"Tanking" in the NFL

[*Nately120*]

(12-04-2023, 01:41 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Fields stinks. Building around him by getting him a second #1 WR to go with his $12.5m/yr TE, is not going to work well because he'll never be able to feed them all and it'll lead to locker room issues. 

They should have traded him off to someone who still believed in him last offseason to recoup some value and drafted Stroud. Now they should just take Williams and build around him, because after this year you'd have to pick up Fields' 5th year option at $23.25m and he's eligible for an extension. 

Don't Daniel Jones yourself, though at least Jones won a bit. It doesn't matter how bad your supporting staff is, if you're 3 years in and you've never won more than 3 games in a season (just assuming the Bears won't finish 2-3 or better), you're not the future. He'll probably be 8-30 after this season, assuming he doesn't get hurt again (missed multiple games every season and rushing 10 times per game won't help that).

Ehh, this makes sense normally but you're looking at the Bears as if they were a normal franchise.  We're talking about a franchise that has never had a 4,000 yard passer and has a season high TD record of 29 that was set by journeyman, Erik Kramer, in 1995.  How impossible is it in today's insanely passing-friendly NFL to keep passing records from almost 30 years ago?

And I think Fields with a loaded offense would cause fewer issues that drafting Caleb Williams who probably doesn't want to go to that cursed franchise, assuming he'd even be good there which is a stretch.  I'm not saying the Bears will ever be good, but rotating out Fields for Stroud or Williams just has "midwest AZ Cardinals" vibes.  They probably will draft Williams against his will though, and they'll end up looking like the Baltimore Colts dealing with Elway or the old school Buccaneers with Bo Jackson.

Maybe Caleb Williams is better than I think he is, I really don't know, but I've heard that he isn't perfect and it would take absolute perfection to drag Chicago out of NFL irrelevance like their 1985 team did for a brief, overly-marketed moment.

[lone bengal]

Players and coaches don’t tank too much money on the line and if you don’t play hard in football you get hurt. Call me a bad fan if you want but I’m personally rooting for losses.. We’re currently picking 13th right now and if we lose to Jacksonville we can move up to 9. The only real shot we have at wins are probably the Colts and Vikings and that’s not even a guarantee. Rooting for a top 10 pick hoping a bunch of QB’s go and we can land the best OL or DL players need to build the trenches and become a more physical team. Fire Pollack and get an offensive line coach who can run scheme better , evaluate talent and coach better.

[Whatever]

(12-03-2023, 02:04 PM)Millhouse Wrote: It's also difficult to sit a vet or limit their playing time when there are incentives in their contracts. Imagine being told we need to play a younger guy to give him experience, but you probably won't hit that 'mark' to make an extra million or two. I'm going to assume that doesn't resonate well with players, and doesn't make it easier to bring in free agents either.

Players understand that this is a thing.  Joe Thomas once said in an interview "You can play to win now or you you can play to win later."

A lot of it is up to the coaches to balance the fine line.  You may encourage players to sit with injuries they would normally try to play through.  You may focus on reinforcing your basic plays and dial back on more exotic stuff.  

With players, you have to have some rational explanation as to why changes are being made.  For example, it's easy to explain Battle starting for Scott or Brown getting RB2 carries over Williams and Evans because the performance hasn't been there.  It's a lot more difficult to give Carman or Smith a shot at RT because Jonah is in a contract year and hasn't played badly.  

[jj22]

Didn't they tank in 2019 once they realized they were in the running for the top pick? Or was Finley really better than Dalton?

[Bing Ghuls]

(12-04-2023, 12:40 PM)jj22 Wrote: Didn't they tank in 2019 once they realized they were in the running for the top pick? Or was Finley really better than Dalton?

That was an obvious "tank" move.

I just can't believe Finley look that much better in practice than he did in the games.

[Bing Ghuls]

(12-04-2023, 02:50 AM)Bengalstripes9 Wrote: I continue to say negative things about the team. But I’m just being honest with myself about what I have witnessed. I’m trying to be unbiased. Fans need to do this. The more the bengals players and coaches hear this the more they have to prove that it isn’t the case. So I encourage everyone to let them have it!

Players and coaches have millions of dollars on the line based on how they perform.  They also face humiliation from national media and opposing players if they fail.

I don't really think they half-ass it just because some home fans are positive.

[kalibengal]

(12-04-2023, 06:40 PM)Bing Ghuls Wrote: Players and coaches have millions of dollars on the line based on how they perform.  They also face humiliation from national media and opposing players if they fail.

I don't really think they half-ass it just because some home fans are positive.

trotting out Browning as our QB to lead us deep into the playoffs in its self was a tank move. 
If they were serious about playoffs we should have seen a proven vet being brought in like Flacco or Ryan , and maybe Wentz before Rams claimed him 
I think the team would have had a better feel for the possibility of continuing with some Victories and playoffs  as these guys have taken teams to the SB.  

[Bengalstripes9]

(12-04-2023, 06:40 PM)Bing Ghuls Wrote: Players and coaches have millions of dollars on the line based on how they perform.  They also face humiliation from national media and opposing players if they fail.

I don't really think they half-ass it just because some home fans are positive.

I’m not saying anyone is half assing anything. But if someone is unaware of their struggles/issues/incompetence/shortfalls/etc how on earth can they overcome them. They need to be made aware!!

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(12-03-2023, 02:09 PM)jason Wrote: Tanking is organizational... It's not the players.

Truth. We all know the players will play to win and the Coaches as well will be coaching to win.

Just unlikely we DO win much this year with our main guy out who we pretty much built our entire team around.

Which is why I am fine with us losing out for a special player, we got Burrow and Chase the same way.

I doubt we get much of a chance in the future to get this early of a pick, need to take advantage while we can.