Lapham on WRs

[Bengalbug]

(03-10-2016, 06:54 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I understand exactly what your opinion is.  I just cited a couple of experts who said you were wrong.

I don't see how anyone can blame our playoff loss last year on a mistake in free agency.

Agreed.  That was dumb luck.  

Let's say the bengals draft a talented yet troubled WR (sound familiar?) wouldn't it be nice to have the Walter Payton man of the year on your team in boldin? Arguably one of the most respected people in the nfl?

[fredtoast]

(03-10-2016, 06:54 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: Also this isn't about being cheap, this is about overvaluing a comp pick and undervaluing veteran and more importantly their leadership. 

Except it is only your opinion that they over value the extra pick.  Extra draft picks do have value and help a team get better.  I don't know how people can deny this.

And it is also only speculation that they would pass on any player just to get a comp pick.  Just two days ago people were acting like it was a set-in-stone fact that the Bengals were not going to spend over $15 million in free agency. 

And finally, when you are only going to sign a mid to lower tier guy anyway I don't see a big difference between the guys who have played out contracts and the best of the guys who have been released.

[fredtoast]

(03-10-2016, 06:56 PM)Bengalbug Wrote: Let's say the bengals draft a talented yet troubled WR (sound familiar?) wouldn't it be nice to have the Walter Payton man of the year on your team in boldin? Arguably one of the most respected people in the nfl?

I am one of the people who predict we will sign a veteran free agent.

[tigerseye]

Just draft another stud TE and use a TE in the slot more often than a WR. Would help the running game. Then occasionally use Alford/Burkhead/Draft another small bullet and play them in the slot. Just a thought. I'm no expert. AD is at the point where his play is going to eleviate some of these problems.  AD is going to have a big year this year.

[THE Bigzoman]

(03-10-2016, 08:39 PM)tigerseye Wrote: Just draft another stud TE and use a TE in the slot more often than a WR. Would help the running game. Then occasionally use Alford/Burkhead/Draft another small bullet and play them in the slot. Just a thought. I'm no expert. AD is at the point where his play is going to eleviate some of these problems.  AD is going to have a big year this year.

Andy Dalton is going to regress to at least some degree.

People who think he's going to ascend into godhood with another OC and without weapons he's had for most of his career are going to be very disappointed.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-09-2016, 09:57 PM)coachmcneil71 Wrote: I feel ya on the entire post and agree. The only thing that I disagree with is considering this a weak WR draft class.(EDIT: I see you meant not many burners at the top of the WR class. I agree but I think we can find a guy to take the top off of the D perhaps Alford) It may be a little thin but there are several guys coming out that can create space and catch the ball at it's peak. In the NFL that is a good thing. No studs but some solid guys in the first 4-5 rds.
I honestly think that Kumerow  may show something.

Yeah, there are some speedy Recievers in this Draft. But i think most of them will go early and it might
not be a good idea for us to be desperate and go after one. That is mostly my argument for getting one
in FA or in a trade or something. I like Alford and Kumerow for the future actually, i really do.

Just heard that there is some talk about Jeremy Kerley re-uniting with Dalton here. Old TCU duo.

Would love it if this pans out. Wouldn't cost us a comp pick...

[fredtoast]

(03-10-2016, 08:47 PM)THE Bigzoman Wrote: Andy Dalton is going to regress to at least some degree.

People who think he's going to ascend into godhood with another OC and without weapons he's had for most of his career are going to be very disappointed.

Dalton has already switched OCs before and he just got better.

Jones has only been a main option for two seasons and Sanu for three.  Dalton has gone through a lot of WRs and just gotten better.

People predicting gloom and doom for the Bengals offense are the ones who are going to be disappointed.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(03-10-2016, 09:09 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Dalton has already switched OCs before and he just got better.

Jones has only been a main option for two seasons and Sanu for three.  Dalton has gone through a lot of WRs and just gotten better.

People predicting gloom and doom for the Bengals offense are the ones who are going to be disappointed.

I agree and it is way early to predict such. Especially after the way Dalton played last season and the fact
FA just started and the Draft is still a ways away. We still have a good O-line, Green, Eifert, Gio, Kroft, Tate,
Burkhead and some WR's that could show something in Alford, Kumerow and Wright.

Lots of options on the team already nevermind what is to come and maybe our run game might just get a
bit better this season. I am not betting Hill is a bust either.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

Man, this kills me.

Travis Benjamin: 4yr/$24m
Rishard Matthews: 3yr/$15m

Why couldn't the Bengals be in on that?

[NATI BENGALS]

(03-10-2016, 10:15 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Man, this kills me.

Travis Benjamin: 4yr/$24m
Rishard Matthews: 3yr/$15m

Why couldn't the Bengals be in on that?

Because giving Iloka money to outside free agents in an over paid weak WR free agent class is dumb. They played for losers and had inflated stats due to garbage time come back attempts. 

Yes we have work to do at WR. Getting involved in an over paid free agent class for some guys coming off of career years would have cost us one of the 3 defenders we have signed back. May not be the best WR draft class. But there are options better than these guys. 

Notice where the teams that signed them are picking in the draft...

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(03-10-2016, 11:30 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Because giving Iloka money to outside free agents in an over paid weak WR free agent class is dumb. They played for losers and had inflated stats due to garbage time come back attempts. 

Yes we have work to do at WR. Getting involved in an over paid free agent class for some guys coming off of career years would have cost us one of the 3 defenders we have signed back. May not be the best WR draft class. But there are options better than these guys. 

Notice where the teams that signed them are picking in the draft...

You mean like when the Bengals "matched" Jones' 5yr/$40m offer?


Also, why specify outside free agents as if they're some kind of plague? What is Cincinnati, Japan back in the Isolationist period? Because that worked REAL well for them, fighting with swords and arrows while the US had trains and gatling guns. Stagnating like that is maybe why the Bengals have the longest playoff win drought. I'm pretty sure outside free agents have helped the last three straight Super Bowl winners. A lot of those guys came off losers, didn't stop them from winning the big one.

[NATI BENGALS]

(03-10-2016, 10:15 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Man, this kills me.

Travis Benjamin: 4yr/$24m
Rishard Matthews: 3yr/$15m

Why couldn't the Bengals be in on that?

Because giving Iloka money to outside free agents in an over paid weak WR free agent class is dumb. They played for losers and had inflated stats due to garbage time come back attempts. 

Yes we have work to do at WR. Getting involved in an over paid free agent class for some guys coming off of career years would have cost us one of the 3 defenders we have signed back. May not be the best WR draft class. But there are options better than these guys. 

Notice where the teams that signed them are picking in the draft...

[fredtoast]

(03-10-2016, 10:15 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Man, this kills me.

Travis Benjamin: 4yr/$24m
Rishard Matthews: 3yr/$15m

Why couldn't the Bengals be in on that?

Because we are spending our money elsewhere.

[PDub80]

The Bengals have been perfect with how they've handled free agency. Absolutely.... PERFECT. I have murdered the FO in the past, and I still think they have a great car but a mediocre driver, but the last several years the FO has been outstanding. Truly a class above. The Bengals roster is setup to be very successful and have as good a shot as any team in the NFL for the next 5 years. In today's NFL that's the lion's share of an era.

- For last season, I gave the Bengals an overall F grade in terms of results. It was a season of ascending higher than the organization ever has only to crash and flame out harder than they ever have. But, that does not mean they stink. They just failed (in grand fashion) at achieving what they should have.

But the fact that late in the season they took the Superbowl champs into OT on the road on Monday night with a QB getting his 2nd start is outstanding and so encouraging for this group just now coming into their own. You want hope for a bright 2016 season? Point to that game and point to that roster.


The hard truth is that the Bengals have a Superbowl caliber roster already. It is as strong as possible and they have money allocated appropriately and to the right guys. Bringing in outside help makes sense for depth, but the starters they are resigning are the RIGHT ones and for the RIGHT money and length of deals.

- I'm sorry, but they made the right decision on M.Jones & Sanu. Well, sort of on M.Jones as it's rumored that HE turned down the Bengals, but that will be a blessing in disguise. I was a HUGE Marvin Jones guy from the day they drafted him. No question he was a 5th round gem and he ended up playing his way into a #1 role somewhere. Good for him and good for the Bengals to get that kind of production out of a 5th round contract! But a #1? It just wasn't going to be on the Bengals roster for him. Hell, he was barely a #3 option for the Bengals in terms of scheme and Sanu was the 4th or 5th look when you consider Gio and the other TE in the mix.

Thank about it.... THAT'S how much talent is there! The Bengals #3 is Detroit's #1. The Bengals #4/5 is Atlanta's #2. What super blows, to me, is that with such a loaded group and talent on the cheap, the head coach failed - yet again - to achieve anything greater than HIS previous best results.

- Time and time and time again the NFL has proven what? That great D beats great O. Period, point blank. The Bengals have a great D, which I think it's poised to only get better. The offense is excellent. Not great, but excellent and, I'm sorry, but a #3 or #4 receiving option is NOT what makes that offense go round.

-Draft a WR EARLY that can make a big, immediate impact on special teams. Let James Wright step in on the outside with Alford, Tate, the rookie, and maybe a vet. Because of Eifert and Green even Tate was able to make stuff happen against a really good Chiefs team.

I think a lot of guys can put up what Jones and Sanu did with Eifert and Green on the field.

[XenoMorph]

(03-09-2016, 08:53 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: According to him, don't look for any UFA to be signed. The only chance they'll get one in FA is if he's someone who's been released because they want the compensatory picks.

Which is pretty much exactly what I didn't want to hear, but almost exactly what I expected to hear after I they said that they budgeted $15m out of a possible $39m+ for free agency. I really don't understand what their hardon for comp picks are.

several good players can be grabbed with out messing with the comp picks m wallace probly tops that list though
(but would be a good replacement for jones if the price is right)

[StLucieBengal]

(03-10-2016, 10:15 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Man, this kills me.

Travis Benjamin: 4yr/$24m
Rishard Matthews: 3yr/$15m

Why couldn't the Bengals be in on that?

3rd or 4th round picks next year would be Better than both of those guys.

[tigerseye]

(03-10-2016, 08:47 PM)THE Bigzoman Wrote: Andy Dalton is going to regress to at least some degree.

People who think he's going to ascend into godhood with another OC and without weapons he's had for most of his career are going to be very disappointed.

WRONG

AD is going to prove the nay sayers wrong this year.

WHO DEY!!!!!

[NATI BENGALS]

(03-10-2016, 11:37 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: You mean like when the Bengals "matched" Jones' 5yr/$40m offer?


Also, why specify outside free agents as if they're some kind of plague? What is Cincinnati, Japan back in the Isolationist period? Because that worked REAL well for them, fighting with swords and arrows while the US had trains and gatling guns. Stagnating like that is maybe why the Bengals have the longest playoff win drought. I'm pretty sure outside free agents have helped the last three straight Super Bowl winners. A lot of those guys came off losers, didn't stop them from winning the big one.

We try to keep our own. Thats what we do. Thats what got us to 5 straight playoffs. And had us rolling with a good undeafted stretch. I will take consistent winning seasons over losing records and rebuilds every other year. It has produced solid results. We were inches away from getting over the hump. I dont think you break the mold after a 12-4 season that should have had a win against the SB champ and a playoff win with the backup QB. 

Its that simple. If we had no outside free agents on our team I would be with you. But the fact is we do have guys that were free agents playing on the team now. That we acquired to fill holes.

[Shake n Blake]

(03-11-2016, 10:12 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Because we are spending our money elsewhere.

"Our money" is fluid though. Hobs said they had $15 million to spend, but in reality it was closer to $28 million or more. Plus, guys like AJ Hawk are destined to be cut.

If the Bengals offered $8+ million per to MLJ, then why couldn't they offer $5 million per (on a short 3 year deal) to Rishard Matthews?

[XenoMorph]

(03-11-2016, 03:26 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: "Our money" is fluid though. Hobs said they had $15 million to spend, but in reality it was closer to $28 million or more. Plus, guys like AJ Hawk are destined to be cut.

If the Bengals offered $8+ million per to MLJ, then why couldn't they offer $5 million per (on a short 3 year deal) to Rishard Matthews?

i think a statement was aroudn 15 mil dedicated to retaining our own. we rolled over 7 mil or so from last season as well