Are we SURE that Antonio Brown is better than AJ Green?

[XenoMorph]

(09-12-2016, 12:02 PM)PlayerFormerlyKnownAsMousecop Wrote: I'm honestly not too sure about that.

Green's style simply seems more dominant when he's on his game. 

Brown has better numbers, but he tends to get more targets so that is a wash. When it comes to game winning plays and taking over games and just being unstoppable overall, I'm not sure you can say AB is even that much better. You're right though, it's definitely close.

if we could just have both these guys on the same team.   oh we could have =(


both are great talents and guys you want on your team. Both can dominate in a given situation. will one outproform the other on sunday sure but a lot of that is dictated by what the team needs. IF Team B is down early they will probly throw more passes to their star.. .etc.

I think a lot of browns (and Wallace before him) success comes from Bens ability to extend plays to gain them enough time to get open.... no one can cover forever.

Dalton and greens relationship is a bit different. But that's the style the teams run. So would brown and AJ be as successful if they switched places right now. Probly but I think the steelers might get the better end of that deal overall.

[Rattler]

No way would I choose Brown over Green.

5' 10" 180lbs vs. 6' 4" 210 lbs

[Rhinocero23]

(09-12-2016, 11:53 AM)PlayerFormerlyKnownAsMousecop Wrote: Title.

No not for certain 

[IMightBeRight]

Green is the color of money, Brown is the color of shit, enough said.

[*rfaulk34*]

(09-12-2016, 12:02 PM)PlayerFormerlyKnownAsMousecop Wrote: Brown has better numbers, but he tends to get more targets so that is a wash. 

If Green were targeted the same amount of times that Brown was last year, with his current catch and td %, here is what his numbers would look like.

127 catches
1,918 yards
15 TDs

A few less catches due to Brown having a higher catch %, but more yards and more TDs for Green. 

Verdict...

AJ Green is better than that turd in Pittsburgh.

[Nicomo Cosca]

(09-13-2016, 10:16 PM)IMightBeRight Wrote: Green is the color of money, Brown is the color of shit, enough said.

 /thread 

[Brownshoe]

I would still have to say that Brown is better just because he's much more clutch than Green. Green sometimes folds under pressure (Texans fumble, missed TD catch to win a playoff game, fumble vs the Steelers when we were having a game winning drive, fumble vs the Patriots when we were starting to come back, ect, ect). Green doesn't fold under pressure a lot, but it's more than Brown. Plus Brown is better after the catch. Green is better at making acrobatic/crazy catches.

[*jason*]

(09-13-2016, 11:20 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: I would still have to say that Brown is better just because he's much more clutch than Green. Green sometimes folds under pressure (Texans fumble, missed TD catch to win a playoff game, fumble vs the Steelers when we were having a game winning drive, fumble vs the Patriots when we were starting to come back, ect, ect). Green doesn't fold under pressure a lot, but it's more than Brown. Plus Brown is better after the catch. Green is better at making acrobatic/crazy catches.

I don't know. I saw Antonio Brown fold at the end of the last game these two played... If ya know what I mean.

[Rhinocero23]

(09-13-2016, 10:16 PM)IMightBeRight Wrote: Green is the color of money, Brown is the color of shit, enough said.

Lol!
That was great!

[Rhinocero23]

(09-13-2016, 11:20 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: I would still have to say that Brown is better just because he's much more clutch than Green. Green sometimes folds under pressure (Texans fumble, missed TD catch to win a playoff game, fumble vs the Steelers when we were having a game winning drive, fumble vs the Patriots when we were starting to come back, ect, ect). Green doesn't fold under pressure a lot, but it's more than Brown. Plus Brown is better after the catch. Green is better at making acrobatic/crazy catches.

Brown has an advantage over Green
Ben > Andy...by a bunch.

[Brownshoe]

(09-14-2016, 07:39 AM)Rhinocero23 Wrote: Brown has an advantage over Green
Ben > Andy...by a bunch.

Maybe the first couple of years Dalton was in the league, but not anymore. 

[Nicomo Cosca]

Idk about "by a bunch." Dalton was having an MVP type season last year before his injury, and he's off to a great start after 1 game.

[Rhinocero23]

(09-14-2016, 07:52 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: Maybe the first couple of years Dalton was in the league, but not anymore. 

Dalton is good...last year very good. As much as I hate Ben, he is elite...that means in the top 5. Dalton is not there and probably never will be. Ben can make all the throws Dalton can make 90% of all the throws. I know you will want to disagree with this but given you are a great film researcher (you often support your stance with clips) show me one time Andy has put a ball in the air greater than 60 yards...if he has it needs to have height too.

Ben has several examples of balls traveling 75-80 yards is the air with a huge parabola. That gives a speedy wideout a huge advantage. It opens up an additional 25% of the field.

[XenoMorph]

(09-14-2016, 09:39 AM)Rhinocero23 Wrote: Dalton is good...last year very good. As much as I hate Ben, he is elite...that means in the top 5. Dalton is not there and probably never will be. Ben can make all the throws Dalton can make 90% of all the throws. I know you will want to disagree with this but given you are a great film researcher (you often support your stance with clips) show me one time Andy has put a ball in the air greater than 60 yards...if he has it needs to have height too.

Ben has several examples of balls traveling 75-80 yards is the air with a huge parabola. That gives a speedy wideout a huge advantage. It opens up an additional 25% of the field.

Only if the QB has enough time to wait for the WR to get that far down field... The ball usually isn't in daltons hands that long because the OL cant handle more than 3 seconds. 

[Brownshoe]

(09-14-2016, 09:39 AM)Rhinocero23 Wrote: Dalton is good...last year very good. As much as I hate Ben, he is elite...that means in the top 5. Dalton is not there and probably never will be. Ben can make all the throws Dalton can make 90% of all the throws. I know you will want to disagree with this but given you are a great film researcher (you often support your stance with clips) show me one time Andy has put a ball in the air greater than 60 yards...if he has it needs to have height too.

Ben has several examples of balls traveling 75-80 yards is the air with a huge parabola. That gives a speedy wideout a huge advantage. It opens up an additional 25% of the field.

You do realize that the longest completed pass in NFL history is 83 yards through the air (Don Meridith to Bob Hays). Ben doesn't have multiple 75-80 yard passes through the air, and 99% of those passes that have that much distance through the air are hail marys (from any QB).

[Rhinocero23]

(09-14-2016, 10:01 AM)XenoMorph Wrote: Only if the QB has enough time to wait for the WR to get that far down field... The ball usually isn't in daltons hands that long because the OL cant handle more than 3 seconds. 

You could have a point there.

 I still don't have any reason to believe Andy has that much arm. I think you may be muddying the waters a bit. Your example makes it seem as though the quarterback is just standing there waiting for receiver to run 60 yards down the field.

For instance last year Ben completed a pass against us that was on the left sideline coming from the north end zone. He was on the numbers on the right...the  receiver only had to run down the field 50 yards however the ball traveled close to 80. Point being he did not have to wait on the receiver to get down the field he had to have enough arm to throw the ball 80 yards in the air with a high enough arc to allow the receiver to run underneath it on the 50 yard go route. Andy cannot make that throw and never will. That does not make him a bad QB it just is obvious he cannot make all of the throws. 

[OrlandoBengal]

(09-14-2016, 10:40 AM)Rhinocero23 Wrote: You could have a point there.

 I still don't have any reason to believe Andy has that much arm. I think you may be muddying the waters a bit. Your example makes it seem as though the quarterback is just standing there waiting for receiver to run 60 yards down the field.

For instance last year Ben completed a pass against us that was on the left sideline coming from the north end zone. He was on the numbers on the right...the  receiver only had to run down the field 50 yards however the ball traveled close to 80. Point being he did not have to wait on the receiver to get down the field he had to have enough arm to throw the ball 80 yards in the air with a high enough arc to allow the receiver to run underneath it on the 50 yard go route. Andy cannot make that throw and never will. That does not make him a bad QB it just is obvious he cannot make all of the throws. 

There are very few who can make that throw, but I do know what you mean.  Ben does put a high arc on throws, which gives his guy a chance to run under it.  He is also very good at hitting receivers in stride, which allows for even more yards after the catch.  Add in the fact that he is still very good at extending plays, he can throw off his back foot or across his body and still get velocity on it... I cannot stand Roethlisberger, but the guy can play quarterback.

[Rhinocero23]

(09-14-2016, 10:06 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: You do realize that the longest completed pass in NFL history is 83 yards through the air (Don Meridith to Bob Hays). Ben doesn't have multiple 75-80 yard passes through the air, and 99% of those passes that have that much distance through the air are hail marys (from any QB).

Where did you find that stat? I believe that is from the line of scrimmage to the completed yard line. That does not take in account the ball traveling across the field or the depth of drop back. Nor should it for purposes of stats...this is a point of topic concerning arm strength. 

Now you can continue to believe that Andy has a cannon and you would be wrong. It works against your motive to claim to be "the one guy who knew" way back that Andy was the greatest most capable QB in the history of the game. See you have to be able to admit when you kids are ugly...it does not mean they are not smart. Andy has a average NFL arm, great accuracy, and has a great football mind. He makes excellent post snap adjustments to put his team in the optimal position to succeed… With average NFL arm strength. 

 I find that to be a higher compliment then delusionaly pretending that he has a Cannon can run a 4.0 40 and can jump over the goalpost. 

[Brownshoe]

(09-14-2016, 10:53 AM)Rhinocero23 Wrote: Where did you find that stat? I believe that is from the line of scrimmage to the completed yard line. That does not take in account the ball traveling across the field or the depth of drop back. Nor should it for purposes of stats...this is a point of topic concerning arm strength. 

Now you can continue to believe that Andy has a cannon and you would be wrong. It works against your motive to claim to be "the one guy who knew" way back that Andy was the greatest most capable QB in the history of the game. See you have to be able to admit when you kids are ugly...it does not mean they are not smart. Andy has a average NFL arm, great accuracy, and has a great football mind. He makes excellent post snap adjustments to put his team in the optimal position to succeed… With average NFL arm strength. 

 I find that to be a higher compliment then delusionaly pretending that he has a Cannon can run a 4.0 40 and can jump over the goalpost. 

Dalton does have a good NFL arm. It's not average. He has some of the best stats in the league when it comes to 20+ and 40+ yard completions. Pretty much all passes that are 75-80 yards through the air are hail marys. The hail mary Aaron Rodgers had against the Cardinals was only ~60 yards through the air. To say 75-80 through the air on anything other than a hail mary is just fooling yourself.

[Hammerstripes]

There are actually a few guys that I would take over Brown. I think that he is partly a product of the Steeler's system that has produced guys like Wallace and Sanders.

That being said, I think you could throw a bunch of guys in the Steeler offense and would get similar, if not more dominant, numbers:

Julio Jones
AJ
Dez Bryant (although I wouldn't put him in the same category as those 2 since he seems to have some personal issues on and off the field)
OBJ