9

[Nicomo Cosca]

The turnovers aren’t really lucky or a fluke though. We have 3 guys that are just flat out good at making plays (CTB, Pratt, and Wilson).

[chrisball96]

(11-07-2023, 05:56 PM)casear2727 Wrote: Giving up yards but limiting points is what we have done this for the last 2 seasons.  How do you forget this?  Turnovers are icing on the cake and those come and go. 

I say “bend but don’t break” so much every Sunday that my wife always threatens to buy me a shirt with that printed on it. But it’s the truth. This team seems to tighten up in the red zone and it’s worked so far again this year.

[PDub80]

(11-07-2023, 08:32 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: Even the Browns game, the defense held Cleveland to just 13 points going into the 4th quarter.  It wasnt until the Bengals decided to go for it on 4th down, not getting it and handing the ball over to Cleveland at the Bengals own 18 yard line did that game get away.  The defense kept the team in that game and the offense did absolutely nothing.

Yes, that was kond ofnwhat I was getting at. The offense not really working due to Burrow's injury left the Bengals Defense in bad spots the first few games of the year because they couldn't sustain drives or move the ball. Field position was toast. Throw in the rain for the Browns game and it's kind of just a weird bunch of circumstances.

Inerested in the Defensive performances after Burrow's leg got right just because then they at least could sustain drives and not get killed on field position and not get conpletely worn out. Time of Posetion in those first few games was horrible through most of the game.

[WeezyBengal]

This is what I am talking about:

From this article:
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/38678708/nfl-2023-midseason-report-afc-nfc-questions-critical-stats


What we don't know yet: Can Cincinnati's defense continue forcing turnovers at a high rate? Through eight games, the Bengals rank fourth in the NFL in turnovers forced per drive at 17%, according to ESPN Stats & Information. That has negated a yards allowed per play of 5.9 which is the NFL's third-worst. Defensive coordinator Lou Anarumo will happily give up the yards if drives don't end in points. But turnovers will be crucial to Cincinnati's postseason push.

[Bing Ghuls]

Our rush defense is horrible. 27th in yards per game (129.8) and 31st in yards per attempt (5.0). We allowed over 170 rushing yards in all three of our losses.

Ravens are #1 in the league in rushing (160.3) and Browns are #3 (144.1). Our rush defense could decide the AFC North.


The '05 Bengals defense lived and died by turnovers. When we didn't get any in the Wildcard game we gave up 31 points.

[WeezyBengal]

Just going to reiterate that this defense isn't as good as some want to believe.

It starts with the pass rush. It's a huge problem.

[TheFan]

(11-12-2023, 07:04 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Just going to reiterate that this defense isn't as good as some want to believe.

It starts with the pass rush. It's a huge problem.

The lack of adding anything to a Dline that already struggled to get pressure may be on of the biggest misses of the off season. Almost every other top team loaded up their dline with pass rushers either in the offseason or trade deadline and we did neither. It's coming back to bite us hard because we struggle to stop the run and get very little pass rush. 

[Nicomo Cosca]

(11-12-2023, 07:04 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Just going to reiterate that this defense isn't as good as some want to believe.

It starts with the pass rush. It's a huge problem.

The pass rush sucked today, but you have no business losing a game where you force 3 turnovers. Especially at home.

[Nepa]

(11-12-2023, 07:12 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: The pass rush sucked today, but you have no business losing a game where you force 3 turnovers. Especially at home.

CTB came up with what should have been a game winning play, and Boyd choked it away.

No, they scored after the CTB game-saving play. Boyd dropped it on the last Bengals series.

I remember last year that Boyd went all year with out a drop (until I think it was the KC playoff game). Now I have seen at least 3 dropped so far this year.

[Rattler]

the way the D played today, it's absolutely amazing we didn't lose by three scores...worst team tackling I can remember since the mid 90's...

if TH is lost for any appreciable amount of time, we're playing to stay out of the cellar...

[Nepa]

(11-12-2023, 07:22 PM)Rattler Wrote: the way the D played today, it's absolutely amazing we didn't lose by three scores...worst team tackling I can remember since the mid 90's...

if TH is lost for any appreciable amount of time, we're playing to stay out of the cellar...

Especially the failure to tackled on the last Texans play before the FG. If they make that tackle, there is a good chance the kick is missed. 

[Nicomo Cosca]

(11-12-2023, 07:20 PM)Nepa Wrote: No, they scored after the CTB game-saving play. Boyd dropped it on the last Bengals series.

Right, I meant CTB would have had the play we all remembered had they won.

[Rattler]

(11-12-2023, 07:24 PM)Nepa Wrote: Especially the failure to tackled on the last Texans play before the FG. If they make that tackle, there is a good chance the kick is missed. 

shrouded by three tacklers no less...then Hendrickson gets hurt for the double whammy...

[NUGDUKWE]

To me the struggles against the run were the most concerning. They have shown struggles tackling a few times this year and it showed up today unfortunately. But the way the Shroud has been playing and the receivers they have it was probably the most stress our secondary has faced this year. To me it falls more on the offense. Can't have 5 straight punts with the majority being 3 and outs. Burrows picks and the Boyd drop really hurt.

[HarleyDog]

(11-12-2023, 07:37 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: To me the struggles against the run were the most concerning.

Yes, and the middle. We are not good at either. I would like to say Lou will get that fixed, but, we've struggled on both for a few years. This loss will light a fire and TBH, Ravens don't stand a chance Thursday night. We will tear them apart in their house.

[WeezyBengal]

(11-12-2023, 07:20 PM)Nepa Wrote: No, they scored after the CTB game-saving play. Boyd dropped it on the last Bengals series.

I remember last year that Boyd went all year with out a drop (until I think it was the KC playoff game). Now I have seen at least 3 dropped so far this year.

He has two this game. Dropped a third down conversion in the first half.