Lets Face It, Losing Jones and Sanu Hurts

[kevin]

(03-11-2016, 09:01 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: It did hurt.

The good news is the vast majority of the fans knew that we were most likely losing both. There were a few holdouts who thought we could afford 8 million more at WR, or they thought Jones would take a massive pay cut to stay home.

But just looking at the free agent class of WRs told a lot of fans everything they needed to know. There was no way we were getting either back at a fair price. They got overpaid like crazy and I'm glad our front office didn't fall into the classic trap of overpaying now and suffering later (maybe by not having the money to re-sign Eifert next off season, for example.)

I wish we could have kept Jones, but not at 8 million per year. That probably would have meant we didn't re-sign Iloka this season or Eifert next season.

Overall, it was what was best for the team.

We agree that it hurts.......but I don't see an upside that a lot of fans saw this coming. That won't help this team on the field in games.  The only thing that will possibly help this team on the field in games is if they put top priority on bringing in 2 top WRs to fill what is now a weak area on this team.  Our QBs must have WRs on the roster to throw to.  Green and Eifert by themselves won't cut it.  Bengals must put everything into bringing in top WR weapons for our QBs to win ball games.  Team still has play-off talent across the board, except for the losses at WR, which must get full attention by the front office and coaches now to keep the goal at play-offs and Super Bowl.  

[fredtoast]

(03-11-2016, 12:09 AM)Aquapod770 Wrote: Fuller or Coleman in round 1 seems like a lock now.

I don't think so.

We are replacing a #2 WR not a #1.  I doubt we use a first roiund pick on a #2 WR.

[milksheikh]

(03-11-2016, 10:01 AM)fredtoast Wrote: I don't think so.

We are replacing a #2 WR not a #1.  I doubt we use a first roiund pick on a #2 WR.

Using a late first round pick on a #2 isn't a bad idea... Many teams do it indeed...

Such as Giants did with Odell (Knowing they had Cruz), Phillip Dorsett with Colts ( W/ T.Y. Hilton as the #1 ), etc.

Anyways, I doubt we can find our #2 in the 2nd round unless someone like Doctson or Fuller drops to us.

[Garrus]

(03-11-2016, 10:01 AM)fredtoast Wrote: I don't think so.

We are replacing a #2 WR not a #1.  I doubt we use a first roiund pick on a #2 WR.

Agreed, I actually think we will go CB in the first, then WR in the 2nd.

[Daddy-O]

(03-10-2016, 06:37 PM)fredtoast Wrote: This is what happens to really good teams.  They develop more good players than they can afford to keep.

It hurts to lose two WRs, but neither was our number one.  I don't see any way we use a first round pick on a #2 WR while we have Eifert.

We will sign a cheap free agent and probably draft 2 WRs, but we won't take one before the third round.  Possibly second round, but I am betting third or later.

Depends on how the Bengals feel about the WR talent at the time of their pick in RD1.  If they feel there is one guy they believe fits their mold and can produce immediately they may pull the trigger, otherwise like you I think they sign someone longer-in-the-tooth and develop mid to lower round picks.

We're not talking about needing a #1 WR.  I think we'll be fine as long as AJ an Eifert stay healthy.  Anybody they can add that forces at least some respect in coverage will satisfy the need.

There is only 1 football to go around per play, and we saw how a #2 WRs numbers (MLJs) numbers work within the current scheme.  Definitely not earth shattering.

[Bengalbug]

(03-11-2016, 10:01 AM)fredtoast Wrote: I don't think so.

We are replacing a #2 WR not a #1.  I doubt we use a first roiund pick on a #2 WR.

The bengals were willing to invest 40million over 5 years.  Why wouldn't they draft a wide receiver in the first round? 

The bengals drafted eifert in the first even though they had Gresham. They drafted two OL early in the draft even though they had starters. 

Using your logic "we are adding a #4 cb not a #1, I doubt we use a first round pick on a #4 cb)

[Bengalbug]

(03-11-2016, 10:11 AM)Garrus Wrote: Agreed, I actually think we will go CB in the first, then WR in the 2nd.

So a #4 cb is more important than a #2 WR?

[jj22]

I don't believe you can pass up on the talented defense in this draft for a 1st round wideout. There will be too many options at DT, CB, DE, and even a LB. Besides the front office just doesn't draft first round wideouts often (outside of Green). There are more Sanu's (slow can't separate) receivers in this draft then Jones. Hard to see any really worth a 1st round pick. Maybe 1. And he's likely to run a 4.75.

Just because we're desperate, we can't overvalue the receivers in this draft. And we certainly can't expect a rookie receiver to come in and make up for the catches and yards Jones/Sanu had. I don't think people are thinking clearly.

(03-11-2016, 10:39 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: So a #4 cb is more important than a #2 WR?

Yes, when the talent is there and not with a wideout. Dre is unknown to be back in 17, Dennard hasn't proven he can stay on the field for anyone to see if he's the future. If anything, (as great as Pacman has been the last couple years), giving a 33 year old 7m a year on a 3 year deal after drafting 2 first round corners in 3 years shows there is some issues there. Best player available. We can't be desperate and draft a wideout in the first in the weakest receiving class in a decade just because we're desperate. C'mon guys.

[Bengalbug]

(03-11-2016, 11:12 AM)jj22 Wrote: I don't believe you can pass up on the talented defense in this draft for a 1st round wideout. There will be too many options at DT, CB, DE, and even a LB. Besides the front office just doesn't draft first round wideouts often (outside of Green). There are more Sanu's (slow can't separate) receivers in this draft then Jones. Hard to see any really worth a 1st round pick. Maybe 1. And he's likely to run a 4.75.

Just because we're desperate, we can't overvalue the receivers in this draft. And we certainly can't expect a rookie receiver to come in and make up for the catches and yards Jones/Sanu had. I don't think people are thinking clearly.


Yes, when the talent is there and not with a wideout. Dre is unknown to be back in 17, Dennard hasn't proven he can stay on the field for anyone to see if he's the future. If anything, (as great as Pacman has been the last couple years), giving a 33 year old 7m a year on a 3 year deal after drafting 2 first round corners in 3 years shows there is some issues there. Best player available. We can't be desperate and draft a wideout in the first in the weakest receiving class in a decade just because we're desperate. C'mon guys.

I'm all for pba, but how can one argue that in general a #2 WR is such a small priority.  I agree that having green and eifert is a great combo and we are better off than a lot of teams.  But green doesn't necessarily take over in big games.  We need a viable #2.  

If there is a great talent when we draft , you take him. But you argue that cb is a weakness and question mark.  I'd be willing to bet as it stands our CB's would be able to contain our WR's handily.  

[Garrus]

(03-11-2016, 10:39 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: So a #4 cb is more important than a #2 WR?

No, I just know what positions the Bengals value. They would rather take a money position (CB) in the first, then use the 2nd to fill out their needs. I'm not saying I would agree, just saying that's what I think they are going to do. I mean they could take a WR in the first, they did try and resign MLJ hard it seems, so maybe they will value it come April.

[XenoMorph]

(03-10-2016, 10:14 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: We have to replace 98 catches 1210 yards and 4 TDs.

I dont think that is an insurmountable task. If we get 40-50 catches 600 yards and 2 TDs from a rookie we are half way there.

Krofts load gets heavier. Time to finally give Burkhead more than 3 touches a year. What is Uzi? Eifert could definitely improve his numbers aside from TDs. Gio and Hill on the field at the same time needs to happen. I wont be complaining if Gio is getting more catches.

The Pats had a really bad WR situation. And the panthers and the packers. Seattles WRs? The steelers lost mike wallace and emmanuel sanders and survived. KC was rolling with Maclin and not much else.

Having a stud WR and stud TE means a lot. It would have been nice to keep MLJ, definitely would have helped open the draft for us. But not the end of the world.

Also Hewitt has made some good catches in the passing game... maybe some 3 te sets are a coming.

[coachmcneil71]

(03-11-2016, 08:57 AM)kevin Wrote: The comments that these were 3rd round and 5th round WRs is silly, because where they were drafted doesn't matter.  Some 1st round picks in NFL history were lousy and huge busts and a Joe Montana not a top pick has a hand full of Super Bowl rings.  So just forget where they were drafted and accept that we just lost our # 2 and # 3 WRs, which is a huge loss.  The Bengals really tried to keep Jones and the Bengals did not want to lose both of them.....To talk about where they were drafted is silly.  What other teams paid them is not important, except it shows other teams could care less where they were drafted. .....What is important is that Bengals have lost their # 2 and # 3 WRs, and that's all that matters. Bengals can not just put RBs and FBs in there as some mentioned. Bengals must go out now and get some top WR talent to fill the void, because right now Bengals don't have enough WR talent to field a competitive team.  .......Green and Eifert give us a top WR and a top TE, but that is pee wee football formation stuff. We will need more than a WR and a TE.   These top WRs we just lost must be replaced in F/A or the draft with top talent, not cheap fill in talent. If they don't, NFL defenses will be all over Green and Eifert not letting them get open, and everybody will be wondering why Dalton is having such a bad season. This isn't rocket science and our needs at other positions now falls way behind our needs at WR.  Our QBs must have these WRs replaced with top talent for our QBs to win ball games.

Without going into all of this;yes,it is a set back losing Jones but let's also remember that other than the one double digit TD year he basically played up to two rds better than his draft position. Sanu played two rds less than his draft position with a serious case of the drops.
Jones could have stayed and chose to leave. The money was close enough. Me personally, I am a Bengals fan not a Lions fan. I'm excited for new blood. He gone! 

[grampahol]

WR's may be a bit thin in the draft, but that doesn't mean there aren't quality receivers out there. There are a lot of college players and a lot of colleges and they can't all be bums.. I'm not in the habit of following the careers of every college receiver out there,but the NFL have people whose jobs are to do just that so I'm not worried. Late round players become big stars every season and so do some undrafted players. Before drafting both Jones and Sanu I had never heard of either and I suspect few here did..
It's still early and someone is going to catch the ball from Andy this season.

[jj22]

(03-11-2016, 11:48 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: I'm all for pba, but how can one argue that in general a #2 WR is such a small priority.  I agree that having green and eifert is a great combo and we are better off than a lot of teams.  But green doesn't necessarily take over in big games.  We need a viable #2.  

If there is a great talent when we draft , you take him. But you argue that cb is a weakness and question mark.  I'd be willing to bet as it stands our CB's would be able to contain our WR's handily.  

We def need an outside receiver opposite AJ. I'm with you on that. It's just a bad draft to need an outside receiver (more possession slot receivers in this draft), so we shouldn't reach for one out of desperation. If that's the plan, then we've really blew it by losing both Jones/Sanu.

There wouldn't be such a sense of desperation if we could count on Hill and a run game, but 2015 was all Dalton and the receivers (including Eifert). Maybe our run game will bounce back and we can lean on the run until we develop some weapons. Sucks to lose the battle of the best and most talented offense in the division to the Steelers.

[Stormborn]

(03-11-2016, 10:01 AM)fredtoast Wrote: I don't think so.

We are replacing a #2 WR not a #1.  I doubt we use a first roiund pick on a #2 WR.

We don't really have a choice now do we?

Besides, what other position would they realistically go after? Corner? OT? We know they won't touch a front 7 man in the first for some reason, all other premium positions are filled, I'd say it's pretty likely we go WR in the 1st.

[fredtoast]

(03-11-2016, 12:44 PM)Stormborn Wrote: We know they won't touch a front 7 man in the first for some reason, 

Actually we don't know that at all.

I remember people saying the exact same thing about TE before Gresham and OG before Zeitler.

Plus we used a #1 pick on a LB in '08 and '05 under Marvin.

[Brandon00151]

Time for the Andy Haters to bring out their pitch forks and torches again!

[GreenCornBengal]

My dad pointed out that Gresham is available

[fredtoast]

(03-11-2016, 10:37 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: The bengals were willing to invest 40million over 5 years.  Why wouldn't they draft a wide receiver in the first round? 

That was for a WR that had worked in our system for years.  There have been a lot of other WRs who have signed cheaper contracts that the Bengals were not even interested.

But I 100% agree that what the Bengals end up spending in free agency on WR will be a good indication of what we are willing to do for a #2 WR.

(03-11-2016, 10:37 AM)Bengalbug Wrote: The bengals drafted eifert in the first even though they had Gresham. They drafted two OL early in the draft even though they had starters. 

Eifert replaced Gresham. Ogbuehi was drafted to replace Smith and/or Whit.

We are not looking for a guy to replace Green.  

[GreenCornBengal]

(03-11-2016, 01:55 PM)fredtoast Wrote: But I 100% agree that what the Bengals end up spending in free agency on WR will be a good indication of what we are willing to do for a #2 WR.

Lol you really are a Lawyer huh Fred.