My Q&A with Duke Tobin

[jowczarski]

Duke rarely speaks, and I was fortunate to get him for a few questions.

I saw some of these topics in the threads below (recent first round picks, the kicking situation, etc.). Some interesting stuff from the director of player personnel.

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/sports/nfl/bengals/2017/01/27/cincinnati-bengals-director-of-player-personnel-duke-tobin-talks-nfl-draft-mccarron-and-kickers/97154184/

[SunsetBengal]

I'm glad that you had the opportunity to sit down with Duke Tobin, I'm sure that you must have felt honored to get the interview. However, after reading, I feel like he said a lot of words, without really saying much of anything. Just a lot of bland, general statements. I really wish that he could have given a clue as to which position groups that the team is leaning toward, with that #9 pick.

I was happy to read that Duke Tobin says that there will be changes, but a bit disappointed in his expression toward Ogbuehi. As a fan, I think that it is more than obvious, to anyone that even follows AFCN football, that Ogbuehi is a bust. In my opinion, the team should just admit their mistake in drafting him and move on.

I apologize for coming off like a bitter fan, but that is where many of us are, right now.

[Jpoore]

(01-27-2017, 10:42 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I'm glad that you had the opportunity to sit down with Duke Tobin, I'm sure that you must have felt honored to get the interview.  However, after reading, I feel like he said a lot of words, without really saying much of anything.  Just a lot of bland, general statements.  I really wish that he could have given a clue as to which position groups that the team is leaning toward, with that #9 pick.  

I was happy to read that Duke Tobin says that there will be changes, but a bit disappointed in his expression toward Ogbuehi.  As a fan, I think that it is more than obvious, to anyone that even follows AFCN football, that Ogbuehi is a bust.  In my opinion, the team should just admit their mistake in drafting him and move on.  

I apologize for coming off like a bitter fan, but that is where many of us are, right now.

Yeah I agree with the Tobin statement although he probably doesn't even really know right now this early or the fact that he doesn't want to give other teams a clue. As far as ogbuehi I m fine with giving him one more year. Everyone was calling Dre k a bust before last year. I wanna see what he can do with Tc to actually have one for once and to back up Whit. Can't ask for a better mentor. So yeah one more year is fine with me before I throw out bust label. 

[seahawkscheat]

we have drafted poor over the past few years

[HarleyDog]

(01-27-2017, 11:14 PM)seahawkscheat Wrote: we have drafted poor over the past few years

Yes we have. However previously this has been one of Marvins strong areas. He gets benefit of doubt by the draft graders because of it. Yet, he's starting to suck even at this task. Poor ass coach. Maybe he knows he's on his way out and doesn't want another coach win with his players and crushing his reputation, so he is destroying the team good enough that the possibility isn't there.

[Shake n Blake]

100% agree with everything Sunset said.

[coachmcneil71]

(01-27-2017, 10:42 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I'm glad that you had the opportunity to sit down with Duke Tobin, I'm sure that you must have felt honored to get the interview.  However, after reading, I feel like he said a lot of words, without really saying much of anything.  Just a lot of bland, general statements.  I really wish that he could have given a clue as to which position groups that the team is leaning toward, with that #9 pick.  

I was happy to read that Duke Tobin says that there will be changes, but a bit disappointed in his expression toward Ogbuehi.  As a fan, I think that it is more than obvious, to anyone that even follows AFCN football, that Ogbuehi is a bust.  In my opinion, the team should just admit their mistake in drafting him and move on.  

I apologize for coming off like a bitter fan, but that is where many of us are, right now.

(01-27-2017, 11:39 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: 100% agree with everything Sunset said.

Good work and congratulations on the interview, but I'm with these feller's. There was a lot of lip service in there. That said, thanks for the share.

[MaineBengal]

Sheesh. If the de-facto GM of my team answered questions accurately..... can you imagine? "Yeah, we're targeting an edge rusher with the #9 pick, and after that we want to prioritize LB, CB, and interior OL."

He'd be -- rightly -- skewered by everyone who saw it.

Jim, thanks for sharing your article. I appreciate what you do.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

I'm sure Tobin doesn't want to tip the Bengal's hand to other teams that might trade up to draft the player the Bengals are targeting.

[coachmcneil71]

(01-28-2017, 01:04 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: I'm sure Tobin doesn't want to tip the Bengal's hand to other teams that might trade up to draft the player the Bengals are targeting.

 
 That should go without saying. I think he did an excellent job of that, and his dance moves bring back memories of Saturday Night Fever!  

[jowczarski]

I'm glad that you had the opportunity to sit down with Duke Tobin, I'm sure that you must have felt honored to get the interview. However, after reading, I feel like he said a lot of words, without really saying much of anything. Just a lot of bland, general statements. I really wish that he could have given a clue as to which position groups that the team is leaning toward, with that #9 pick. 

I'm sure Tobin doesn't want to tip the Bengal's hand to other teams that might trade up to draft the player the Bengals are targeting.

Good work and congratulations on the interview, but I'm with these feller's. There was a lot of lip service in there. That said, thanks for the share.

Thanks for reading the entire thing – these statements prove you did

Yes, he did a good job of talking through and around some topics. But some of it was interesting – namely setting the table for what he feels will be there at No. 9 talent wise but still felt it’s a guy who can play immediately (which hasn’t been in the case in the first round in how long?).

I do believe him (and other league evaluators) when they talk in January about prospects that they don’t know who they want. And unless you have the No. 1 pick there is always some mystery because anything can happen before their pick.

I think he was totally honest about Bullock. It is in lock step with what Simmons told me just a few days ago when they clearly were in negotiations with Bullock to be re-signed.

I was happy to read that Duke Tobin says that there will be changes, but a bit disappointed in his expression toward Ogbuehi. As a fan, I think that it is more than obvious, to anyone that even follows AFCN football, that Ogbuehi is a bust. In my opinion, the team should just admit their mistake in drafting him and move on. 

Yeah I agree with the Tobin statement although he probably doesn't even really know right now this early or the fact that he doesn't want to give other teams a clue. As far as ogbuehi I m fine with giving him one more year. Everyone was calling Dre k a bust before last year. I wanna see what he can do with Tc to actually have one for once and to back up Whit. Can't ask for a better mentor. So yeah one more year is fine with me before I throw out bust label. 

I do think a tackle will be in consideration at some point in those 11 picks, though none of the players in the class are as talented as Fisher or Ogbuehi.

[BengalChris]

Jim, excellent on getting the interview and getting him to talk.

Like the others have said I also don't see Ogbuehi as the answer to either tackle spot. The guy ended the year on IR and he really needs to have a spectacular off season. It's tough to get your strength up with a rotator cuff injury. I just don't see it happening and the team's optimism appears unwarranted. What he did in college has become irrelevant now that he's going into his 3rd year. At least now we know how the team sees it even though it was disappointing news to get.

Personally, I'm hoping a couple of QBs get pushed up the board and are overdrafted, pushing one of those top tier guys down to #9.

I look at the underachieving depth on this team and if the front office drafted BPA at every pick all the way down and it would come out the other end a better overall team. That's, of course, assuming our evaluations are legit.

[McC]

(01-28-2017, 01:04 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: I'm sure Tobin doesn't want to tip the Bengal's hand to other teams that might trade up to draft the player the Bengals are targeting.

That'll happen anyway.  It almost always does.

[*SHRacerX*]

(01-27-2017, 10:42 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I'm glad that you had the opportunity to sit down with Duke Tobin, I'm sure that you must have felt honored to get the interview.  However, after reading, I feel like he said a lot of words, without really saying much of anything.  Just a lot of bland, general statements.  I really wish that he could have given a clue as to which position groups that the team is leaning toward, with that #9 pick.  

I was happy to read that Duke Tobin says that there will be changes, but a bit disappointed in his expression toward Ogbuehi.  As a fan, I think that it is more than obvious, to anyone that even follows AFCN football, that Ogbuehi is a bust.  In my opinion, the team should just admit their mistake in drafting him and move on.  

I apologize for coming off like a bitter fan, but that is where many of us are, right now.

Ogbuehi is a double-bust...They thought his feet and athleticism was the stuff great LTs are made of...but he can't move a 200lb safety.  He is so weak in his gas can (his butt) that any shot of him contributing as a guard is also off the table.  There have been a number of tackles that didn't have the mobility to play LT, but ended up having solid careers at guard, but there is no way that is happening with Ogbuehi.  

He will, unfortunately, toil in repeated failures and never-ending support because he was a first round pick.  At the very least, don't pick up the guy's fifth year option.  

Now I read about his shoulder that doesn't require surgery...just rest.  Sure, that is the making of a great offseason.  Just rest, big guy....don't work on your strength that is so pathetic.  Oh, and we don't have any options to replace you so your job is safe.  

Sign Whit to 2-3 year deal, and relegate this guy to the extra TE and nothing more.  They will need to draft at least two offensive linemen in this draft:  A tackle to groom to be Whit's replacement and a Center to be Bodine's.  Don't get your hopes up, though, Bodine isn't going anywhere while he is still under contract.  

[*SHRacerX*]

(01-28-2017, 06:16 AM)McC Wrote: That'll happen anyway.  It almost always does.

I think the Colts really want Dalvin Cook...and with a dearth of talent at Tackle, it makes sense....How bad do you want him, Indy?  We're listening.  

[SunsetBengal]

(01-28-2017, 11:05 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: Ogbuehi is a double-bust...They thought his feet and athleticism was the stuff great LTs are made of...but he can't move a 200lb safety.  He is so weak in his gas can (his butt) that any shot of him contributing as a guard is also off the table.  There have been a number of tackles that didn't have the mobility to play LT, but ended up having solid careers at guard, but there is no way that is happening with Ogbuehi.  

He will, unfortunately, toil in repeated failures and never-ending support because he was a first round pick.  At the very least, don't pick up the guy's fifth year option.  

Now I read about his shoulder that doesn't require surgery...just rest.  Sure, that is the making of a great offseason.  Just rest, big guy....don't work on your strength that is so pathetic.  Oh, and we don't have any options to replace you so your job is safe.  

Sign Whit to 2-3 year deal, and relegate this guy to the extra TE and nothing more.  They will need to draft at least two offensive linemen in this draft:  A tackle to groom to be Whit's replacement and a Center to be Bodine's.  Don't get your hopes up, though, Bodine isn't going anywhere while he is still under contract.  

Isn't this the final year of Boling's rookie deal?  I would think they would certainly be looking for the next Center.  However, we also know how this team works in mysterious ways.

[*SHRacerX*]

(01-28-2017, 11:10 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Isn't this the final year of Boling's rookie deal?  I would think they would certainly be looking for the next Center.  However, we also know how this team works in mysterious ways.

Yeah, that was the second to last line of my post:  two linemen:  one to groom to replace Whit and one to replace Bodine.  But they won't release Bodine for a rookie.  The rookie will sit and watch, barring injury, and they will hope for some miracle transformation that Bodine suddenly becomes a beast in the middle.  It won't happen, but they will never release a guy in his contract year.  

[Fan_in_Kettering]

I'm willing to give Cedric Ogbuehi a second chance this off season and through training camp for one reason:  I don't think Cedric played healthy in 2016 because to my eye he never seemed totally recovered from his college injury.  Last spring this pick made sense; Cedric graded high in all categories and his film from his games at Texas A&M showed an outstanding NFL prospect.  To me there are three potential reasons he underachieved last season:

(1) Being coached by the Piano Man
(2) Not being 100% healthy
(3) He's not NFL quality

Of these three reasons, I think (1) and/or (2) are more likely and (3) is a remote possibility.  If (3) turns out to be the case he needs to go because playoff teams don't have the luxury of experimenting with personnel.

[SunsetBengal]

(01-28-2017, 11:26 AM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: I'm willing to give Cedric Ogbuehi a second chance this off season and through training camp for one reason:  I don't think Cedric played healthy in 2016 because to my eye he never seemed totally recovered from his college injury.  Last spring this pick made sense; Cedric graded high in all categories and his film from his games at Texas A&M showed an outstanding NFL prospect.  To me there are three potential reasons he underachieved last season:

(1) Being coached by the Piano Man
(2) Not being 100% healthy
(3) He's not NFL quality

Of these three reasons, I think (1) and/or (2) are more likely and (3) is a remote possibility.  If (3) turns out to be the case he needs to go because playoff teams don't have the luxury of experimenting with personnel.

Ogbuehi's failure to launch has put the team in quite a bit of a situation.  He, and Fisher, were supposed to be stepping up into the roles of Whitworth and Andre Smith, that hasn't happened.  Now, rather than focusing money on re-signing a guy like Kevin Zeitler, the team must desperately attempt to sign Whit for another year or two.  Hopefully the draft is kind to the Bengals this year, and they hit strong on all of their picks, so that a guy like Ogbuehi becomes expendable in the near future.

Bonus would be if Paul Alexander woke up one morning, admitted the error of his ways, and humbly submitted his resignation to the team.

[Fan_in_Kettering]

(01-28-2017, 11:41 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Hopefully the draft is kind to the Bengals this year, and they hit strong on all of their picks, so that a guy like Ogbuehi becomes expendable in the near future.

I know it's a dirty term in Bengaldom, but what about looking via free agency for some outstanding offensive linemen?  It certainly paid off for Atlanta.