Are you circumsized?

[BengalHawk62]

BDid that get your attention? Honestly, I really don't need to know about your bits or lack there of, but I thought this was an interesting topic to add to this board. Iceland is proposing to ban all circumcisions on baby boys, the lawmaker from the center-right Progressive Party said she proposed the measure after realizing the country's ban on female genital mutilation had no equivalent to prevent male circumcision.


https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/feb/12/iceland-considers-ban-circumcision/




Personally, maybe this is just an ‘American’ POV, but I certainly feel like the health benefits outweigh the risks emmensely. I’m no doctor, so if someone on here knows more about that, please weigh in. I know when my son was born I weighed the pros and cons of circumsizing him and finally decided I didn’t want him to get beat up in junior high PE class for having a turtle head. At least that would have happened in my junior high days. Now maybe things have changed since then, but I still feel like I made the right decision.

[Griever]

no turtle neck here

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

[BmorePat87]

I am and I feel like the decision comes down to how we want others to view the kid. Most women I've talked to don't like it au natural. Two of my friends have sons, and while both of the dads are without the turtle neck, one chose to keep his son intact.

Do I think it really should be a decision the son makes? Sure, but who honestly wants an adult circumcision? Even if they'd prefer the look, who wants to go through that at an older age?

[CKwi88]

(02-21-2018, 10:57 AM)BengalHawk62 Wrote: Did that get your attention? Honestly, I really don't need to know about your bits or lack there of, but I thought this was an interesting topic to add to this board. Iceland is proposing to ban all circumcisions on baby boys, the lawmaker from the center-right Progressive Party said she proposed the measure after realizing the country's ban on female genital mutilation had no equivalent to prevent male circumcision.


https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/feb/12/iceland-considers-ban-circumcision/




Personally, maybe this is just an ‘American’ POV, but I certainly feel like the health benefits outweigh the risks emmensely.  I’m no doctor, so if someone on here knows more about that, please weigh in.  I know when my son was born I weighed the pros and cons of circumsizing him and finally decided I didn’t want him to get beat up in junior high PE class for having a turtle head.  At least that would have happened in my junior high days.  Now maybe things have changed since my days, but I still feel like I made the right decision.

I'd have to put in the effort to actually research, but I feel like the "health benefits" are really a nonfactor, and generally overstated. Even if studies are accurate and unbiased, UTIs have much more to do with hygiene, penile cancer has much more to do with other risk factors like smoking, and STDs have way more to do with unsafe sex.

I think it's much more an aesthetic/personal decision made by the parents (you admitted as much with the junior high possibilities) and to an extent I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I personally don't care one way or the other, and if my wife and I have to make that decision we've already discussed that we'll go the circumcision route. I think it has most to do with that fact that I am myself, and I think it would be an easy decision to leave my child intact if I were as well.

There are pros and cons and risks with both. And ultimately it comes down to the parents making the best chance they can given the circumstances. I agree with Pat in that it's probably not a decision that a grown man/older child would like to make.

[fredtoast]

The is a very activist anti-circumcision group. I forget the name, but I know I put a few of my friends on their mailing list years ago. The have anti-circumcision protest songs and posters and everything.

[*michaelsean*]

Comparing female mutilation to circumcision?

[Johnny Cupcakes]

I am...would you like to see photos?

[*bfine32*]

Ask your mom

[Johnny Cupcakes]

(02-21-2018, 04:02 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Comparing female mutilation to circumcision?

Seems like a valid comparison considering the fact that circumcision is literally the mutilation of male genitalia. 

[Belsnickel]

(02-21-2018, 04:13 PM)Johnny Cupcakes Wrote: Seems like a valid comparison considering the fact that circumcision is literally the mutilation of male genitalia. 

I don't know. I mean, there are different versions of the practice and some of them are much different. If we were talking excision of the clitoral hood and/or the labia minora, then I would agree. However, clitoridectomies and infibulation are things that also fall under what we typically call FGM (or FGO, if we want to take a relativistic stance on the topic). To compare a clitoridectomy, the glans penis would have to be cut off entirely. There is no comparable version of infibulation, as far as I know.

[Johnny Cupcakes]

(02-21-2018, 04:20 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I don't know. I mean, there are different versions of the practice and some of them are much different. If we were talking excision of the clitoral hood and/or the labia minora, then I would agree. However, clitoridectomies and infibulation are things that also fall under what we typically call FGM (or FGO, if we want to take a relativistic stance on the topic). To compare a clitoridectomy, the glans penis would have to be cut off entirely. There is no comparable version of infibulation, as far as I know.

No mention was made of the severity of the mutilations....

Still, they may be different enough to discuss separately, while also similar enough to address as one.

People like to pretend that the mutilation of the penis isn't a problem because it's been long accepted in the United States (when it is virtually nowhere else outside of third world countries), when really, the practice typically consists of taking an unwilling infant, inflicting pain and harm upon them, and leaving them with potential decreased sexual sensitivity.

All in the name of religious beliefs that the child does not hold.

Seems like something we should have retired long ago.

[Belsnickel]

(02-21-2018, 04:32 PM)Johnny Cupcakes Wrote: No mention was made of the severity of the mutilations....

Still, they may be different enough to discuss separately, while also similar enough to address as one.

People like to pretend that the mutilation of the penis isn't a problem because it's been long accepted in the United States (when it is virtually nowhere else outside of third world countries), when really, the practice typically consists of taking an unwilling infant, inflicting pain and harm upon them, and leaving them with potential decreased sexual sensitivity.

All in the name of religious beliefs that the child does not hold.

Seems like something we should have retired long ago.

I read an ethnographic paper on the practice in groups in Kenya. In the details, both boys and girls went through the process during puberty. It was done without any pain killers and part of the ritual was that showing any pain could cause ostracizing. Groups of boys and girls would have this done to them at one place in an evening. It was very interesting.

Anyway, I have mixed opinions on it. When I look at it through the lens of cultural relativism I have a hard time saying we should ban it, but then the issue becomes a matter of where the line is drawn. Reform Jews, and maybe even some Conservative groups, would probably fight it but not too strongly. Orthodox Jews, however, would be very unhappy with the decision and would bring a case of a First Amendment violation were a law passed here banning the practice.

The health arguments are non-existent when you actually look at the data. This is purely a cultural issue.

[fredtoast]

(02-21-2018, 04:32 PM)Johnny Cupcakes Wrote: People like to pretend that the mutilation of the penis isn't a problem because it's been long accepted in the United States (when it is virtually nowhere else outside of third world countries), when really, the practice typically consists of taking an unwilling infant, inflicting pain and harm upon them, and leaving them with potential decreased sexual sensitivity.

In general the "health benefits" of a circumcision are way overstated by one side and the "decreased sensitivity" is way overstated by the other.  I really don't see any need for the procedure, but I don't see any reason to be opposed to it either.

People like to joke about Catholics being pedophiles, but what about the Jews deciding that the best way to determine who was a jew was to look at his dick.
 

[*michaelsean*]

(02-21-2018, 04:13 PM)Johnny Cupcakes Wrote: Seems like a valid comparison considering the fact that circumcision is literally the mutilation of male genitalia. 

It's more like preemptive vaginal rejuvenation.  

[CKwi88]

(02-21-2018, 03:59 PM)fredtoast Wrote: The is a very activist anti-circumcision group.  I forget the name, but I know I put a few of my friends on their mailing list years ago.  The have anti-circumcision protest songs and posters and everything.

Think I know the group you're talking about. An acquaintance on Facebook used to share anti-circumcision posts on Facebook where these bloody messes of newborn males appeared. 

Quite extreme.

[BengalHawk62]

To me it’s boils down to a hygiene issue and to an extent, an aesthetic issue. Its a lot easier to take care of and clean without the ‘hood’. My friend decided not to cut his boys and now they are growing up and being potty trained, they are having all sorts of issues. Thin stream, basically the pee hole isn’t wide enough for the urine to pass thru and the little guy is having uncomfortable pain when he goes. And now my friend is going to a specialist to see if getting a circumsion now is the right course of action. Plus the boys are old enough to kind of know whats going to happen and they start freaking out.


Ya, there’s a reason why 3rd world countries don’t circumsize their boys.

[Johnny Cupcakes]

(02-21-2018, 04:57 PM)BengalHawk62 Wrote: To me it’s boils down to a hygiene issue and to an extent, an aesthetic issue.  Its a lot easier to take care of and clean without the ‘hood’.  My friend decided not to cut his boys and now they are growing up and being potty trained, they are having all sorts of issues.  Thin stream, basically the pee hole isn’t wide enough for the urine to pass thru and the little guy is having uncomfortable pain when he goes.  And now my friend is going to a specialist to see if getting a circumsion now is the right course of action. Plus the boys are old enough to kind of know whats going to happen and they start freaking out.  


Ya, there’s a reason why 3rd world countries don’t circumsize their boys.

3rd world countries are actually far more likely to circumcise male children...



Male circumcision rate by country according to the World Health Organization's 2007 review of the global trends and determinants of prevalence, safety, and acceptability of circumcision. Red countries show >80% prevalence, orange 20-80%, and yellow <20%.  

[Belsnickel]

(02-21-2018, 04:57 PM)BengalHawk62 Wrote: To me it’s boils down to a hygiene issue and to an extent, an aesthetic issue. Its a lot easier to take care of and clean without the ‘hood’. My friend decided not to cut his boys and now they are growing up and being potty trained, they are having all sorts of issues. Thin stream, basically the pee hole isn’t wide enough for the urine to pass thru and the little guy is having uncomfortable pain when he goes. And now my friend is going to a specialist to see if getting a circumsion now is the right course of action. Plus the boys are old enough to kind of know whats going to happen and they start freaking out.


Ya, there’s a reason why 3rd world countries don’t circumsize their boys.

Is your friend circumcised? I ask because if you have someone that is circumcised, they don't necessarily know all the "tricks" to having an uncut penis. I learned this back when I was working as a CNA. There was another male CNA who taught me about it because we had uncircumcised residents to care for. Other CNAs, including most of the males, didn't know what to do if they needed any help.

[Johnny Cupcakes]

(02-21-2018, 04:39 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: The health arguments are non-existent when you actually look at the data. This is purely a cultural issue.

(02-21-2018, 04:44 PM)fredtoast Wrote: In general the "health benefits" of a circumcision are way overstated 

The health benefits are as follows:

If you decide to not bathe yourself and exercise normal personal hygiene practices, it will accumulate less cheese.

......just friggin' clean yourself!