5 - 0 vs the NFC, 0 - 5 vs the AFC North.

[BengalYankee]

(12-26-2023, 07:34 AM)Essex Johnson Wrote: Worse vs bad then the Bengals were on a tail spin after the collapse in 2015 in playoffs, 4 straight no playoff seasons, ZT took over a team trending bad and helped guide it to winning again.

I give credit to Mr. Joe Burrow >>> Andy Dalton




What is ZT's record without Burrow...

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(12-26-2023, 05:55 PM)BengalYankee Wrote: I give credit to Mr. Joe Burrow >>> Andy Dalton




What is ZT's record without Burrow...

I thought the same until Zac won 3 games in a row against good teams with Browning. This made me think that Zac can win without Joe.

We will see if it continues against KC Sunday.

[casear2727]

(12-26-2023, 06:03 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I thought the same until Zac won 3 games in a row against good teams with Browning. This made me think that Zac can win without Joe.

We will see if it continues against KC Sunday.

#1.  We cant put too much on Jakes plate.  He is not all word like a few here think.
#2.  The defense cant be so atrocious, we will never win again if they continue to play like they did vs Pitt.
#3.  The punting has to get better quickly.  We are not obtaining field advantage on 4th down with Robbins.  He must be more consistent. 

[Shake n Blake]

(12-26-2023, 06:18 AM)BengalYankee Wrote: Lol. Where did you learn math?

The difference between 2-14 and 6-10 is 60%!!!

No splitting hairs Marvin inherited a horrible team. 

Your venom should be against Dick LeBeau. 

You should add some context, BY.

Sure, that team was 2-14, but there were tons of talented young players. Chad, TJ, Rudi, a good o-line, Justin Smith, Brian Simmons and the rights to draft Carson Palmer. Not to mention an owner with tons of cap space and a willingness to spend to reshape the defense.

Meanwhile, the team that Zac inherited was 6-10 but the players were heading in the opposite direction. AJ Green, Geno Atkins, Carlos Dunlap, a bad o-line, etc.

Those guys were close to washed and also pretty disgruntled. Imo, Marvin started with a better team and a lower bar for success. He was also more set up for a quick turnaround.

(12-26-2023, 08:30 AM)Essex Johnson Wrote: What is great,
Coach 1 has 4 SB appearances with 0 wins, 10 playoffs in 24 years, 11-9 in playoffs 535 winning percentage 
Coach 2 has 2 SB appearances with 1 win, 10 playoffs in 15 year, 12-9 in playoffs , 623 winning percentage,  
Coach 3 has  1 SB appearances with 1 win, 10 playoffs in 15 years, 11-9 in playoffs 617 winning percentage 
Coach 4 has  4 SB appearances with 0 wins, 8 playoffs in 18 years  11-8 in playoffs 561 winning percentage 
Coach 5 has 2 SB appearances with 1 win ,  10 playoffs in 16 years, 8-9 in playoffs  630 winning percentage
Coach 6 has 3 SB appearances with 2 wins , 10 playoffs in 19 years, 11-9 in playoffs 569 winning percentage 
Coach 7 has 0 SB appearances,  14 playoffs in 21 years 5-13 in playoffs 613 winning percentage 

3 coaches in HOF Cowher (2), Levy (4), Parcells (6) 
2 coaches not in HOF  Schottenheimer (7) , Reeves (1)
2 active Tomlin (5) , Harbaugh (2).
All are hof consideration careers, none have great playoff records, Tomlin is for sure HOF career consideration as is Harbaugh when you compare them with the rest of that list.

Also sure the cupboard was not bare for Tomlin but give credit were credit is due , he took a 8-8 team  to 10-6 then won SB and 15 starters in 2008 team were not on 2005 and if you want to go to 2011 team only 7 remained that lost in SB. I agree he has not maintained that level of success but how look above at that excellent coaches listed it is hard in NFL to win at high level year in and year out and even make SBs.

Fair counter. That said.

1. The last Cowher team was 8-8, sure, but only 1 season removed from winning a championship. A rebound was likely just looking at who they had.

2. Who were those remaining players and coaches? Ben Roethlisberger, Hines Ward, Willie Parker, Heath Miller, James Harrison, Troy Polamalu, Lamar Woodley, Ike Taylor, Ryan Clark, Brett Keisel, James Farrior, Aaron Smith, etc were all drafted by Cowher. Look at that list, brother. That's pretty much all of their great players. Obviously Tomlin had to bring some of his own guys, but this was undeniably the core of Tomlin's Super Bowl group.

Then you had the legend Dlck LeBeau coaching the defense.

Tomlin still hasn't done anything since that core started to dry up. The record speaks for itself and points directly to Tomlin not being able to accomplish anything great without Cowher's team.

(12-26-2023, 01:38 PM)2MinutesHate Wrote: That is a good point.  I forgot about the first Dalton year which was really bad.  But still, it appears the rest of the North has figured us out.  We played Baltimore kinda tough both games (before Burrow got hurt) but the other 3 division games, we really got pushed around.


I think Zac has an opportunity to redefine himself and use the offseason to beat the other 3 at their own game.  Good hard-nosed football with a balanced offense that can run the ball.  We've got the best QB in the division so I think it would actually help Joe.  I'd let Higgins walk and use the savings to dedicate to the run game and defense.

If you can't win your division, a Super Bowl win will be even more unlikely.  

Agree 100% that the division has figured us out. We'll figure a lot out about Zac next year.

Tbh, I feel like a great coach would've adjusted this year.

(12-26-2023, 05:55 PM)BengalYankee Wrote: I give credit to Mr. Joe Burrow >>> Andy Dalton




What is ZT's record without Burrow...

The Bengals were rebuilding in Zac's first couple years. I wouldn't use that record against him.

This year, Zac is 3-2 without Burrow, and mind you, that's with a guy who has been a practice squad QB for 4 years.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(12-26-2023, 07:15 PM)casear2727 Wrote: #1.  We cant put too much on Jakes plate.  He is not all word like a few here think.
#2.  The defense cant be so atrocious, we will never win again if they continue to play like they did vs Pitt.
#3.  The punting has to get better quickly.  We are not obtaining field advantage on 4th down with Robbins.  He must be more consistent. 

Agree with all 3 points. Having Jake in the Shotgun all the time puts pressure on him and the OL, just isn't the way to go, we have to do 
what works and stay unpredictable. More under Center while running the ball to take pressure off of Browning and let the OL play aggressive
and attack. On Defense, we need to either play more Man to get our young Corners comfortable or hope for the players to learn how to play
better in Zone. CTB coming back should help. Robbins has been the one disappointment of all the Draft picks in my eyes.

[Rotobeast]

(12-26-2023, 11:07 AM)reuben.ahmed Wrote: You can wear your Bengals hoodie to Home Depot and the employees will shoulder chuck you when they walk by with no remorse.

I need to drive up and get me some of that action.
[emoji106]

Sent from my SM-S515DL using Tapatalk

[*Nately120*]

(12-26-2023, 11:07 AM)reuben.ahmed Wrote: It's funny to imagine the Browns win a SB before Burrow does, we wouldn't live that shit down, but it looks like it's Lamar's year.

I think the big issue with the year round 24/7 NFL cycle and constant online engagement is that it is so damn easy to hate everyone else with a passion.  What do we do with the AFC side of the playoffs?

we hate the Ravens
we hate the Browns
the Dolphins winning fuels the Bengal haters because they have the "QB we coulda had" (plus like a buttload of 1st round picks) and the "real" new-wave HC
we hate the Chiefs and now the whole Taylor Swift thing has old dudes rage-crapping their pants over it all
I guess the Jaguars winning (as if they can do anything other than lose and get hurt these days) would fuel Bengals haters since Trevor Lawrence is the other golden boy QB

Ida know...I have to admit that while I'm supposed to hate the Ravens and Browns with my dying breath, the idea of Joe Flacco and the Browns playing in the AFC Championship game in Baltimore would be too nuts to miss.  Flacco winning a SB with the Browns while their sex offender QB pouts the whole time ala Carson Wentz would be pretty funny, I guess.

[Essex Johnson]

(12-26-2023, 07:49 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: You should add some context, BY.

Sure, that team was 2-14, but there were tons of talented young players. Chad, TJ, Rudi, a good o-line, Justin Smith, Brian Simmons and the rights to draft Carson Palmer. Not to mention an owner with tons of cap space and a willingness to spend to reshape the defense.

Meanwhile, the team that Zac inherited was 6-10 but the players were heading in the opposite direction. AJ Green, Geno Atkins, Carlos Dunlap, a bad o-line, etc.

Those guys were close to washed and also pretty disgruntled. Imo, Marvin started with a better team and a lower bar for success. He was also more set up for a quick turnaround.


Fair counter. That said.

1. The last Cowher team was 8-8, sure, but only 1 season removed from winning a championship. A rebound was likely just looking at who they had.

2. Who were those remaining players and coaches? Ben Roethlisberger, Hines Ward, Willie Parker, Heath Miller, James Harrison, Troy Polamalu, Lamar Woodley, Ike Taylor, Ryan Clark, Brett Keisel, James Farrior, Aaron Smith, etc were all drafted by Cowher. Look at that list, brother. That's pretty much all of their great players. Obviously Tomlin had to bring some of his own guys, but this was undeniably the core of Tomlin's Super Bowl group.

Then you had the legend Dlck LeBeau coaching the defense.

Tomlin still hasn't done anything since that core started to dry up. The record speaks for itself and points directly to Tomlin not being able to accomplish anything great without Cowher's team.


Agree 100% that the division has figured us out. We'll figure a lot out about Zac next year.

Tbh, I feel like a great coach would've adjusted this year.


The Bengals were rebuilding in Zac's first couple years. I wouldn't use that record against him.

This year, Zac is 3-2 without Burrow, and mind you, that's with a guy who has been a practice squad QB for 4 years.

Prediction that Tomlin in the future will be joining the next team Cowher is on called NFL HOF 

[BengalYankee]

(12-26-2023, 07:49 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: You should add some context, BY.

Sure, that team was 2-14, but there were tons of talented young players. Chad, TJ, Rudi, a good o-line, Justin Smith, Brian Simmons and the rights to draft Carson Palmer. Not to mention an owner with tons of cap space and a willingness to spend to reshape the defense.

Meanwhile, the team that Zac inherited was 6-10 but the players were heading in the opposite direction. AJ Green, Geno Atkins, Carlos Dunlap, a bad o-line, etc.

Those guys were close to washed and also pretty disgruntled. Imo, Marvin started with a better team and a lower bar for success. He was also more set up for a quick turnaround.


Fair counter. That said.

1. The last Cowher team was 8-8, sure, but only 1 season removed from winning a championship. A rebound was likely just looking at who they had.

2. Who were those remaining players and coaches? Ben Roethlisberger, Hines Ward, Willie Parker, Heath Miller, James Harrison, Troy Polamalu, Lamar Woodley, Ike Taylor, Ryan Clark, Brett Keisel, James Farrior, Aaron Smith, etc were all drafted by Cowher. Look at that list, brother. That's pretty much all of their great players. Obviously Tomlin had to bring some of his own guys, but this was undeniably the core of Tomlin's Super Bowl group.

Then you had the legend Dlck LeBeau coaching the defense.

Tomlin still hasn't done anything since that core started to dry up. The record speaks for itself and points directly to Tomlin not being able to accomplish anything great without Cowher's team.


Agree 100% that the division has figured us out. We'll figure a lot out about Zac next year.

Tbh, I feel like a great coach would've adjusted this year.


The Bengals were rebuilding in Zac's first couple years. I wouldn't use that record against him.

This year, Zac is 3-2 without Burrow, and mind you, that's with a guy who has been a practice squad QB for 4 years.

Here is some context for you. Cowher's team that you glorify[hand in your Bengals fan card] was a wild card team that won a controversial championship. And had NEVER done anything prior to that tainted championship. You may kiss their ass of that tainted championship, but I don't. Dick Lebeau was a Dick see Bengals 2000-2002.

I am not a Steeler fan, but I hate Cowher and it confuses me that you give this POS a pass. 

 

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-26-2023, 08:26 PM)Rotobeast Wrote: I need to drive up and get me some of that action.
[emoji106]

Sent from my SM-S515DL using Tapatalk

When we leaving? I got a few forearm shivers left in me. Them mfers wouldn't do it more than once.....one of us would be wearing an ass kicking. Then I'd "Karen" their ass out to the manager.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-27-2023, 09:58 AM)BengalYankee Wrote: Here is some context for you. Cowher's team that you glorify[hand in your Bengals fan card] was a wild card team that won a controversial championship. And had NEVER done anything prior to that tainted championship. You may kiss their ass of that tainted championship, but I don't. Dick Lebeau was a Dick see Bengals 2000-2002.

I am not a Steeler fan, but I hate Cowher and it confuses me that you give this POS a pass. 

 

Hell, at least he's not defending the current StOoLeR coach and bashing ours like someone else who shall remain "nameless".

[BengalYankee]

(12-27-2023, 10:12 AM)Wyche Wrote: Hell, at least he's not defending the current StOoLeR coach and bashing ours like someone else who shall remain "nameless".

He is bashing the Bengals with our slogan "Who Dey", what is wrong with you?????

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-27-2023, 10:18 AM)BengalYankee Wrote: He is bashing the Bengals with our slogan "Who Dey", what is wrong with you?????

I was referring to your post about our coach.....you kinda trashed him before coming to the defense of Omar Epps. 

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-25-2023, 07:36 PM)Bronxbengal Wrote: I also want a coach like this.  Tomlin knows how to motivate a team which he did the week leading up to our game this week.  I haven’t seen Taylor motivate anything or anybody.  Matter of fact, Taylor teams are under motivated

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Uh.....the entire NFL world, and Tyler Boyd's dumbass, were questioning the team's heart, Tomlin's lack of control of the locker room, and calling them lazy. Where were you praising Omar Epps then?

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-25-2023, 08:18 PM)casear2727 Wrote: This makes zero sense to me.  

Ravens won their last Super Bowl 10 years ago, they have ONE postseason win in the last 5 years.

Steelers won their last Super Bowl 14 years ago, they have ONE post season win in the last 7 years.

You can trash Zac all you want, but these two teams have done NOTHING recently.  Weird take.

They've gotta be right about their narrative! No way in hell are they gonna change their mind, even when presented with more and new data. Heels dug in, I can't be wrong, the new 'murica.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-24-2023, 10:07 PM)Destro Wrote: When they study us, they know how to play us. Is it the NFC East next year?

That's every division. The Raiders just dismantled the Chiefs with 69 yards passing. 

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-25-2023, 05:40 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I was going to make a similar thread eventually, while posting our stats inside and outside of our division. I feel like the division has caught up to Zac and obviously other teams that play us less frequently and don't literally draft with "stopping the Bengals" in mind haven't yet.

Zac and staff need to adjust back. Otherwise, this division will go 6-0 against us every year.

It's almost like there's something different about this season vs the last two .....I can't quite put my finger on it, but yeah, there's definitely something different about this season vs the last two where we won the AFCN ....

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-26-2023, 10:01 AM)reuben.ahmed Wrote: Flacco has a good chance to take them to the SB and it's without Chubb - how much sense does that make, that team is built for the long haul pending any contract situations. Really it's only the Ravens that stand in their way right now and Flacco wouldn't have something ot play for? A Flacco vs Lamar game in the playoffs is all the NFL wants right now, with Flacco yelling into the camera at end "you never shoulda ***** made me retire!".

With the Deshaun Watson contract, and many others coming due very soon, the end is nigh. They better win it with Flacco....

[Soonerpeace]

(12-25-2023, 05:40 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I was going to make a similar thread eventually, while posting our stats inside and outside of our division. I feel like the division has caught up to Zac and obviously other teams that play us less frequently and don't literally draft with "stopping the Bengals" in mind haven't yet.

Zac and staff need to adjust back. Otherwise, this division will go 6-0 against us every year.

(12-27-2023, 10:53 AM)WychesWarrior Wrote: It's almost like there's something different about this season vs the last two .....I can't quite put my finger on it, but yeah, there's definitely something different about this season vs the last two where we won the AFCN ....

I’ve thought that too but couldn’t put a finger on it. I think they were over confident. The team and coaches. Not in a cocky way but more just matter of fact “we’ve got this” But I’m not ready to go as far as Shake n Bake about the division. The Ravens have improved their roster better than us and Monken has helped a ton. Stefanski maybe has done the best job but they are all about the trenches. So looking at our games in the division the Browns first game is no indicator with Joe hobbled. The first Ravens game Joe was hobbled we barely lost. The second Raven’s game we took the lead when Joe got hurt 10-7. The second Steelers game was bad especially the defense. To me it’s all about the OL. We can’t run the freaking ball.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(12-27-2023, 12:13 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: I’ve thought that too but couldn’t put a finger on it. I think they were over confident. The team and coaches. Not in a cocky way but more just matter of fact “we’ve got this” But I’m not ready to go as far as Shake n Bake about the division. The Ravens have improved their roster better than us and Monken has helped a ton. Stefanski maybe has done the best job but they are all about the trenches. So looking at our games in the division the Browns first game is no indicator with Joe hobbled. The first Ravens game Joe was hobbled we barely lost. The second Raven’s game we took the lead when Joe got hurt 10-7. The second Steelers game was bad especially the defense. To me it’s all about the OL. We can’t run the freaking ball.

That's what I was referring to....but the run game is definitely a glaring issue.