The Bodine Witch Hunt

[Bengalholic]

I wish we could hear that conversation between Whit and Paul, that prompted Whit to tell him not to compare Bodine to Braham.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(04-30-2016, 09:54 PM)grampahol Wrote: Russell Bodine is only 23 years old so he started out as the starting center at 21

No, his rookie season was his age 22 season, not 21. His birthday is in June.

He will be 24 for the entire 2016 season.

Not saying he's not young or anything, but just needed to point that out. He wasn't 21 for his rookie season and he won't be 23 for this season.

[fredtoast]

(04-30-2016, 11:11 PM)BengalsRocker Wrote: If the truth is a "witchhunt"?   Then yeah...  we're all pretty much carrying the torches you F'n moron.

Center is a glaring problem on this team.

Just Google it Paul.  It's not that hard.

"Though he was essentially handed the starting job as a rookie, Bodine has done little to reward the Bengals for their patience with him in hopes he could become their franchise center. He's routinely been pushed around in the run game and was part of the reason why Cincinnati finished 2015 ranked 23rd in rushing yards per carry (3.9).



His pass-blocking has been serviceable, but mainly because the Bengals had utilized a quick passing game that makes it hard for defenses to get pressure up the middle.



Bodine finished his rookie season as one of the worst-rated centers and didn't improve much in Year 2. In fact, Pro Football Focus ranked Bodine as their 30th-best center out of 39 eligible players. His 42.4 grade puts him in PFF's 'replaceable' tier of players, the worst of five tiers PFF has.



If you look at that list, most of the names down in Bodine's range are guys like Cody Wallace, Trevor Robinson, Joe Looney and Jamil Douglas, guys who were either backup centers or guards moved to center because of injuries.



That's not exactly good company for Bodine to be in, especially when you're talking about a Bengals team that's been painfully close to being a Super Bowl contender. It stings to think how good the Bengals' offensive line would have been this past season had they gotten just average play at center."

Link please.

--PFF rankings are a joke.  Here is how they work.  Player A plays 70% of the snaps and messes up once every ten plays.  Player B plays fewer snaps (50%) and messes up more often (once every 8 plays).  Guess which player will be rated higher by PFF.  Player B who played both fewer snaps and messed up more often will be ranked higher than player A.  So that means Bodien could be ranked behind a guy who played less and messed up more often.  their rankings are total garbage.  In fact when you look at the PFF lists you will often see bad players near the top and good players ner the bottom.

--How is Bodine to blame for the problems the Bengals rush game had in 2015, but gets no credit for the run game in '14 when we ranked 12th in the league in yards per carry?

--Pass protection is good.  Lots of teams use quick passing game just like the Bengals, and in fact the Bengals throw more deep passes than most other teams which requires long pass protection.  Bengals were 4th in the league in pass plays of greater than 20 yards (63) and 5th in pass plays greater than 40 yards (13).  The claim that we throw nothing but quick short passes is a complete myth.

[NATI BENGALS]

(04-30-2016, 11:23 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: I have no problem with Alexander supporting one of his players. That's expected from a position coach. What I do have an issue with is the way he went about it. He came off like a petulant child throwing a temper tantrum. Also, while 'defending' Bodine from criticism...he had no problem saying Z didn't start "all that great". Then he had to throw out what Whit said (I agree with Whit BTW). 

Paul, if you're going to defend your guy, then fine...but don't act like an assclown while you're doing it and no need to bring your other players into it.

What I do have a problem with is apparently we are still picking offensive linemen on how hard they shake our 50 something+ year old offensive line coach's hand and whether he thinks they will beat his ass.

Intimidate the piano man and you get picked by the Bengals....

He wants tough guys but comes across as a soft spoken fatso cupcake. Nothing about the man exudes toughness.

21 seasons as the offensive line coach. The one thing connecting us to our old losing ways other than the ownership.

There are pros and cons. He has a couple success stories. And failures. Complacency kills was a saying we had in the USMC.

There is nothing the softbatch chubosko piano man could say that would fire me up enough to go fight James Harrison or Terrell Suggs or Cameron Heyward. When his fire up speech is him sitting back talking about how he played a mean song on the piano one time while eating a Twinkie. I'm mentally checking out.
 

[fredtoast]

(05-01-2016, 12:44 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: There is nothing the softbatch chubosko piano man could say that would fire me up enough to go fight James Harrison or Terrell Suggs or Cameron Heyward. When his fire up speech is him sitting back talking about how he played a mean song on the piano one time while eating a Twinkie. I'm mentally checking out.
 

Grown men don't need other grown men squealing at the to get them motivated.

[coachmcneil71]

(04-30-2016, 07:44 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Although I respect PA's opinion on players, i would also question his comparing Bodine to Braham.

Quit hedging there Mr.Bayless. Can't have it both ways. He's either good or he isn't. He's had more than ample talent drafted for his o-line since he has been here. Yet this team hasn't had a decent center since Braham retired.

Bodine is ok in run blocking but his pp is not good at all. I watched him let Andy get crushed in a game this past season as he just watched the defender run right past him. Then he wanted to look around like it was someone else's fault.

He should have answered the question just as Nate said he should have.

[coachmcneil71]

(04-30-2016, 07:40 PM)fredtoast Wrote: There is always an ignorant portion of the fan base who insist they know more than our coaches.

justin Smith was a bust who would not even start on another NFL team.

Leon Hall wass too slow to play CB.

Whitworth could not handle speed rushers and needed to be moved to guard.

And so on and so on.

Bodine has not been a great player, but he is not a bad as some people here claim.  I'll trust PAs opinion over any one else's here.

So which is it? Is he good or does he owe our a future HOF tackle an apology?

[fredtoast]

(05-01-2016, 12:44 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: There are pros and cons. He has a couple success stories. And failures. 

Actually he has had zero high picks fail.  The only one that is close is Andre Smith and even he was a starter for many years and was among the best RTs in the league for a couple of years.

[fredtoast]

(05-01-2016, 12:59 AM)coachmcneil71 Wrote: So which is it? Is he good or does he owe our a future HOF tackle an apology?

He is better than Braham was at the same point in his career.

So no apology for Whit.

[fredtoast]

(05-01-2016, 12:58 AM)coachmcneil71 Wrote:  Yet this team hasn't had a decent center since Braham retired.

Cook was a good center before he got injured in '12.

[Stormborn]

(04-30-2016, 11:23 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: I have no problem with Alexander supporting one of his players. That's expected from a position coach. What I do have an issue with is the way he went about it. He came off like a petulant child throwing a temper tantrum. Also, while 'defending' Bodine from criticism...he had no problem saying Z didn't start "all that great". Then he had to throw out what Whit said (I agree with Whit BTW). 

Paul, if you're going to defend your guy, then fine...but don't act like an assclown while you're doing it and no need to bring your other players into it.

Can't say it better than this. This is their self made mess, drafting a late round backup in the 4th to start with no competition, and surprisingly have that player be the obvious weakness on the entire offense. They have to live with it and make it better. This did nothing but make him look bad when it could've been averted.

[coachmcneil71]

(05-01-2016, 01:02 AM)fredtoast Wrote: He is better than Braham was at the same point in his career.

So no apology for Whit.

Apples and oranges Fred. One had to play as a rookie out of necessity, while the other didn't have to step in immediately.

The word "better" is pretty ambiguous in that statement. I like some of what Bodine brings to the table so I'm not bashing the guy but he needs some drastic improvement in PP.

[coachmcneil71]

(04-30-2016, 08:37 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: AKA the magazine nobody really cares about anymore until it's time for women to be in bikinis and paint.

 The most articulate words I heard in chat during today's draft....Billings! & Boobs!!!! 

[NATI BENGALS]

(05-01-2016, 12:57 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Grown men don't need other grown men squealing at the to get them motivated.

Everybody in the NFL knows how to play football. There is a reason coaches get promoted and are highly respected. Bellicheat blows at drafting. He gets his guys prepared and motivated to play. Pete Carrol is one of the best motivators in the business. And has had some of the best teams lately. Zimmer will motivate the shit out of guys. San Fran fell off a cliff when they lost their motivator coach.

Grown men not motivated will get the hell beat out of the by grown men who are properly motivated.

These guys have millions of dollars in their bank accounts. Without proper coaching and motivation you have the 90s Bengals. (Cough.. Paul Alexander was there cough..)

[fredtoast]

(05-01-2016, 01:26 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Everybody in the NFL knows how to play football. There is a reason coaches get promoted and are highly respected. Bellicheat blows at drafting. He gets his guys prepared and motivated to play. Pete Carrol is one of the best motivators in the business. And has had some of the best teams lately. Zimmer will motivate the shit out of guys. San Fran fell off a cliff when they lost their motivator coach.

Grown men not motivated will get the hell beat out of the by grown men who are properly motivated.

These guys have millions of dollars in their bank accounts. Without proper coaching and motivation you have the 90s Bengals. (Cough.. Paul Alexander was there cough..)

Like I said before grown men don't need another grown man squealing at them to motivate them. 

You mention Belichick.  When was the last time you heard him squealing at players?

[NATI BENGALS]

(05-01-2016, 01:31 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Like I said before grown men don't need another grown man squealing at them to motivate them. 

You mention Belichick.  When was the last time you heard him squealing at players?

Do you think he talks to his team like he does the media?

[NATI BENGALS]

(05-01-2016, 01:31 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Like I said before grown men don't need another grown man squealing at them to motivate them. 

You mention Belichick.  When was the last time you heard him squealing at players?

You are seriously mistaken if you think motivation has nothing to do with it.

Sure guys get motivated for different reasons. But a good coach finds ways to do it.

One of the reasons Marvin likes guys on one year contracts. Because money is a big time motivator.

But a fat dude with piano stories is not a good motivator.

[fredtoast]

(05-01-2016, 01:34 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Do you think he talks to his team like he does the media?

Do you think squealing at grown men is the best way to motivate them?  Tony Dungy is one of the best coaches in NFL history and he did not squeal at players to motivate them.

But it is not even the position coaches job to give pre-game speeches.

This entire discussion shows how stupid discussions can get among fans.


"Do you judge a position coach based on the success he has at his job?"


"No.  I judge them based on how they look and how loud I think they yell at their players.  And if they play a musical instrument I make fun of them for that."

[fredtoast]

(05-01-2016, 01:37 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: But a fat dude with piano stories is not a good motivator.

How can you tell?

This is one of the dumbest arguments i have ever had around here.

What does a great motivational coach look like?  Since you have never ever seen PA work with his players that is all you have to work with.  So how do you judge a coaches motivational skills based on appearances?

[NATI BENGALS]

(05-01-2016, 01:46 AM)fredtoast Wrote: How can you tell?

This is one of the dumbest arguments i have ever had around here.

What does a great motivational coach look like?  Since you have never ever seen PA work with his players that is all you have to work with.  So how do you judge a coaches motivational skills based on appearances?

21 years. How many Pro bowlers has he produced? Or all pros.

How many guys have you ever heard say how fired up Paul Alexander gets them? Or how pumped they are to play for coach.

Guys are fired up to play for Paulie G. They were fired up to play for Zimmer. Fired up to play for Hue Jackson. Hell bland old marvin fires guys up.

You are right. I am by far not an expert on the topic. But from my couch. Paul is a junk ass motivator. And the handshake and will he beat my ass eye test isn't good enough prospect evaluation for me.