Real reason why Hue left

[*Nately120*]

(04-10-2016, 11:29 AM)GodFather Wrote: Hue answered that question in an interview why he left. It was pretty clear:

"I wanted to know what it felt like to win a playoff game"

Well, he has a mere 13 years to win one and match or surpass ol' Marv.

[Benton]

(04-10-2016, 12:08 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote: Because of ownership and it's the "Factory of Sadness"?

Ya know...

I can still remember when the Bengals were that team.

Just sayin'...

Me too. And that's a valid point. On the other hand, mike had a plan in place. We didn't have a new QB every month or pick one early in every draft, we didn't completely turn over staff every two years.

[Beaker]

I am glad Hue Jackson is gone. I didnt care for him as our OC, and I certainly didnt want him as the Bengals HC.

[wolfkaosaun]

I heard a pretty similar thing when Zimmer left. Heard that they told Zimmer to wait "one more year and they'll see how Marvin does" before they could move him up. But it's obvious that the Bengals are giving someone too much time and allowing talent in house to leave.

I mean, it happens all the time. But we're still waiting for a "succession" for Marvin? We've had 3 guys move while Marvin delivers the same end product.

[*Nately120*]

(04-10-2016, 03:24 PM)Benton Wrote: Me too. And that's a valid point. On the other hand, mike had a plan in place. We didn't have a new QB every month or pick one early in every draft, we didn't completely turn over staff every two years.

Did Mike Brown have a plan in place when Marvin was hired?  Actually, prior to the Dalton/Palmer days with Marvin the Bengals were starting a slate of QBs that are somewhat comparable to what the Browns have been doing since they came back into the league.  We had a group of has-beens, our own draft busts, some late-round never-was guys, and an obvious mentor/bridge QB in Kitna.

The Bengals threw all sorts of QBs into the fray between Esiason going to the Jets and Palmer taking over when Mavin got here.  Was it as bad as the Browns?  Maybe not, but we had Klingler and Smith to their Weeden and Manziel, Kitna to their McCown, O'Donnell to their Delhomme, and so on and so forth.

[junglefever67]

Hue would not have been my choice for HC. M ike Brown hired Marvin to take this team to the Big Dannce, and that has'nt happened yet. My choice now would be John Gruden.

[Shake n Blake]

(04-10-2016, 03:24 PM)Benton Wrote: Me too. And that's a valid point. On the other hand, mike had a plan in place. We didn't have a new QB every month or pick one early in every draft, we didn't completely turn over staff every two years.

Idk. I remember going through quite a few starting QBs before Marv. From 1991-2001, we could've made one of those duct taped jerseys with these names:

Hollas
Wilhelm
Jay Schroeder
Klingler
Blake
Boomer
O'Donnell
Paul Justin
Akili 
Scott Mitchell
Frerotte
Kitna

All of them started at least a game in that time frame. We also drafted Donald Hollas, Klingler, John Walsh, Akili and Scott Covington during the 90's. 

Fwiw, we did go through 4 HC's between 1991-2000. Not far off from the Browns there, either.

[Bilbo Saggins]

I can see both sides of the coin on this one and don't fault either party for their actions.  Jackson was just coming off of a really good season as an OC.  His value seemed sky high after guiding an offense like that.  What would've happened had he stayed another year but the offense merely looked average?  How about two years of an average offense?  This could've happened and it could've been outside of Hue's control.  In a scenario like this, not only does Mike Brown not want to promote the guy, now it's pretty likely that nobody does and he gets labeled as a one year wonder.  

Hue saw an opportunity to cash in after helping the team put together a monster season on offense.  Mike Brown saw a HC candidate that he really liked, but wasn't 100% sold on as far as being the guy who could improve the team as a HC.  There are some guys who are amazing coordinators but wind up being just average HC's (Schwartz is the first one to come to mind).  At the end of the day I believe that both parties wanted it to work out but had to cover their butts just in case things didn't work out perfectly.  It happens.

[fredtoast]

Hue worked for the Bengals 7 of his last 12 years in the NFL.  He knows exactly how things work around here.  In fact he may know more than all of us fans.  I seriously doubt there was any promise or even hinting of a HC position for Hue here in the immediate future.

Same with Zimmer.  He may not have had a long history with the Bengals, but he was no rube.  He had 14 years of experience in the NFL when we hired him.  He knew that as long as he did a good job then Marvin would look good enough to keep his job.  

And I pretty much guarantee you that both Hue and Mike have a good relationship with the Bengals and are grateful for the chance they were given to shine with talented, stable rosters.

That is the way it seems to work in the NFL.

[kevin]

(04-09-2016, 11:58 PM)Football Bender Wrote: http://mweb.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/25548212/heres-why-hue-jackson-left-the-bengals-to-take-the-browns-job

Has anyone read this??  Marvin wanted to groom Hue for the HC job for the Bengals and give him the keys in two years.  Mike Brown couldn't guarantee it because that's too far down the road.  So Hue takes his stuff and heads over to the rival to prove a point??  Interesting and disappointing at the same time.

We lost Zimmer and Gruden and still made play-offs.....Good coaches get head coaching offers, that is football......Zimmer and Gruden turning things around in Minnesota and Washington.....Hue could turn things around in Cleveland......Good coaches get head coaching offers......The Miami Dolphins offensive coach is a great pick-up replacement. A good coach and Bengals offense stays tough.....

Marvin is pretty good and is light years above the insults of him.  Marvin took over the worst team in the NFL and has had them in the play-offs 7 out of 13 years, over 50 % of the time in play-offs for a franchise that from Paul Brown dying to Marvin hiring was in play-offs 0 % of the time, zero, a dozen years of futility.   Only 2 of the 13 years did the teams revert back to 4 win seasons.  11 of his 13 seasons here, the team has had competitive seasons around 7 or 8 wins or more to go play-offs over 50 % of the time.  Remember this was the worst team in the NFL, that isn't up for debate, so the first years needed much rebuilding.  The 6 play-off seasons in last 7 years shows Marvin turned this losing franchise around.  Most in NFL thought 2002 Bengals were unable to be fixed after being awful for 12 seasons. 

One more thing. I won't mind it if Bengals get away from Hue putting the tackles out with the WR.  I saw Houston Oilers do that back in late 60's and early 70's ....It didn't work then and I wasn't seeing these separated offensive line plays doing much for Bengals....Hue is gone and you can't run his playbook.  Let the coach from Miami do his thing, and let Cleveland run those separated O line formations because they won't work there either.  Hue is a good coach, but these formation plays need to go to with him.....Gruden loved the pass and Hue loved the run.  I hope this Dophins coach now here is a combo of pass and run. We have weapons in both areas. Certainly don't ask him to run Gruden or Hue playbooks, that never ever works.  Let him bring his Miami offensive playbook to Cincy and run his own scheme, that is what works, a coach running his plays, not trying to run the coaches that are gone. Let him run his own system because that is the only way it can work. 

[Benton]

(04-10-2016, 07:58 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Idk. I remember going through quite a few starting QBs before Marv. From 1991-2001, we could've made one of those duct taped jerseys with these names:

Hollas
Wilhelm
Jay Schroeder
Klingler
Blake
Boomer
O'Donnell
Paul Justin
Akili 
Scott Mitchell
Frerotte
Kitna

All of them started at least a game in that time frame. We also drafted Donald Hollas, Klingler, John Walsh, Akili and Scott Covington during the 90's. 

Fwiw, we did go through 4 HC's between 1991-2000. Not far off from the Browns there, either.

Eh, not seeing it.

The Browns have gone through 8 HC's in 16 years. They've had 24 QB's start more than a game in that time. 

We went through some growing pains while we tried to find a HC and a QB. For the most part, the Browns have just chucked things every other year.

[BonnieBengal]

Or maybe he left because a head coaching job now is better than a head coaching job that might happen in two years.

[kevin]

(04-10-2016, 09:02 PM)BonnieBengal Wrote: Or maybe he left because a head coaching job now is better than a head coaching job that might happen in two years.

Yes, a promotion and pay raise to another company today is better than the company  that doesn't want to lose you and the we hate to lose you speech of MAYBE better things to come years down the road.........of course in the real world, you have to consider the company and will this new one even be in business next week.....but in the NFL, the Browns will be around, so why not take the head coaching job. I really think all Browns need is to get the front office and head coach in order and quit changing at the top every year.  Go with a rebuilding plan and stick with it. After moving to Baltimore, the new Browns change owners, GMs, Head coaches and QBs way too much.   Cleveland needs to get it together at the top and then stick with the top people for at least the next 5 years to do the rebuilding into their system.  Constant change has left Cleveland with no system at all since back in the NFL.  There needs to be a system and some leadership.  Bengals fans complain of Mike Brown and family, but the consistent Bengals win much more than the ever changing no system Browns.  

[magikod]

Sounds like rubbish to me.

[*Nately120*]

(04-10-2016, 08:57 PM)Benton Wrote: Eh, not seeing it.

The Browns have gone through 8 HC's in 16 years. They've had 24 QB's start more than a game in that time. 

We went through some growing pains while we tried to find a HC and a QB. For the most part, the Browns have just chucked things every other year.

What are we really arguing over here?  Ok, so the Browns would hire and fire 4 different guys during a span where we'd let one moron who runs a steakhouse be our HC...does this make us smarter/better than the Browns or something?

[fredtoast]

(04-10-2016, 09:02 PM)BonnieBengal Wrote: Or maybe he left because a head coaching job now is better than a head coaching job that might happen in two years.

This


Things can change fast in the NFL.  If we suffer a couple of key injuries and our offense goes in the tank next year the shine would be off of Hue's star.

[kevin]

(04-10-2016, 09:21 PM)Nately120 Wrote: What are we really arguing over here?  Ok, so the Browns would hire and fire 4 different guys during a span where we'd let one moron who runs a steakhouse be our HC...does this make us smarter/better than the Browns or something?

The Bengals in 6 of the last 7 play-offs are indeed better, much better, a thousand times better than the last place ever changing Browns. ...If Browns are smart, they will give Hue 5 years to rebuild that awful no system franchise. They are constantly stupid up there expecting over night turnaround or else they will change again. You can never rebuild that way .......Maybe Cleveland and Art Moddell moving franchise and how messed up the new Cleveland team has been, maybe this is all grapes of wrath for the firing of the best coach and front office man they ever had, Paul Brown. 

[*Nately120*]

(04-10-2016, 09:29 PM)kevin Wrote: The Bengals in 6 of the last 7 play-offs are indeed better, much better, a thousand times better than the last place ever changing Browns. ...If Browns are smart, they will give Hue 5 years to rebuild that awful no system franchise. They are constantly stupid up there expecting over night turnaround or else they will change again. You can never rebuild that way.

We are talking about the Browns when Hue took the HC position versus the Bengals when Marvin took the HC position.  I realize I'm handsome, but it's absurd to think I actually think the Browns and the Bengals have had comparable amounts of success in the past 7 years.

[kevin]

(04-10-2016, 09:31 PM)Nately120 Wrote: We are talking about the Browns when Hue took the HC position versus the Bengals when Marvin took the HC position.  I realize I'm handsome, but it's absurd to think I actually think the Browns and the Bengals have had comparable amounts of success in the past 7 years.

In that case, the 2002 Bengals and the 2015 Browns are equal in being awful from the owner to the water boy.....The Browns needs to gets a plan ands a system and sticks wid' it.  Hue has as much chance fixing it as anybody, but it will take years of drafts to fix it. .....Putting a band aid on the 2002 Bengals would not have worked, and Cleveland needs to quit looking for band aids.  The rebuilding will take years to do it right. ......When Paul Brown started the Cincinnati Bengals, he told all the fans, " Don't expect a competitive team for at least 5 years ".....Certainly fans didn't like hearing that, but it did make sense, and at least we just got a football team.

[*Nately120*]

(04-10-2016, 09:37 PM)kevin Wrote: In that case, the 2002 Bengals and the 2015 Browns are equal in being awful from the owner to the water boy.....The Browns needs to gets a plan ands a system and sticks wid' it.  Hue has as much chance fixing it as anybody, but it will take years of drafts to fix it. .....Putting a band aid on the 2002 Bengals would not have worked, and Cleveland needs to quit looking for band aids.  The rebuilding will take years to do it right. 

I guess the point I was making is that the Browns might try 4 different HC's in the same time frame we let Dave Shula be our HC.  It seemed pretty clear off the bat that he had no business being a HC and I think in hindsight we rather wish he would have been fired after that first season.

I'm not even discussing Marvin or his merits in this thread, this is just about Hue taking a HC position now rather than waiting for Mavin to either retire for no real reason.  The only way I see Marvin getting fired is if the Bengals become super awful anyways, so he might as well take his job as a HC of a super awful team now.