Bond slashed to 175 million while Trump appeals

[Luvnit2]

It appears appeals court feels bond was excessive. Sorry James, you losing streak begins.

[HarleyDog]

$454 million was a joke anyway. $175 is still rediculous, but it's a start.

[Luvnit2]

(03-25-2024, 12:30 PM)HarleyDog Wrote: $454 million was a joke anyway. $175 is still rediculous, but it's a start.

The bigger issue in my opinion is this shows the judge on the case was not being fair. 

I am confident in the end, an appeals court at some level will overturn the decision. If that happens, then NY will be open to a counter lawsuit from Donald Trump, Eric Trump and Don Jr. 

The Trump family could bankrupt them, that would be a hoot. 

[*pally*]

(03-25-2024, 12:30 PM)HarleyDog Wrote: $454 million was a joke anyway. $175 is still rediculous, but it's a start.

so you think Trump should be able to retain money and profits obtained via fraud?

[XenoMorph]

(03-25-2024, 12:53 PM)pally Wrote: so you think Trump should be able to retain money and profits obtained via fraud?

I think you should find a new news source.

[JustWinBaby]

Not sure I'd read anything into reducing the bond as an indication of the fairness of the full judgement.  And even if it were, $175M is still a huge loss for Trump.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(03-25-2024, 12:53 PM)pally Wrote: so you think Trump should be able to retain money and profits obtained via fraud?

Based on his posts I think it's rather obvious he doesn't believe Trump committed fraud.

[*pally*]

(03-25-2024, 12:56 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: I think you should find a new news source.

profits via fraud is the basis for the money owed.  Whether you agree or not, Trump was found liable for fraud. 

He may win on appeal...he may not.

BUt if he loses, why should he, or any other person found liable, be allowed to benefit from their crime?

[JustWinBaby]

(03-25-2024, 12:56 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Based on his posts I think it's rather obvious he doesn't believe Trump committed fraud.

Trump committed fraud, but the financial benefit is pretty questionable.  It COULD have resulted in a slightly higher interest rate, but that's impossible to determine conclusively.

For example, if Trump claimed Mar-a-Lago was worth $1B, the bank would almost certainly have ignored that and substituted their own valuation.  But I believe he claimed like $240M, and FMV estimates were maybe 20-30% below that. My guess is 20% would be on the high side of your typical real estate "fudging", certainly not as egregious as claiming his NY residence was 3X bigger than it was.

DB exec testified it haircut his claim of net worth more than half - to $2.5B from the $5.8B Trump claimed.  So what happens when you overvalue property?  It serves to inflate your equity in that property, which inflates your net worth.  So I don't think Trump's valuations would have led to a lower interest rate with DB.

[*pally*]

Judge rules in the hush money case that jury selection will take place on Apr 15. Trump's request for another delay was denied

[GMDino]

(03-25-2024, 01:04 PM)pally Wrote: profits via fraud is the basis for the money owed.  Whether you agree or not, Trump was found liable for fraud. 

He may win on appeal...he may not.

BUt if he loses, why should he, or any other person found liable, be allowed to benefit from their crime?

And the truth of the matter is that if he loses on appeal he's already shown he doesn't have the money to pay the fine.

[*pally*]

(03-25-2024, 01:15 PM)JustWinBaby Wrote: Trump committed fraud, but the financial benefit is pretty questionable.  It COULD have resulted in a slightly higher interest rate, but that's impossible to determine conclusively.

For example, if Trump claimed Mar-a-Lago was worth $1B, the bank would almost certainly have ignored that and substituted their own valuation.  But I believe he claimed like $240M, and FMV estimates were maybe 20-30% below that. My guess is 20% would be on the high side of your typical real estate "fudging", certainly not as egregious as claiming his NY residence was 3X bigger than it was.

DB exec testified it haircut his claim of net worth more than half - to $2.5B from the $5.8B Trump claimed.  So what happens when you overvalue property?  It serves to inflate your equity in that property, which inflates your net worth.  So I don't think Trump's valuations would have led to a lower interest rate with DB.

Mar a Lago didn't factor into the fine amount.  The biggest contributor was the DC Trump Hotel where it was ruled that his fraudulent numbers won him the initial contract therefore the profit realized when it was sold was gained via fraud

[Luvnit2]

(03-25-2024, 12:53 PM)pally Wrote: so you think Trump should be able to retain money and profits obtained via fraud?

Please name one other person NY has convicted using this statute of fraud with NO VCTIMS.

Do you understand what an appeal is? Should NY get to get one dime if his case is overturned on appeal?

If it is overturned should the Trump organization be entitled to damages and attorney fees from NY?

[Luvnit2]

(03-25-2024, 12:56 PM)JustWinBaby Wrote: Not sure I'd read anything into reducing the bond as an indication of the fairness of the full judgement.  And even if it were, $175M is still a huge loss for Trump.

It is a bond. Next, Trump team appeals. If Trump loses appeal, he still has other appeal options including the Supreme Court? 

You may wonder why the SC would intervene if asked. Simple, read and you will find out this is the first case ever in NY that sued an organization for a victimless crime. The first in history. Why is that? Many say because this case was political and an attempt to interfere in the 2024 election by removing Trump's financial assets.

Many legal experts agree, in time this ruling will be overturned. 

Many financial experts say it will hurt NYC and NY if this is not overturned. Billionaires like Kevin Oleary are on record they are done investing in NY or NYC if this ruling stands. 

[Luvnit2]

(03-25-2024, 01:16 PM)GMDino Wrote: And the truth of the matter is that if he loses on appeal he's already shown he doesn't have the money to pay the fine.

I guess you missed the 3-billion-dollar windfall Trump will receive very soon if he decides to sell all of his shares in Truth Social.

I find it funny liberals' goal is try and pain Trump as not a real billionaire. 

A normal person can have a net worth of 3 million dollars, but unlikely they have liquid (cash on hand) of 30% or 900,000.

The judge valued Mara Lago at 18 million dollars, it is worth over a billion dollars. 2 acre lots are selling for 200 million or 100 million per acre. 

Why did the judge purposely under value it? Simple, it killed his case. Let's see how an appeal court values the properties to see is the kangaroo court judge was accurate. 

[GMDino]

(03-25-2024, 01:37 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I guess you missed the 3-billion-dollar windfall Trump will receive very soon if he decides to sell all of his shares in Truth Social.

I find it funny liberals' goal is try and pain Trump as not a real billionaire. 

A normal person can have a net worth of 3 million dollars, but unlikely they have liquid (cash on hand) of 30% or 900,000.

The judge valued Mara Lago at 18 million dollars, it is worth over a billion dollars. 2 acre lots are selling for 200 million or 100 million per acre. 

Why did the judge purposely under value it? Simple, it killed his case. Let's see how an appeal court values the properties to see is the kangaroo court judge was accurate. 

No, I noted that that money isn't supposed to be available right away.

"Liberals" don't have to prove how much money Trump has or doesn't have.  He's the one who said he doesn't have the money and can't get it.

[GMDino]

(03-25-2024, 01:27 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: It is a bond. Next, Trump team appeals. If Trump loses appeal, he still has other appeal options including the Supreme Court? 

You may wonder why the SC would intervene if asked. Simple, read and you will find out this is the first case ever in NY that sued an organization for a victimless crime. The first in history. Why is that? Many say because this case was political and an attempt to interfere in the 2024 election by removing Trump's financial assets.

Many legal experts agree, in time this ruling will be overturned. 

Many financial experts say it will hurt NYC and NY if this is not overturned. Billionaires like Kevin Oleary are on record they are done investing in NY or NYC if this ruling stands. 

Probably not the SC.

This isn't a federal case.  He'd have to request a federal review and if they deny it I don't think he has a case for the SC.  If I remember what I read over the weekend correctly.

[Luvnit2]

(03-25-2024, 01:15 PM)JustWinBaby Wrote: Trump committed fraud, but the financial benefit is pretty questionable.  It COULD have resulted in a slightly higher interest rate, but that's impossible to determine conclusively.

For example, if Trump claimed Mar-a-Lago was worth $1B, the bank would almost certainly have ignored that and substituted their own valuation.  But I believe he claimed like $240M, and FMV estimates were maybe 20-30% below that. My guess is 20% would be on the high side of your typical real estate "fudging", certainly not as egregious as claiming his NY residence was 3X bigger than it was.

DB exec testified it haircut his claim of net worth more than half - to $2.5B from the $5.8B Trump claimed.  So what happens when you overvalue property?  It serves to inflate your equity in that property, which inflates your net worth.  So I don't think Trump's valuations would have led to a lower interest rate with DB.

It is a known fact every evaluation and loan document Trump submitted had a disclaimer on it stating use your financial statements to value the properties. I have had millions of dollars in loans, the bank uses their own evaluation prior to approval. Many times, they challenged my projections. 

The bank is responsible to complete a full investigation prior to lending any money.

Think of it in simpler terms, you buy a house for $500,000 and need to borrow 90% or $450,000. The bank does an APPRAISAL OF THE HOUSE AND ALSO INSURE NO LIENS AGAINST THE PROPERTY, if it appraised for $500,000 no issues. But if appraised for only $450,000, person needs to come up with an additional $50,000 down payment or sale is not approved. Banks will not lend money without an appraisal.

Again, all banks were paid, not one victim of a crime. First time in NY history a crime without a victim was prosecuted without a jury. Lots of firsts in this case. I feel it gets thrown out at some point. 

[Luvnit2]

(03-25-2024, 01:45 PM)GMDino Wrote: Probably not the SC.

This isn't a federal case.  He'd have to request a federal review and if they deny it I don't think he has a case for the SC.  If I remember what I read over the weekend correctly.

There are many cases in history appealed all the way up to the state supreme court and then appealed to the SC.

The Colorado on the ballot case is an example, the SC overruled the Colorado SC. 

Trump's team argument would be election interference. Would they win and get the SC to hear it is the question.

But lots of appeals all the way to the NY state Supreme court for Trump team. If they lose them all, SC may hear it. 

[GMDino]

(03-25-2024, 01:56 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: There are many cases in history appealed all the way up to the state supreme court and then appealed to the SC.

The Colorado on the ballot case is an example, the SC overruled the Colorado SC. 

Trump's team argument would be election interference. Would they win and get the SC to hear it is the question.

But lots of appeals all the way to the NY state Supreme court for Trump team. If they lose them all, SC may hear it. 

Yeah, that's what I said.  Although probably not.

Of course Trump just said he'd appeal the decision to move forward with the other case on April 15th and he can't appeal that.  It's just a tic with him to say he'll appeal every case he loses.

And he loses a lot of cases.