Bengals playcalling exposes Burrow to hits

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-17-2023, 02:28 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: I believe there's some merit to your statement, however.

Joe Burrow exposes Joe Burrow to hits all on his own. And, AND, with our offensive line woes continuing, again! Exposes him to hits - A LOT.

They've got to show Volson the door, and others

Volson gotta go, but you're right about Joe too. He's even said, I'll take a sack on third down before I give up on a play unless it effects FG position. 

[Millhouse]

(11-17-2023, 02:57 PM)Wyche Wrote: Richard's comment confused me. We were running Mix, AND using him on screens as an extension of the run. I also remember Drew Sample in the backfield to block on a few plays. The back was in the backfield to help block too with Drew. WTF was he watching? Fair to say it in previous games, but the first half they were actually doing what he said they weren't. 

Yeah he could be off for sure, but maybe with Burrow getting knocked around a bit made him think that. 

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-17-2023, 02:57 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: running for 4.2 ypc and less is an inefficient run game. If the running game was more productive and not crap, yes, they should and prob would run the ball more. But the run game has been bad for a long time now. Even in 2021. They ranked 24th in yards per carry

Aside from the Jeremy Hill anamoly, they've been bad since Rudi Johnson wore down.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-17-2023, 03:01 PM)Millhouse Wrote: Yeah he could be off for sure, but maybe with Burrow getting knocked around a bit made him think that. 

Hell man, on the TD drive, it was pretty much ALL Joe Mixon. Running and catching passes. Sample was in on pass pro several times. Just more freak shit happening to the Bengals. We should be used to it, unfortunately.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-17-2023, 11:17 AM)jj22 Wrote: I think some of this is Burrow refusal to play from under center. Refusal or inability to read the defense after turning his back to them.

They had their best outing when they were equally under center / shotgun against SF. That playbook has gone out the window.

Spot on, it is as much on Burrow as it is the coaches, maybe even more so. Puts the OL in a bad situation always being in the Shotgun
and damn near eliminates the running game. Was surprised the running game was as good as it was last night always in Shotgun.

But that is Burrow, hopefully he learns that playing under Center equally to Shotgun is where he will find the most success and this 
will lead to SB wins. Not happening this year most likely especially if he cannot play against the stealers in a week and a half sadly.

We have to essentially win out now with how good the AFC North is.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-17-2023, 03:03 PM)Wyche Wrote: Hell man, on the TD drive, it was pretty much ALL Joe Mixon. Running and catching passes. Sample was in on pass pro several times. Just more freak shit happening to the Bengals. We should be used to it, unfortunately.

I still like Hudson as well, good pass catching TE. Something positive and the running game did look great last night with Mixon
before Burrow went down. There are positives, we also had the refs wearing Ravens colors last night lol

Amazing we took the lead and were in it with Browning at the helm with all that was going on.

[casear2727]

(11-17-2023, 11:12 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: We were rushing for 8 yards per carry on 8 attempts.

The Ravens lead the league in sacks.

For some reason, Zac prefers to have Burrow drop back nearly every time to throw and minimally run.

And Burrow keeps getting hit until he's hurt.

Last night was a game to let Mixon rush for 160 yards and win.

I have slammed Zac as much as anyone but....

Burrow has waaaay more control over run and pass than ever before.

And many need to understand that the high number of horizontal pass and toss plays that we all hate are being called to due to the poor pass protection.  Those plays are supposed to slow the down rush.

I think we need to go all in on having the best oline - better players and better oline coach.  KC has proven that a SB can be won with a great oline and one great receiver.  If Burrow has time to throw the other WRs dont matter and if the oline opens holes the back doesnt really matter.  

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-17-2023, 03:23 PM)casear2727 Wrote: I have slammed Zac as much as anyone but....

Burrow has waaaay more control over run and pass than ever before.

And many need to understand that the high number of horizontal pass and toss plays that we all hate are being called to due to the poor pass protection.  Those plays are supposed to slow the down rush.

I think we need to go all in on having the best oline - better players and better oline coach.  KC has proven that a SB can be won with a great oline and one great receiver.  If Burrow has time to throw the other WRs dont matter and if the oline opens holes the back doesnt really matter.  

Nice post Casaer. Go all in on the OL and the DL while adding a new OL coach and this team will be right back in the SB.

Burrow will learn, he just loves the Shotgun and empty sets entirely too much right now.

[casear2727]

(11-17-2023, 03:28 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Nice post Casaer. Go all in on the OL and the DL while adding a new OL coach and this team will be right back in the SB.

Burrow will learn, he just loves the Shotgun and empty sets entirely too much right now.

"he just loves the Shotgun and empty sets entirely too much right now"

He likely does love that formation.
He likely does believe he is better in that formation.
He likely does believe we have a better chance of succeeding in that formation.
All could be true at the same time.

The problem is, how much does his reasoning stem from a lack of trust in the oline?  

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-17-2023, 03:33 PM)casear2727 Wrote: "he just loves the Shotgun and empty sets entirely too much right now"

He likely does love that formation.
He likely does believe he is better in that formation.
He likely does believe we have a better chance of succeeding in that formation.
All could be true at the same time.

The problem is, how much does his reasoning stem from a lack of trust in the oline?  

I am sure there is some lack of trust in the OL, they aren't great by no means, but they got it done against arguably just as good 
of a Defense in the 49ers in their place. The reason? Unpredictability with Burrow playing under Center, getting the ball out fast, a 
running game while playing Shotgun with empty sets sprinkled in. This is the winning formula we need to go back to.

It was scary to try and defend.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-17-2023, 03:09 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I still like Hudson as well, good pass catching TE. Something positive and the running game did look great last night with Mixon
before Burrow went down. There are positives, we also had the refs wearing Ravens colors last night lol

Amazing we took the lead and were in it with Browning at the helm with all that was going on.

Yes, Hudson made a couple of nice contested catches last night. Pleasant surprise.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-17-2023, 03:54 PM)Wyche Wrote: Yes, Hudson made a couple of nice contested catches last night. Pleasant surprise.

Hudson is just a natural route runner and pass catcher. Been wanting to see this at TE this year.

Sample is slow, good player, great blocker, but slow and plodding TE.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-17-2023, 03:23 PM)casear2727 Wrote: I have slammed Zac as much as anyone but....

Burrow has waaaay more control over run and pass than ever before.

And many need to understand that the high number of horizontal pass and toss plays that we all hate are being called to due to the poor pass protection.  Those plays are supposed to slow the down rush.

I think we need to go all in on having the best oline - better players and better oline coach.  KC has proven that a SB can be won with a great oline and one great receiver.  If Burrow has time to throw the other WRs dont matter and if the oline opens holes the back doesnt really matter.  

(11-17-2023, 03:28 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Nice post Casaer. Go all in on the OL and the DL while adding a new OL coach and this team will be right back in the SB.

Burrow will learn, he just loves the Shotgun and empty sets entirely too much right now.

Being an old hog..... I've been on this train since they started pummeling Andy Dalton, lol. Build the trenches, and the rest will take care of itself. It's really rudimentary fundamentals of football, but it's true. Give Burrow time, and one dynamic playmaker or two, and watch what would happen.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-17-2023, 03:56 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Hudson is just a natural route runner and pass catcher. Been wanting to see this at TE this year.

Sample is slow, good player, great blocker, but slow and plodding TE.

Yes. I didn't have a lot of faith in Hudson since he's been on a lot of practice squads, but damned if he didn't show me!

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-17-2023, 03:43 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I am sure there is some lack of trust in the OL, they aren't great by no means, but they got it done against arguably just as good 
of a Defense in the 49ers in their place. The reason? Unpredictability with Burrow playing under Center, getting the ball out fast, a 
running game while playing Shotgun with empty sets sprinkled in. This is the winning formula we need to go back to.

It was scary to try and defend.

The offense honestly didn't look too bad until Joe got hurt. Shooter missed a FG, but the run game was looking good, short passing game was alright, and they would've likely got a few more shots at the homerun. They did a few under center plays, and got good execution on a few toss plays.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-17-2023, 03:58 PM)Wyche Wrote: Being an old hog..... I've been on this train since they started pummeling Andy Dalton, lol. Build the trenches, and the rest will take care of itself. It's really rudimentary fundamentals of football, but it's true. Give Burrow time, and one dynamic playmaker or two, and watch what would happen.

We would really find out how great Burrow could be if he had a great OL in front of him. New OL coach while adding some 
more athletic players in FA and we should be right back on track to being that scary Offense. Our OL still isn't as bad as some
claim though, Burrow will learn that the Shotgun all the time is just too predictable and he likes to hold onto the ball to wait
for something to happen far too often, we saw the winning formula against the 49ers.

I could tell when Burrow was on the sideline after the wrist injury last night, he saw it.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-17-2023, 04:03 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: We would really find out how great Burrow could be if he had a great OL in front of him. New OL coach while adding some 
more athletic players in FA and we should be right back on track to being that scary Offense. Our OL still isn't as bad as some
claim though, Burrow will learn that the Shotgun all the time is just too predictable and he likes to hold onto the ball to wait
for something to happen far too often, we saw the winning formula against the 49ers.

I could tell when Burrow was on the sideline after the wrist injury last night, he saw it.

Ya know, might do him some good to watch it in living color from the sideline. 

[2MinutesHate]

(11-17-2023, 02:53 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: They were 1-3 in those four games in 2019, with a scoring differential of -55.

Mixon has averaged only 3.9ypc since the start of 2020, the 4 100+ yard games he had since then the Bengals are 4-0 in.

Getting 100+ yard games just for the sake of it while getting your ass beaten isn't productive. If Mixon and the Run Game Coordinator were better, he would have more carries and more 100+ yard games, but at the end of the day you need to do what you need to in order to win.

In 2019, it was Andy Dalton when the wheels were falling off, so there's that.  
As has been said a million times, the run opens up the pass, so if we could just run somewhat better, it's going to make Burrow's life so much easier.

I do think Mixon is a good back but the holes just aren't there.  I don't think Jonathan Taylor would have much more success here TBH.
I'm not blaming Mixon or even the OL really.  It's just seems to be an aspect of the coaching style.  

Mixon ran the the ball pretty damned well last night until they put Browning in.  Ravens were getting gashed.  Once Burrow got hurt and Browning started in with the noodle arm throws, it was easy to key in on Mixon.  I think he was averaging close to 5.5 YPC before JB left.

Save Burrow by balancing the offense please.  I'd like to see him playing for the Bengals until he's 40. 
No way he makes it that long.  I just don't see how.

[*michaelsean*]

(11-17-2023, 11:13 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Knowing the NFL they will come down HARD on us. They hate us.

Is it really true you don't have to disclose an injury if the player practiced full all week? I saw that on twitter last night.

What's the definition of an injury?  I don't see how you can be required to report every hurt if you are full go.    The sad thing is all these injury reports are required for gambling purposes.