Rank our Backup QB

[tlotharw]

(05-29-2016, 05:26 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: The whole team other than a couple of people are terrible in the playoffs when Dalton played. DL - played like shit, secondary - played like shit, LBs - played like shit, OL - played like shit, WR core - played like shit, TEs - played like shit, RBs - played like shit, everyone played like shit.

Did Dalton play like shit?

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-29-2016, 10:28 PM)tlotharw Wrote: Did Dalton play like shit?

Yes, yes he did.

[Brownshoe]

(05-29-2016, 10:28 PM)tlotharw Wrote: Did Dalton play like shit?

Is Dalton not a part of everyone? Plus it's not hard for anyone to play like shit if everyone else around you is too.

[Savagehenry54]

(05-29-2016, 11:20 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: 1. Yeah, Campbell did play for the Browns, a year before he didn't play for us. He wasn't exactly good there, but who is?

2. An opportunity as a backup is the "opportunities" you were referring to? He was already a backup so I'm not sure how this proves that other teams were impressed by Fitzy's awful season with the Bengals. The opportunities he's been getting (as a starter) with the Texans and Jets are thanks to his good seasons with the Bills. He did get a bigger contract with the Bills, but not until after he proved himself as a starter - with the Bills.

3. I was talking about Reggie Kelly. Not Kelly Washington, who was long gone by that point. He also had Housh, Chad, Chris Henry, Utecht, and Caldwell. He had Benson at RB. More than enough to work with, IMO.

4. So I guess you thought Russell Wilson had a clutch performance in the 2014 NFC championship? Dude completed less than half his passes, threw 4 INTs and took 5 sacks. But he did throw the game winner in OT. IMO, that was a miserable choke job of a performance in a playoff game. 

Sure, the last play was clutch, but the overall performance was the opposite of clutch. Had Wilson not been so completely awful all game, the Seahawks would've won by 20+. But I'm supposed to believe that just because he pulled himself together for a play or 2, that his performance was somehow "clutch"? Same deal with McCarron. We would've smoked the Steelers had he even played average all game. 

Our defense was clutch. Kept our inept offense in the game the whole way through. Forced turnovers, sacks and 3 and outs all game. Kept giving the offense ample opportunities and good field position. AJ leading the offense to 16 points and countless stalled drives while coughing up multiple turnovers wasn't clutch by my definition. 

I don't care if he had a couple good drives (that were greatly aided by field position and Jeremy Hill). Had he not wet the bed so much for 3+ quarters, we would've won this one easily. He's as much to blame as anyone for us not having a playoff win. I give him some slack for it being his 5th start, but it doesn't make it any less true.

Utrecht and Caldwell? There you go running off a list of names like it's something even when it's not. Chad was spiraling by then too. House was decent but overrated and a product of Carson and Chad's greatness when he was productive.

[wolfkaosaun]

(05-30-2016, 03:58 PM)Savagehenry54 Wrote: Utrecht and Caldwell?  There you go running off a list of names like it's something even when it's not.  Chad was spiraling by then too.  House was decent but overrated and a product of Carson and Chad's greatness when he was productive.

Housh was decent? He posted 4 straight seasons with over 900 yards. 5 straight seasons if you include the year with Fitzpatrick. 6 straight years even once he left Cincinnati for Seattle, where he obviously didn't play with Chad or Carson. And even much of 2008 he didn't play with Chad and Carson.

Chad went 6 straight seasons with over 1,100 yards. 5 straight seasons with over 1,200 yards. And after 2008 Chad still posted a season on 1,000 yards and caught 9 TDs. 2nd most in his career (also did it in 04 and 05).

While Chirs Henry was a troubled past, he still did well when he played. 21 receiving TDs in 55 games as a #3 WR is pretty good.

Benson was pretty mediocre his first year here, but when you have Fitzpatrick throwing the ball why not stuff the box with 8? But 2009 was obviously Benson's best year.

So yes, there were options out there for Fitzpatrick and talent around him. Was it older talent that was no longer in their prime? Yes. Did players from that team produce in 2009? Absolutely. Chad had a good year despite lacking receiving weapons in 09. Housh continued to be what he was here, a reliable WR who will get you yards and tough 1st downs. Benson had his best year. Henry only played in 8 games in 2009, but still had 2 TDs and 236 yards. Averaged 23.6 YPC.

[Vanilla Heat]

McCarron is a decent backup. He's not he answer as a starter, and no team who needs a starting QB would have interest in him as anything more than a stopgap.

[Savagehenry54]

(05-30-2016, 04:21 PM)wolfkaosaun Wrote: Housh was decent? He posted 4 straight seasons with over 900 yards. 5 straight seasons if you include the year with Fitzpatrick. 6 straight years even once he left Cincinnati for Seattle, where he obviously didn't play with Chad or Carson. And even much of 2008 he didn't play with Chad and Carson.

Chad went 6 straight seasons with over 1,100 yards. 5 straight seasons with over 1,200 yards. And after 2008 Chad still posted a season on 1,000 yards and caught 9 TDs. 2nd most in his career (also did it in 04 and 05).

While Chirs Henry was a troubled past, he still did well when he played. 21 receiving TDs in 55 games as a #3 WR is pretty good.

Benson was pretty mediocre his first year here, but when you have Fitzpatrick throwing the ball why not stuff the box with 8? But 2009 was obviously Benson's best year.

So yes, there were options out there for Fitzpatrick and talent around him. Was it older talent that was no longer in their prime? Yes. Did players from that team produce in 2009? Absolutely. Chad had a good year despite lacking receiving weapons in 09. Housh continued to be what he was here, a reliable WR who will get you yards and tough 1st downs. Benson had his best year. Henry only played in 8 games in 2009, but still had 2 TDs and 236 yards. Averaged 23.6 YPC.

So for one year after Seattle picked him up in fa, he did okay. And then nothing.

:)

You type so much to support nothing of substance.

[Shake n Blake]

(05-30-2016, 06:35 PM)Savagehenry54 Wrote: So for one year after Seattle picked him up in fa, he did okay.  And then nothing.

:)

You type so much to support nothing of substance.

Housh was old by then. He (like so many other players) had to fall off at some point.

Keep in mind that Seattle cut him right before the season where he "fell off". He had zero time to learn Baltimore's playbook.

Seattle screwed him, tbh. Still, it's not like he had much time left. By that point he was 33 or so.

[wolfkaosaun]

(05-30-2016, 06:35 PM)Savagehenry54 Wrote: So for one year after Seattle picked him up in fa, he did okay.  And then nothing.

:)

You type so much to support nothing of substance.

I'm supporting that Housh was not just a product of "Carson and CHad" by pointing out he STILL had over 900 even while not playing with both players.

And still showed support that Fitz had a lot of weapons to work with in 08. By showing what they did before he played with them and even after.

You're just turning a blind eye to facts. You don't have over 900 yards for 6 straight seasons by being just a "product". I mean, even in 2004 Carson wasn't all that great and even Kitna played in games, yet Housh still produced.

Please go ahead and show me how I was wrong with bringing up 09 stats of those players that were on the team in 08. They all pretty much stayed constant with how they always played, and some improved (IE: Benson).

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(05-30-2016, 06:35 PM)Savagehenry54 Wrote: So for one year after Seattle picked him up in fa, he did okay.  And then nothing.

:)

You type so much to support nothing of substance.

Housh was not a #1 WR no matter how much he tried to talk himself into one.

Doesn't mean he wasn't a GREAT #2 WR while he was here. Dude was clutch, unlike Chad Johnson.

[BengalFanInNJ]

He's no T.J. Yates.

[Shake n Blake]

(05-31-2016, 10:25 AM)BengalFanInNJ Wrote: He's no T.J. Yates.

Actually TJ Yates is a very interesting comparison. Both were 5th round picks. Like McCarron, Yates' first NFL starts came in place of an injured starter (Schaub) late in the season. He led a really good team to a couple more wins down the stretch. Then he won a playoff game - the Texans first playoff win in team history.

The only differences were...

1. Yates actually beat 2 playoff teams in the regular season (Falcons and Bengals) instead of bad teams like McCarron beat (49ers and Ravens).
2. Yates actually played well and won in the playoffs, unlike McCarron.
3. Texans fans weren't talking like they had the next Tom Brady sitting on their bench.

[*Nately120*]

(05-31-2016, 12:59 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Actually TJ Yates is a very interesting comparison. Both were 5th round picks. Like McCarron, Yates' first NFL starts came in place of an injured starter (Schaub) late in the season. He led a really good team to a couple more wins down the stretch. Then he won a playoff game - the Texans first playoff win in team history.

The only differences were...

1. Yates actually beat 2 playoff teams in the regular season (Falcons and Bengals) instead of bad teams like McCarron beat (49ers and Ravens).
2. Yates actually played well and won in the playoffs, unlike McCarron.
3. Texans fans weren't talking like they had the next Tom Brady sitting on their bench.

This is the nature of the game...for some reason people just LOVE to dream QBs with empty resumes are going to be SUPER.  And it only seems to apply to QBs...no one ever seems to say:

- We need to see what a HC with no NFL experience can do
- I'd rather take my car to a mechanic who's never worked on a car before rather than a boring old industry veteran
- My dentist might be the Tom Brady of dentists because he graduated really low in his class
- I already KNOW what I have in my middle-aged wife...maybe I should bench her for a young prospect and see what happens

Ok, well the last one seems to hold some appeal.

[Shake n Blake]

(05-31-2016, 01:57 PM)Nately120 Wrote: This is the nature of the game...for some reason people just LOVE to dream QBs with empty resumes are going to be SUPER.  And it only seems to apply to QBs...no one ever seems to say:

- We need to see what a HC with no NFL experience can do
- I'd rather take my car to a mechanic who's never worked on a car before rather than a boring old industry veteran
- My dentist might be the Tom Brady of dentists because he graduated really low in his class
- I already KNOW what I have in my middle-aged wife...maybe I should bench her for a young prospect and see what happens

Ok, well the last one seems to hold some appeal.

Well you never know if that late round prospect may turn out to be the next Brooklyn Decker. 

Even though the previous 400 late round prospects looked more like Rosie O'Donnell.

[*Nately120*]

(05-31-2016, 02:25 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Well you never know if that late round prospect may turn out to be the next Brooklyn Decker. 

Even though the previous 400 late round prospects looked more like Rosie O'Donnell.

The draft is next to meaningless since any QB in the top 200 can be the next Brady (Tony Romo went undrafted, but he seems to have the reputation as a gigantic loser for some reason) and HOF QBs can be found in the CFL or grocery stores thanks to Moon and Werner.

It also depends on the source of QB perception. I have a buddy who is 33 and has been a Packers fan his whole life and he simply can't fathom how NFL teams don't just have 2 HOF QBs for the span of 30 years. He seriously said the Bears should drop Cutler and trade for Matt Flynn (when Flynn was on the bench in Seattle) because, I would assume, it seemed only natural that any Packers QB that exists is a franchise-chaning godsend.

Must be nice!