How would you redesign the offense with our current players?

[Joelist]

Here are my thoughts:

1) Embrace power blocking schemes on both run and pass. Our OL room is currently oriented towards power schemes, so lean into it. This even extends to offseason player acquisition - go power. And commit to it - no more switching the scheme during the season.

2) Get under center. It helps the linemen get into a rhythm especially if we run more than we have been (my next point actually). It also helps disguise the play a bit.

3) RUN MORE! We should be aiming at a target of roughly even between run and pass. Not only will this increase the effectiveness of the run game over time it will make play action work better and also cause defenses to have to play the run more and not tee off like they do now.

4) Redesign the routes to help the receivers get open. Make the QBs life easier. This takes a lot of forms such as bunches, crossers, slants and more. Plus doing this in conjunction with the earlier points will make it easier to get open.

5) Gameplan to use the tendencies of the opposing defense to your advantage. ALL defenses have tendencies which game film study can reveal. The art here is identifying those tendencies and figuring out how to burn the defense on them.

6) Break your own patterns. Watch your own offense on tape and look for "tells" that give the play away. Then remove them. Once you remove the defense knowing the play it also makes them have to hesitate for that critical second.

[KillerGoose]

I would like to see more under center and a little more running. Trying to get roughly even between the two is an awful idea, frankly. Somewhere in the realm of 60/40 pass/run is the sweet spot for this type of offense. Cincinnati has mixed in a lot of RPOs this season. I like the attempt to generate conflict but I would like to see more playaction than RPOs. I really liked some of the plays we saw on Thursday where Mixon was receiving. That's a great way to get more value out of him.

The rush offense struggles partially due to the backs we have. None of the guys we have are able to break tackles very well, so they aren't going to get you much extra yardage. Still, switching up the looks and being able to attack the edges better would help, I think.

[impactplaya]

I'd go to more 2 TE sets. Like Goose said
More snaps under center. I wish the Bengals
Could run more of a 2 RB attack but none
Of the RBs have any kind of 2nd gear
Or burst to evade the 1st and 2nd levels

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-20-2023, 02:57 PM)Joelist Wrote: Here are my thoughts:

1) Embrace power blocking schemes on both run and pass. Our OL room is currently oriented towards power schemes, so lean into it. This even extends to offseason player acquisition - go power. And commit to it - no more switching the scheme during the season.

2) Get under center. It helps the linemen get into a rhythm especially if we run more than we have been (my next point actually). It also helps disguise the play a bit.

3) RUN MORE! We should be aiming at a target of roughly even between run and pass. Not only will this increase the effectiveness of the run game over time it will make play action work better and also cause defenses to have to play the run more and not tee off like they do now.

4) Redesign the routes to help the receivers get open. Make the QBs life easier. This takes a lot of forms such as bunches, crossers, slants and more. Plus doing this in conjunction with the earlier points will make it easier to get open.

5) Gameplan to use the tendencies of the opposing defense to your advantage. ALL defenses have tendencies which game film study can reveal. The art here is identifying those tendencies and figuring out how to burn the defense on them.

6) Break your own patterns. Watch your own offense on tape and look for "tells" that give the play away. Then remove them. Once you remove the defense knowing the play it also makes them have to hesitate for that critical second.

I like a lot of your thoughts Joelist. Especially the QB playing under Center way more often. Even running the ball 40% of the time 
would be an improvement over what we have been doing this season from what I would guess. I don't even know our percentage 
of run to pass but it has to be extremely low. Lowest in the league last I checked.

Keep using Tanner Hudson in the passing game is one thing I would like to reiterate. Dude is a natural pass catching TE.

Browning is also a pretty good runner so I would like to keep the RPO's in the playbook. Need to play out of the pistol much more 
often and like you say, use a lot of bunches, crossers, slants and post routes with our WR's and TE's. Use Mixon in some WR looks 
as he is still a very good pass catching RB and underrated in this aspect of his game.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

Have the QB play from under center.

Put Cody Ford at LG, I don't think he's good, but I am tired of watching Volson. If not Ford, then pretty much anyone else. A potential good is better than a known bad.

Take whatever backup or practice squad OL that has the (relative) best hands and (relative) decent quickness and turn them into a FB for pass blocking, run blocking... and throw him like 4-6 passes in the final 7 games just to show they can do it and that defenses need to respect the possibility.

Stop playing Irv Smith entirely. He has played 41.56% of the offensive snaps this year and provides negative value while on the field. His playing time would go to the FB.

Start Chase Brown at RB because we need to see if he's any good or if we need to just completely restart our entire RB room from scratch next season.

Let there only be ONE playcaller on the headset. None of this 6 guys in committee BS.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-20-2023, 04:04 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Have the QB play from under center.

Put Cody Ford at LG, I don't think he's good, but I am tired of watching Volson. If not Ford, then pretty much anyone else. A potential good is better than a known bad.

Take whatever backup or practice squad OL that has the (relative) best hands and (relative) decent quickness and turn them into a FB for pass blocking, run blocking... and throw him like 4-6 passes in the final 7 games just to show they can do it and that defenses need to respect the possibility.

Stop playing Irv Smith entirely. He has played 41.56% of the offensive snaps this year and provides negative value while on the field. His playing time would go to the FB.

Start Chase Brown at RB because we need to see if he's any good or if we need to just completely restart our entire RB room from scratch next season.

Let there only be ONE playcaller on the headset. None of this 6 guys in committee BS.

I like it.

[reuben.ahmed]

That 6 guy in a committee causes nobody to take responsibility when they play like trash. It's like emailing or slacking 5 people in the TO list and saying can someone help.

[Whatever]

(11-20-2023, 04:04 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Have the QB play from under center.

Put Cody Ford at LG, I don't think he's good, but I am tired of watching Volson. If not Ford, then pretty much anyone else. A potential good is better than a known bad.

Take whatever backup or practice squad OL that has the (relative) best hands and (relative) decent quickness and turn them into a FB for pass blocking, run blocking... and throw him like 4-6 passes in the final 7 games just to show they can do it and that defenses need to respect the possibility.

Stop playing Irv Smith entirely. He has played 41.56% of the offensive snaps this year and provides negative value while on the field. His playing time would go to the FB.

Start Chase Brown at RB because we need to see if he's any good or if we need to just completely restart our entire RB room from scratch next season.

Let there only be ONE playcaller on the headset. None of this 6 guys in committee BS.

A week or two simply isn't enough time for an OL to learn a new position.  If you want to use a FB, it's probably Sample who normally fills that role when it's called on.

You'll completely lose the locker room if you bench a team captain to start a rookie 5th round pick who has shown nothing.  If you want to give Brown some touches to evaluate him further, that's fine, but to start him would be career suicide for Zac.  Besides which, we already know we need to rebuild the RB room.  

[TecmoBengals]

I want to see Zac think about his offense post-Tee & TB.

What kind of offense did the Patriots run 10 to 12 years ago when it was Brady throwing to the double TEs (Gronk & Hernandez) and Welker? Can Burrow be that version of Tom Brady?

Chase will be here as the lone star and well-paid WR. Investing in TEs who can pass catch also facilitates Duke managing the salary cap since TEs typically don't get the high paying contracts like a WR. Plus, any drafted TEs will be on rookie deals.

Note: I know the OP said current personnel. Start using who we have now to see if they can be part of a new offense going forward.

[Joelist]

I want Chase Brown to get more snaps but Mixon is still the starter. Get the total run snaps up into the 40-ish percentile (Goose good point half may be overkill) and Brown can get 10-15 snaps while still giving Mixon around 20. I also want Chuck Sizzle and Yoshi to get enough snaps per game to get a true read on them and to get them comfortable. We need to know if we have the next Boyd on roster in Sizzle and if Yoshi looks good enough it gives us options with Tee. It also helps us with draft strategy.

What I am ultimately looking for is an offensive scheme with an actual identity and that plays to what our players strengths are instead of just going out and expecting Burrow and Chase to play hero ball every week. With this power line that necessarily means more runs using power concepts. Rejiggering the routes to help the receivers helps the QB as well. Getting under center more helps the line get rhythm and also is part of the important piece of finding the "tells" that give the play away and removing them. Keep defenses uncertain.

[*Synric*]

There will be more runs just for the simple fact Browning is probably going to hand off the RPOs while Burrow preferred to Pass. I don't expect much change in the offense it will still be dominated by inside zone and duo with a mix of traps and dart (all power concepts except inside zone which is a versatile vertical run play). We will likely see more jet sweeps and end arounds to get the ball on the edge of the defense.

We will likely see a change in how defenses play the WRs alot more 1 on 1s so I'd like to see them really emphasize getting Tee the ball when hes back in the lineup.

[kevin]

(11-20-2023, 02:57 PM)Joelist Wrote: Here are my thoughts:

1) Embrace power blocking schemes on both run and pass. Our OL room is currently oriented towards power schemes, so lean into it. This even extends to offseason player acquisition - go power. And commit to it - no more switching the scheme during the season.

2) Get under center. It helps the linemen get into a rhythm especially if we run more than we have been (my next point actually). It also helps disguise the play a bit.

3) RUN MORE! We should be aiming at a target of roughly even between run and pass. Not only will this increase the effectiveness of the run game over time it will make play action work better and also cause defenses to have to play the run more and not tee off like they do now.

4) Redesign the routes to help the receivers get open. Make the QBs life easier. This takes a lot of forms such as bunches, crossers, slants and more. Plus doing this in conjunction with the earlier points will make it easier to get open.

5) Gameplan to use the tendencies of the opposing defense to your advantage. ALL defenses have tendencies which game film study can reveal. The art here is identifying those tendencies and figuring out how to burn the defense on them.

6) Break your own patterns. Watch your own offense on tape and look for "tells" that give the play away. Then remove them. Once you remove the defense knowing the play it also makes them have to hesitate for that critical second.

Cleveland showed how to beat Steelers with their QB out for season.  You lean more on the running game.  Cleveland used both Ford and Hunt to keep the fresh legs in game.  Mixon and somebody else pounding the rock.   Yes, and to get the most out of RB's, more snaps under center.  There are very few running plays from shotgun.  Not that Bengals can't mix in some shotgun, but get away from all shotgun all game long.  

Other than that, I wouldn't change the system Browning has been playing in.  Too late in season to go to a new playbook.  Against 49ers Bengals went under center more, and won.  Cleveland leaned on RB's more to beat Steelers without Watson, so that should be Bengals plan without Burrow. 

[*bfine32*]

I'd do more of those sweeps and screens to JaMarr. Those things always work.

OK, I wouldn't change anything but less of that

[Bengalstripes9]

I’m tired of seeing burrow get killed.

We need a more balanced attack.

Last year our most effective formation by far was shotgun and we could only run out of shotgun because the defense didn’t see it coming. Anytime we went heavy it was obvious we were running it. This year defenses adjusted to our shotgun and we really never peaked as an offense.

I’m not convinced we have a Super Bowl caliber offensive coaching staff. I’m watching the game tonight and KC and Philly routinely blow out opponents with lesser offensive playmakers (than ours). The patriots used to do the same with lesser playmakers.

A well designed offense will do that. It’s important to be able to adjust your game plan to the defense you are playing. It’s important to develop a great offensive line. It’s important to game plan wide open players using creative play designs.

What separates great teams year after year is great coaching. Talent is important—especially at qb. But coaching (and qb play) is what sets the best teams apart from all the other talented teams out there.

We’re going to learn a lot about the quality of our offensive coaches in the next 7 weeks. If they can make the playoffs without burrow that could convince me that this staff can bring us a Super Bowl. If not, I’m really not convinced and will have to be convinced next year.

Next year we need a more balanced attack and a less predictable attack. Our divisional opponents know what to expect and it’s a big reason for our lack of success offensively the last year plus.

It’d be nice to be able to say we have a dominant coach to pair with burrow but I don’t think anyone can realistically say that. We don’t have a top 5 coach like the 9ers, Philly, or KC and I’m not sure Zac will develop into one. The last three years were our best opportunity to win it all and we weren’t good enough.It’ll take some innovation to get us where we need to be, and my hope is our coaches don’t hold us back from realizing the potential of the great players we have. If we can’t win a Super Bowl with burrow I don’t think I’ll be able to continue to support the team.

[Interceptor]

Go run-heavy. Use Jumbo sets if need be. Cutback plays. Misdirection. Jet sweeps. Wishbone formations. Wildcat. I'm talking shifts, plays, protections, snap counts, alerts, check-with-me's, Double X, jet, ice cream, 36, counter naked waggle at 16-9 Tennessee Free. Anything for a creative ground game. Once the ground game becomes a legitimate threat, play-action opens up the receivers. This way protects the QB more.