One Touchdown against a bad defense?

[OrlandoBengal]

(09-30-2016, 02:12 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Nothing too out of the ordinary there...

Bengals' Yards per Carry rankings:

2006- 25th
2007- 28th
2008- 30th
2009- 24th
2010- 32nd
2011- 27th
2012- 20th
2013- 28th
2014- 12th
2015- 23rd
2016- 30th


We have 2 of the top RB prospects from their respective classes. Hill is averaging 3.8 ypc and Gio is averaging 2.7. That says it all to me. No matter who we trot out, we never have much of a run game.

Put the ball in Dalton's hands and let him throw it 40 times per game.  I know that is not a popular sentiment, but for the last 10 years the team has been in the bottom 1/3 for rushing.  Stop with the annual "we're going to be a run first team", "this team is built as a power rushing one" BS and embrace who you are.  That or you need to draft different personnel for the line because what you're doing is not working...

[Benton]

(09-30-2016, 02:22 PM)OrlandoBengal Wrote: Put the ball in Dalton's hands and let him throw it 40 times per game.  I know that is not a popular sentiment, but for the last 10 years the team has been in the bottom 1/3 for rushing.  Stop with the annual "we're going to be a run first team", "this team is built as a power rushing one" BS and embrace who you are.  That or you need to draft different personnel for the line because what you're doing is not working...

The first few seasons, Dalton was sub .500 whenever he threw more than 35 times a games. The last couple years, if I'm remembering right, he's only lost a couple games when he's thrown 40+. I've always wanted to get the ground game going, but maybe you're right. Maybe we should go back to "Hey, we're going to throw it all day. You can't stop all these threats."

Whatever the cure, we need to fix this lost in identity problem we have.

[OrlandoBengal]

(09-30-2016, 02:32 PM)Benton Wrote: The first few seasons, Dalton was sub .500 whenever he threw more than 35 times a games. The last couple years, if I'm remembering right, he's only lost a couple games when he's thrown 40+. I've always wanted to get the ground game going, but maybe you're right. Maybe we should go back to "Hey, we're going to throw it all day. You can't stop all these threats."

Whatever the cure, we need to fix this lost in identity problem we have.

Prior to last season, I would not have thought this way, but do now.  It's like they try to force the run and all it does is kill momentum.

[Shake n Blake]

(09-30-2016, 04:07 PM)OrlandoBengal Wrote: Prior to last season, I would not have thought this way, but do now.  It's like they try to force the run and all it does is kill momentum.

Well you have to run sometimes, even if it's to make sure the defense doesn't trot out 6 db's all the time. That said, we obviously haven't been successful enough to feature it for a long time now.

Maybe we should have more of a Lions/Saints offense. Pass heavy. At least we know Dalton/Green/Eifert/Gio/LaFell can make that work. Heck, even the Ravens and Steelers seem to pass more than we do.

[Bengal Dude]

(09-30-2016, 02:12 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Nothing too out of the ordinary there...

Bengals' Yards per Carry rankings:

2006- 25th
2007- 28th
2008- 30th
2009- 24th
2010- 32nd
2011- 27th
2012- 20th
2013- 28th
2014- 12th
2015- 23rd
2016- 30th


We have 2 of the top RB prospects from their respective classes. Hill is averaging 3.8 ypc and Gio is averaging 2.7. That says it all to me. No matter who we trot out, we never have much of a run game.

What's really sad, is that as of right now, Miami and Denver are the two worst run defenses of all the teams on our schedule and we struggled against both. Now we get Dallas, who is #12, and New England tied for #10. I'm not exactly looking forward to what our rushing game looks like in the coming weeks.

[IMightBeRight]

(09-30-2016, 02:32 PM)Benton Wrote: The first few seasons, Dalton was sub .500 whenever he threw more than 35 times a games. The last couple years, if I'm remembering right, he's only lost a couple games when he's thrown 40+. I've always wanted to get the ground game going, but maybe you're right. Maybe we should go back to "Hey, we're going to throw it all day. You can't stop all these threats."

Whatever the cure, we need to fix this lost in identity problem we have.

Yup, go back to how it was in the seasons just following the hiring of Lewis, nothing wrong with throwing it down field all day, as long as it works. 

[OrlandoBengal]

(09-30-2016, 04:17 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Well you have to run sometimes, even if it's to make sure the defense doesn't trot out 6 db's all the time. That said, we obviously haven't been successful enough to feature it for a long time now.

Maybe we should have more of a Lions/Saints offense. Pass heavy. At least we know Dalton/Green/Eifert/Gio/LaFell can make that work. Heck, even the Ravens and Steelers seem to pass more than we do.

Agreed, you have to keep them honest, but I totally see Dalton as a Drew Brees.  Intelligent, makes good pre snap reads, is not going to make a ton of mistakes. Not to mention a little dump off or bubble screen to Gio is basically a run anyway.  Focus on what you are good at, don't try to force what you're not.

[*bengalfan74*]

(09-30-2016, 10:10 AM)bengals67 Wrote: I started a thread after the Broncos game which really explains the problem

Our offensive line is way below average with the worst center in the league. Zeitler is definitely not getting a major contract and our RT is essentially a rookie.

We will not beat any of the top 4 or 5 in AFC with this level of offensive line play.

D line was average in first three games. They were dominant yesterday against a second string Miami line.

Maybe having Eifert playing helps O line because the D has to account for him but I doubt it. There was no push from our O line and nothing for Hill and Gio to work with.


D is going to need to carry us against Dallas. I shudder to think how badly we are going to get beat in New England.

Yep !

I'd only add that our bargain basement OC has no clue. If we continue without shaking up this O-line we're in for a lot of clobberings this season.

[Vas Deferens]

(09-30-2016, 07:13 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Yep !

I'd only add that our bargain basement OC has no clue. If we continue without shaking up this O-line we're in for a lot of clobberings this season.

Nobody does good work when they know they can't be fired.   Look at our Oline coach.  We can't fire them because we refuse to pay for a better replacement and can't promote with the log jam at the top.  It's basic management principles our FO has never had to learn with the tarnished nepotism spoon in their mouths.  

[Essex Johnson]

(09-30-2016, 01:16 PM)OrlandoBengal Wrote: First of all, Seattle has never been known as any type of offensive juggernaut.  Second, they were ranked near the absolute bottom against the run and we managed 2.1 yards per carry last night.  When you're facing a team that is terrible against the run, you would think they would be able to punch it in from inside the five.  Especially when they are bringing in extra blockers to help.

so i guess you believe Steelers are the 14th best passing team in the league also.. since that is where they are ranked... Miami has some good players on that defense line.. a few weeks into a year does not mean a team is good or bad as a whole.  Bottom line if they were that bad they would not have given up just one TD to Seattle.. 

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(09-30-2016, 08:31 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: so i guess you believe Steelers are the 14th best passing team in the league also.. since that is where they are ranked... Miami has some good players on that defense line.. a few weeks into a year does not mean a team is good or bad as a whole.  Bottom line if they were that bad they would not have given up just one TD to Seattle.. 

Then the Rams are a Super Bowl contender.....they just gave up a FG to them.  Seattle offense is struggling this year.

[*SHRacerX*]

(09-30-2016, 04:16 AM)Trademark Wrote: I'm not being a cry baby or anything and it was good to see us get back on track but how do we only manage to score one touchdown against a bad defense?

I will chalk up sloppy play to the short week, and I was at least somewhat encouraged by the defensive play given the same circumstances.  I just really want to start seeing this famed double A gap blitzes I kept hearing about against the likes of Dak Prescott, Tom Brady, and so on...

Stop playing these guys to not get beat deep.  That is happening anyways with poor communication.  I really just want them to start contesting the short stuff again.  Edelman will eat them alive if they are playing off coverage.  And to me that is the equivalent of entering the ring with mittens on your hands and just dancing around the ring hoping to not get hit.  They must force turnovers, not hope they just happen.  They must hit people, not let them catch it and make a tackle seven yards later.  They must get aggressive, plain and simple, and they can't wait for the playoffs to do that.  Number one, because they likely won't even make the playoffs if they don't and number two, because you simply can't change what you have done all year in one week and make it work.  

[*SHRacerX*]

(09-30-2016, 10:10 AM)bengals67 Wrote: I started a thread after the Broncos game which really explains the problem

Our offensive line is way below average with the worst center in the league. Zeitler is definitely not getting a major contract and our RT is essentially a rookie.

We will not beat any of the top 4 or 5 in AFC with this level of offensive line play.

D line was average in first three games. They were dominant yesterday against a second string Miami line.

Maybe having Eifert playing helps O line because the D has to account for him but I doubt it. There was no push from our O line and nothing for Hill and Gio to work with.


D is going to need to carry us against Dallas. I shudder to think how badly we are going to get beat in New England.

The Bengal's solution to this problem is to amass more and more help at the offensive line.  They are keeping an extra TE, and they are keeping the back in to block and many times there are only two receivers in the pattern.  

To me, this is worsening the problem.  The defense similarly stacks the line and the Bengals can't break through.  They should be doing the opposite.  Spread them out and attack.  If you go two TEs, you have to send one in the pattern.  The RB can chip, and be an outlet receiver.  I have seen VERY few plays with two receivers in the pattern where they have had ANY success, yet they do it time and time again.  Kills me.