Trey Hendrickson

[007BengalsFan]

Young wouldnt be a good replacement for Hendrickson but he would be a good replacement for Hubbard.

[SunsetBengal]

(01-21-2025, 09:49 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: Young wouldnt be a good replacement for Hendrickson but he would be a good replacement for Hubbard.

What makes you say that? Is Young coming to play for a bargain basement contract? Compare their stats over their careers. Young isn't better than Hubbard when Hubbard is healthy, and Hubbard still had more tackles playing injured.

[Essex Johnson]

(01-20-2025, 10:51 PM)CJD Wrote: IF the Bengals, by the end of this off season, don't extend Chase, extend Hendrickson and re-sign Higgins, this off season will be a failure. It almost doesn't matter what else they do. 3 of their 4 best players (with a big drop off after 4) are on the line this off season. You can't fix that with a draft or a free agency period.

Well we had all of them playing this season (well expect for the normal miss some games out of Higgins) and how did we do ?  My point is not these are top tier players, but these 3 players are not enough to win with, we need to invest in both lines still and that means spending $$ in FA, i don't see it very feasible we can give major contracts to all three and still spend large in FA.  Im prefer to extend Chase and Trey and move on or tag Higgins and invest more on the trenches.

[CJD]

(01-21-2025, 11:14 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: Well we had all of them playing this season (well expect for the normal miss some games out of Higgins) and how did we do ?  

We missed the playoffs by a single win (edited) after having a horrendous start where we lost multiple games by literally 1 play (and often 1 missed penalty). We were on fire and would have almost certainly won at least 1 if not multiple playoff games against an underwhelming wild card weekend slate in the AFC had we gotten in.

Imagine what we would have done without them.

Quote:My point is not these are top tier players, but these 3 players are not enough to win with, we need to invest in both lines still and that means spending $$ in FA, i don't see it very feasible we can give major contracts to all three and still spend large in FA.  Im prefer to extend Chase and Trey and move on or tag Higgins and invest more on the trenches.

I understand your point, but I think it's based on a fallacy that we cannot keep these three players AND invest in both of our lines. Joe Goodberry made a really good video where he goes over all the really easy things the Bengals can do to free up a lot of cash and cap space, re-sign all three players and still have about 90 million dollars in cap space for the 2025 team to use in free agency. You can watch it here. And it does not involve unrealistic or cheap contracts where millions of dollars are pushed into 4 void years the ways other teams create cap space at the expense of the future. And this is without restructuring Joe Burrow, which is also a lever they can pull if they want to.

Even if they front load the hell out of the contracts (or spend more than he projects entirely on the three of them) and we only end up with half that much at 45 million in cap space, that is still plenty of cap to go and get a few quality free agents. Then you have a good draft, and you're back in championship form for the next 3 to 4 years easy.

We can't fall for this team's lies. They have the money. They have the cap space. If they don't sign all three players, they will have failed the off season.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(01-22-2025, 12:36 AM)CJD Wrote: We missed the playoffs by a tiebreaker

We missed the playoffs by a W. We had 9, everyone who made the playoffs in the AFC had at least 10.

Another W and we would have only snuck in as the #7 seed because of a tie breaker.

[TecmoBengals]

The Bengals are in the Burrow-win now window so my thought is don't overthink and keep the best talent possible on the roster. That includes Trey as the best defensive player on the team.

[CJD]

(01-22-2025, 08:48 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: We missed the playoffs by a W. We had 9, everyone who made the playoffs in the AFC had at least 10.

Another W and we would have only snuck in as the #7 seed because of a tie breaker.

sorry, my mistake.

Doesn't change my point though. We missed by a hair.

[J24]

(01-21-2025, 09:57 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: What makes you say that? Is Young coming to play for a bargain basement contract? Compare their stats over their careers. Young isn't better than Hubbard when Hubbard is healthy, and Hubbard still had more tackles playing injured.

Young isn't A liability in the pass rush department( like Hubbard) and will be 26 years old to start the season vs Hubbard who will be 30 this off season.

[SunsetBengal]

(01-22-2025, 06:39 PM)J24 Wrote: Young isn't A liability in the pass rush department( like Hubbard) and will be 26 years old to start the season vs Hubbard who will be 30 this off season.

Young had 5.5 sacks this season, which is about what I would expect from a mostly healthy Sam Hubbard. As evidenced by his low tackle numbers, C. Young could however prove to be a liability in run defense.

[J24]

(01-22-2025, 06:42 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Young had 5.5 sacks this season, which is about what I would expect from a mostly healthy Sam Hubbard. As evidenced by his low tackle numbers, C. Young could however prove to be a liability in run defense.

He was 7th in pressures amongst Edge players(according to pff) and 10th overall. He was also 16th in QB hits and 15th in pressures according to pro football reference.

[SunsetBengal]

(01-22-2025, 07:04 PM)J24 Wrote: He was 7th in pressures amongst Edge players(according to pff) and 10th overall. He was also 16th in QB hits and 15th in pressures according to pro football reference.

That's great, but he's a one trick pony. We already have an edge rusher, one who actually gets to the QB and puts him on the ground. We don't need to add a liability in the run game, as if the rushing defense didn't already have enough problems.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-22-2025, 07:09 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: That's great, but he's a one trick pony. We already have an edge rusher, one who actually gets to the QB and puts him on the ground. We don't need to add a liability in the run game, as if the rushing defense didn't already have enough problems.

Really? I thought Chase Young was decent against the run, if not, we can do better for sure. I also like Hasaan Redick but I don't know 
how good he is against the run either. Might have to bring back Hubbard as a backup and to help stop the run if he still has something 
in him.

[SunsetBengal]

(01-22-2025, 07:32 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Really? I thought Chase Young was decent against the run, if not, we can do better for sure. I also like Hasaan Redick but I don't know 
how good he is against the run either. Might have to bring back Hubbard as a backup and to help stop the run if he still has something 
in him.

Yeah, that's kind of a misnomer. Chase Young had 31 total tackles this year, and a Pro Football Reference AV rating of 2, while an injury hobbled Sam Hubbard still recorded 41 tackles and had an AV rating of 6.

Note: I don't fully comprehend the AV rating, I just understand it to be an aggregate rating on total value to the team.

With all of that said, I'm not against cutting Hubbard and using the cap savings toward someone better, but Chase Young isn't that guy.

[wanga]

Keep him. And get him some help.

[J24]

(01-22-2025, 07:09 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: That's great, but he's a one trick pony. We already have an edge rusher, one who actually gets to the QB and puts him on the ground. We don't need to add a liability in the run game, as if the rushing defense didn't already have enough problems.

Sure but who are you going to sign for under 20 million per year that can give you an elite pressure and elite run defense? It sure as hell ain't Hubbard.

FYI I would keep Hubbard at a reduced number if that can be had.

[SunsetBengal]

(01-22-2025, 09:07 PM)J24 Wrote: Sure but who are you going to sign for under 20 million per year that can give you an elite pressure and elite run defense? It sure as hell ain't Hubbard.

FYI I would keep Hubbard at a reduced number if that can be had.

Other than Chase Young's rookie year, Hubbard has more sacks than Young. If Hubbard did have surgery and makes a full recovery, I'm betting that the team sticks with him and drafts another DE in case Myles Murphy is the bust I think he is.

[J24]

(01-22-2025, 09:12 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Other than Chase Young's rookie year, Hubbard has more sacks than Young. If Hubbard did have surgery and makes a full recovery, I'm betting that the team sticks with him and drafts another DE in case Myles Murphy is the bust I think he is.

Considering that Young missed a season in a half to injury; its not that surprising that Hubbard has more sacks.

[Clark W Griswold]

So what would Khalil Mack cost? Could play him as a 3rd down/rush specialist across from Trey. He’s 33 and only had 6 sacks last year but had 17 sacks the year before. Might still be productive playing mostly in passing situations.