Jim O & Paul Dehner: Who stays, who goes among Bengals FA's?

[Bengalholic]

Interesting read. They give percentages on the likelihood of each player returning - 

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/sports/nfl/bengals/2017/01/05/who-stays-who-goes-among-bengals-free-agents/96192598/

[Trademark]

Bring back LaFell, Whitworth, Kirkpatrick and Peerman for sure

[OrlandoBengal]

I personally think they are overly optimistic about Zeitler and Kirkpatrick. I think they are both going to want significantly more than Brown is willing to pay.

[leonardfan40]

(01-05-2017, 03:34 PM)OrlandoBengal Wrote: I personally think they are overly optimistic about Zeitler and Kirkpatrick.  I think they are both going to want significantly more than Brown is willing to pay.

I don't think we'll lose both of them, I feel like Kirk will probably be back and Z will be gone. I expect Whit back as well. We have a lot of cap space and they will use it on our guys like usual, so no way we let both our big names go. 

[McC]

(01-05-2017, 03:09 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: Interesting read. They give percentages on the likelihood of each player returning - 

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/sports/nfl/bengals/2017/01/05/who-stays-who-goes-among-bengals-free-agents/96192598/

Doesn't exactly paint a rosy picture.

[OrlandoBengal]

(01-05-2017, 03:55 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: I don't think we'll lose both of them, I feel like Kirk will probably be back and Z will be gone. I expect Whit back as well. We have a lot of cap space and they will use it on our guys like usual, so no way we let both our big names go. 

I'm not sure why, but I have a feeling Kirkpatrick may want to leave.  I guess it all depends on his view of the franchise's near future.  Looking through the list of cornerbacks, he could have multiple suitors if he hits the market as well.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

Thanks Holic. The good news is it seems we are finally trying to move on from Peko and we are trying
to bring back Whit, Lafell and Kirkpatrick. Would like to bring back Zeitler, looks like it is a wait and see
what the market gives him first.

Burkhead just proved that he is a good RB right when we needed one. Why the hell don't we give him an
extension is beyond me. Gio is hurt, Hill doesn't run hard. Bring this guy back.

[samhain]

I have a feeling that Kirkpatrick has franchise tag written all over him. It's a huge number, to be sure (14 or 15 mil), but the team is over a barrel with the recent Adam Jones screwup and the lack of development from early draft pick corners.

Signing Dre give them another year of a positive known commodity while getting an extended look at the younger corners. When Jones gets his suspension, they'll have no choice but to play them. If, at the end of 2017, they are pleased with Dennard, Shaw and Jackson or even two of 3, then let Dre chase money and let the huge franchise number drop off of the books.

On top of it all, it will plug up a huge chunk of cap quick and give them a great excuse not to chase any A or B grade outside guys on the FA market. It's a total Bengal Way kind of move.

I predict that they'll pay Whit 2 or 3 years at 10 mil and throw 14 or 15 at Dre, thus eating up about 25 mil of that 48 before jump. They may even give Whit a little more up front in case they want to release him in 18 or 19 if he shows serious decline.

Sprinkle that in with a LaFell deal for 3.5 per or so and some minor signings like Peerman, Thompson, and maybe Gilberry and they are probably done. Same team and staff as last year minus a really good guard and a running back on the upswing. Gotta love it.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(01-05-2017, 04:41 PM)samhain Wrote: I have a feeling that Kirkpatrick has franchise tag written all over him.  It's a huge number, to be sure (14 or 15 mil), but the team is over a barrel with the recent Adam Jones screwup and the lack of development from early draft pick corners.  

Signing Dre give them another year of a positive known commodity while getting an extended look at the younger corners.  When Jones gets his suspension, they'll have no choice but to play them.  If, at the end of 2017, they are pleased with Dennard, Shaw and Jackson or even two of 3, then let Dre chase money and let the huge franchise number drop off of the books.  

On top of it all, it will plug up a huge chunk of cap quick and give them a great excuse not to chase any A or B grade outside guys on the FA market.  It's a total Bengal Way kind of move.  

I predict that they'll pay Whit 2 or 3 years at 10 mil and throw 14 or 15 at Dre, thus eating up about 25 mil of that 48 before jump.  They may even give Whit a little more up front in case they want to release him in 18 or 19 if he shows serious decline.

Sprinkle that in with a LaFell deal for 3.5 per or so and some minor signings like Peerman, Thompson, and maybe Gilberry and they are probably done.  Same team and staff as last year minus a really good guard and a running back on the upswing.  Gotta love it.

Damn, makes sense Sam.

I still have to be an idiot optimist and hold out all hope that they finally move on from Paul Alexander.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(01-05-2017, 04:41 PM)samhain Wrote: I have a feeling that Kirkpatrick has franchise tag written all over him.  It's a huge number, to be sure (14 or 15 mil), but the team is over a barrel with the recent Adam Jones screwup and the lack of development from early draft pick corners.  

Signing Dre give them another year of a positive known commodity while getting an extended look at the younger corners.  When Jones gets his suspension, they'll have no choice but to play them.  If, at the end of 2017, they are pleased with Dennard, Shaw and Jackson or even two of 3, then let Dre chase money and let the huge franchise number drop off of the books.  

On top of it all, it will plug up a huge chunk of cap quick and give them a great excuse not to chase any A or B grade outside guys on the FA market.  It's a total Bengal Way kind of move.  

I predict that they'll pay Whit 2 or 3 years at 10 mil and throw 14 or 15 at Dre, thus eating up about 25 mil of that 48 before jump.  They may even give Whit a little more up front in case they want to release him in 18 or 19 if he shows serious decline.

Sprinkle that in with a LaFell deal for 3.5 per or so and some minor signings like Peerman, Thompson, and maybe Gilberry and they are probably done.  Same team and staff as last year minus a really good guard and a running back on the upswing.  Gotta love it.

Sounds about right!

[McC]

I will say 100 % that Whit has to come back, no matter what it costs. He wants to stay, he's still playing well and he's a cornerstone of this team. If he leaves, next season is shot.

[McC]

Guess we'll find out just how committed thy are to the raise and keep our own mantra they keep repeating. The money is there.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(01-05-2017, 04:48 PM)McC Wrote: I will say 100 % that Whit has to come back, no matter what it costs.  He wants to stay, he's still playing well and he's  a cornerstone of this team.  If he leaves, next season is shot.

I agree, he is a necessity.  If the two tackles they drafted had a good coach that could have hastened their transition to this level, we might have been in good enough shape to be able to let Whit go if the price got too steep.  Now, it's pay him, or tank next season and risk injury to your QB from the blindside.  No thanks.  Sign this man.....and I want to clarify that I WANT Whit to stay, but if the money wasn't right, you have to consider letting him go.  Thanks to dumbass Pauly, you have no choice now.

[McC]

(01-05-2017, 04:52 PM)Wyche Wrote: I agree, he is a necessity.  If the two tackles they drafted had a good coach that could have hastened their transition to this level, we might have been in good enough shape to be able to let Whit go if the price got too steep.  Now, it's pay him, or tank next season and risk injury to your QB from the blindside.  No thanks.  Sign this man.....and I want to clarify that I WANT Whit to stay, but if the money wasn't right, you have to consider letting him go.  Thanks to dumbass Pauly, you have no choice now.

If Whit leaves, you'd better hold onto McCarron.  And we're not exactly set at RT.

[samhain]

(01-05-2017, 04:47 PM)Wyche Wrote: Sounds about right!

Yep.  I also don't feel like Dre is the kind of player they want to commit huge money to in the long run.  He has an injury history and will command top corner money for less than top corner return.  I imagine they'd want to avoid committing resources to him when they may have better options coming down the pipe as they develop.  

Personally, I think he seems like exactly the kind of ballplayer that will let up once he's set up for life.  Just a feeling.  He sure did seem to be a lot more willing to contribute in the run game in 2016 than he did in previous seasons, which is a little bit of a red flag to me. 

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

Cannot let Whit leave no question about it.

[Hoofhearted]

(01-05-2017, 04:41 PM)samhain Wrote: I have a feeling that Kirkpatrick has franchise tag written all over him. It's a huge number, to be sure (14 or 15 mil), but the team is over a barrel with the recent Adam Jones screwup and the lack of development from early draft pick corners.

Signing Dre give them another year of a positive known commodity while getting an extended look at the younger corners. When Jones gets his suspension, they'll have no choice but to play them. If, at the end of 2017, they are pleased with Dennard, Shaw and Jackson or even two of 3, then let Dre chase money and let the huge franchise number drop off of the books.

On top of it all, it will plug up a huge chunk of cap quick and give them a great excuse not to chase any A or B grade outside guys on the FA market. It's a total Bengal Way kind of move.

I predict that they'll pay Whit 2 or 3 years at 10 mil and throw 14 or 15 at Dre, thus eating up about 25 mil of that 48 before jump. They may even give Whit a little more up front in case they want to release him in 18 or 19 if he shows serious decline.

Sprinkle that in with a LaFell deal for 3.5 per or so and some minor signings like Peerman, Thompson, and maybe Gilberry and they are probably done. Same team and staff as last year minus a really good guard and a running back on the upswing. Gotta love it.

Sounds right, except I doubt they give Whit anything more than two years. Guessing another one year deal.

Unknown would be if they wise up and cut Rey M as well. That changes things quite a bit. But if Marv is coach that's not happening

[J24]

They only need to return two guys Zeitler and Whitworth the rest are replaceable.

[samhain]

(01-05-2017, 04:48 PM)McC Wrote: I will say 100 % that Whit has to come back, no matter what it costs.  He wants to stay, he's still playing well and he's  a cornerstone of this team.  If he leaves, next season is shot.

Totally agree.  Their contingency plan at both tackle spots blew up in their faces in a major way.  I hated both young tackles from the moment they were drafted, but hoped I was wrong about them.  Looks like Ogbuehi is even more worthless than I thought.  Fisher may have a shot, but even he doesn't inspire confidence.  They have zero choice but to sign Whitworth if they are serious about being competitive.  

This franchise is going to eat a massive shit sandwich over the next few seasons.  Their drafting has come home to roost and the deficiencies are popping up faster than a team that's operated by the Bengal Way can fill them.  How much would it mean to have a Landon Collins instead of an Ogbuehi in that draft?  Now they have nothing because they got cute and believed the hype about how great they were at drafting.

They wil be forced to re-sign aging players at dumpster dive rates because there's nobody young on the roster to fill holes.  Nobody at DE.  Nobody at safety.  Nobody at OG.  Nobody at C.  Nobody at DT.  Major questions at LB.  Most of these are positions that have been avoided actively early in recent drafts to select shitbag 3-year projects.  There are guys there, but few if any instill the kind of confidence that guys did in during the last rebuild.

[yellowxdiscipline]

Either Zeitler or Kirkpatrick will get tagged. I think they want to keep both guys long term. My guess is tag Kirkpatrick and get Zeitler locked up. I think Lafell is worth giving a two year deal. I think we can keep Whit too.

All these guys are retainable, how hard the team wants them back is on them.