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**ItsOdellThurman** · 03-02-2016, 03:52 PM

Basically, they stated that the team would not let both WR's and both S's leave. In short, Jones and Iloka were the preferential guys, but the Bengals will make a fair market value offer to both right before the FA window opens and if both decline, they will overpay market value to keep both Sanu and Nelson. With Sanu, this probably means something in the 4.5-5.5M/year range and with Nelson, this likely means a multi-year deal with a higher front-loaded bonus. It makes sense, but it's also thinking that could put you in a tough situation if other teams are aware of this.

They also mentioned that the Bengals allocate a certain amount of money for each position. This was perplexing to me, because shouldn't that be based on your talent? If you have 22M set aside for WR, but have two A.J. Green's, does that mean you don't pay anything but the minimum for other WR's?

**magikod** · 03-02-2016, 05:04 PM

Please sign Iloka! Thats all I care about.

***Bengal Dude*** · 03-02-2016, 05:36 PM

I know the beat guys have said that there's no way we lose both Jones and Iloka, but I won't be surprised if it happens. This is such a thin FA market and teams will overpay just to get some help.

**ItsOdellThurman** · 03-02-2016, 05:44 PM

They kind of hinted at that, as I said, that it would then increase what Cincinnati values Nelson and Sanu at. I'd bet that it's a good chance we lose both Iloka and Jones.

**phil413** · 03-02-2016, 06:23 PM

(03-02-2016, 03:52 PM)ItsOdellThurman Wrote: Basically, they stated that the team would not let both WR's and both S's leave. In short, Jones and Iloka were the preferential guys, but the Bengals will make a fair market value offer to both right before the FA window opens and if both decline, they will overpay market value to keep both Sanu and Nelson. With Sanu, this probably means something in the 4.5-5.5M/year range and with Nelson, this likely means a multi-year deal with a higher front-loaded bonus. It makes sense, but it's also thinking that could put you in a tough situation if other teams are aware of this.

They also mentioned that the Bengals allocate a certain amount of money for each position. This was perplexing to me, because shouldn't that be based on your talent? If you have 22M set aside for WR, but have two A.J. Green's, does that mean you don't pay anything but the minimum for other WR's?

I get Plan A, but I can't see Plan B as absolute. Say you do get Iloka long term but can't sign Marvin Jones. Rather than overpay Sanu to be a starter that still needs replaced, you really need to lock up Nelson since Pacman is still in limbo. This would fly in the face of allocating per position, but if you lose Pacman to say the Cowboys on day one then rather than overpay for a C+ corner to start, then why not have an A safety for stability in the secondary? Sign a cut vet like Cromartie or someone for a season and draft a CB high to develop. Williams will get plenty of reps still at safety, and heck even Iloka can move up to nickleback for a few snaps depending on the matchup to get your best talent out there if the CBs take a step back. It just makes more sense to make the right move for the group, and I'm not sure overpaying Sanu gives the team the stability it seems on paper.

**milksheikh** · 03-02-2016, 06:55 PM

Yet, people seemed to think we were going to be able to resign all our free agents easily..

**Yojimbo** · 03-02-2016, 06:55 PM

(03-02-2016, 05:04 PM)magikod Wrote: Please sign Iloka! Thats all I care about.

I'm fine with Iloka or Nelson. Williams is ready and Smith looks promising. We definitely need to sign a WR though, we can't go into next year with AJ, Alford, Wright and draft picks.

**Atomic Orange** · 03-02-2016, 07:04 PM

In a perfect world we wouldn't have to be worrying about CB because we have already used 2 #1 picks to fill the need. Hoping to keep the old guy (Pac) or wishing to have the other old guy back (Newman)is kinda sad. Hopefully these 2 will get it together soon.

As far as overpaying to keep Sanu. Please no. I'm fine with Nelson though!

**Aquapod770** · 03-02-2016, 07:49 PM

PASSSS. Let the Browns pay Sanu 5 million per year.

And I may be in the minority, but I'd rather keep Nelson over Iloka. He'll cost less and we draft his replacement (Karl Joseph).

**jowczarski** · 03-02-2016, 11:57 PM

It's not hard and fast like "$XX = WR position" ... but according to spotrac A.J. Green will be the highest paid receiver in the NFL at $15 million in 2016 (should Calvin Johnson indeed retire). When you have that true No. 1 making that kind of money, it limits the pool for everyone else just because there is a hard cap. You need impact players all over the field.

Right now, I'm hearing Jones could haul in around $7 million per. I'm starting to think that might go higher now that Jeffery is off the market. But let's just say he gets $7. How many teams would be paying $22 million to two wideouts in 2016? One. The Bengals. It just seems unlikely. Not saying impossible, but unlikely. More likely that Sanu returns for $4-6 per which puts them in line with other combinations of around $18-20 for top two wideouts on the spotrac 2016 contract tracker...and if you don't think $2 million matters - it does.

FYI: I'll have a deeper look at what the "real" number is for the Bengals as they hit free agency either up later tomorrow afternoon/evening or early Friday.

**spazz70** · 03-03-2016, 05:46 AM

(03-02-2016, 03:52 PM)ItsOdellThurman Wrote: They also mentioned that the Bengals allocate a certain amount of money for each position. This was perplexing to me, because shouldn't that be based on your talent? If you have 22M set aside for WR, but have two A.J. Green's, does that mean you don't pay anything but the minimum for other WR's?

They have done this several times in the past...Most recently they offered MJ a deal...He said no...They gave it to Dunlap...MJ left...They offered Joseph a deal...He said no...They gave it to Hall...Joseph left...It is typical of the Bengals to do this...They are not going to overpay in one position group and I do not blame them

**yellowxdiscipline** · 03-03-2016, 11:12 AM

Keeping Iloka and Jones would be the ideal situation.

**samhain** · 03-03-2016, 12:05 PM

(03-02-2016, 11:57 PM)jowczarski Wrote: It's not hard and fast like "$XX = WR position" ... but according to spotrac A.J. Green will be the highest paid receiver in the NFL at $15 million in 2016 (should Calvin Johnson indeed retire). When you have that true No. 1 making that kind of money, it limits the pool for everyone else just because there is a hard cap. You need impact players all over the field.

Right now, I'm hearing Jones could haul in around $7 million per. I'm starting to think that might go higher now that Jeffery is off the market. But let's just say he gets $7. How many teams would be paying $22 million to two wideouts in 2016? One. The Bengals. It just seems unlikely. Not saying impossible, but unlikely. More likely that Sanu returns for $4-6 per which puts them in line with other combinations of around $18-20 for top two wideouts on the spotrac 2016 contract tracker...and if you don't think $2 million matters - it does.

FYI: I'll have a deeper look at what the "real" number is for the Bengals as they hit free agency either up later tomorrow afternoon/evening or early Friday.

If your real number is a result of the Hobson math that we are accustomed to around here, you might be better off just skipping that piece and moving forward. Not sure we can take many more of those "disappearing cap room" write ups that take the team from the point of having a seemingly huge amount of cap to spend to crying poor before the first day of FA even arrives.

**samhain** · 03-03-2016, 12:09 PM

I fully believe that they'll overpay for Jones if it's not a totally insane number like 9 mil. They are fully aware of how difficult it is to find a number 2 wideout that fits their system. Going back down the post-TJ road is not something I see them wanting to do. They'll give him the money because they cultivated his skills, he's a familiar player in the system, and because he's good.

**Hoofhearted** · 03-03-2016, 12:19 PM

(03-02-2016, 06:55 PM)milksheikh Wrote: Yet, people seemed to think we were going to be able to resign all our free agents easily..

It's not that we CANT it's that it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to spend that much money for two position playes (Jones and AJ).

Iloka really is the only one I see them almost certainly getting done. Jones or Sanu and Reggie (Williams able to replace) are coin flips as I would understand the reason why they wouldn't do it.

**Hoofhearted** · 03-03-2016, 12:24 PM

There's a lot to be said about deciding against more money offered and most amount of money earned at the end of said contract...bengals hand down would be the best team to be willing to pay the full length of the contract, which is hard to say about alot of the other teams.

This has to be apart of the thought process, right?

**jowczarski** · 03-04-2016, 12:36 AM

SamHaim: Heh - you'll love my post.

Apparently Geoff writes this annually? Anyway, I had the cap broken down into categories by Joe Banner, former exec for the Eagles and Browns. You'll see I do have the same number, but I think in the end it'll be closer to $18/20 they're working with. But here's the thing - it's not just the Bengals, as Banner points out. It's every team. It just depends what teams do with it.
I'll get more into it on the other thread with some additional insight I just couldn't write because honestly, it'd be like 3,000 words...

**bengalhoel** · 03-04-2016, 01:18 PM

Sign Alex Mack!!! Please lets have a legit center again!!

**wolfkaosaun** · 03-05-2016, 04:33 PM

(03-04-2016, 12:36 AM)jowczarski Wrote: SamHaim: Heh - you'll love my post.

Apparently Geoff writes this annually? Anyway, I had the cap broken down into categories by Joe Banner, former exec for the Eagles and Browns. You'll see I do have the same number, but I think in the end it'll be closer to $18/20 they're working with. But here's the thing - it's not just the Bengals, as Banner points out. It's every team. It just depends what teams do with it.
I'll get more into it on the other thread with some additional insight I just couldn't write because honestly, it'd be like 3,000 words...

I am both intrigued and slightly afraid to see where this goes.

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