Brexit Referendum Day

[Bengalzona]

(06-26-2016, 08:00 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Yes and no. The UK has more sovereignty than any other member state. Immigration is the real issue for the UK, the rest of it was just an attempt at masking that, in my opinion. The UK had the best deal in the EU. Other countries could have legitimate other reasons to want to depart, whether is just be the sovereignty given up, or that and an added bonus of not having the political weight that the UK, France, Germany, and a couple of others have to get their own best interests addressed. I know France is on the list, and they are most like the UK in that immigration is the primary issue.

This. Outside of paying money into the EU, the right to free range EU nations without a passport, and an over-sized vote in the EU for a country which never changed to the Euro currency, it is almost like they were never really there. 

The UK and the EU will carry on without each other. And, as I mentioned before, I see the UK having a future relationship with the EU like Norway. 

The bigger question may be, "What are the Scots going to do?"

[SunsetBengal]

(06-26-2016, 08:22 PM)Bengalzona Wrote: This. Outside of paying money into the EU, the right to free range EU nations without a passport, and an over-sized vote in the EU for a country which never changed to the Euro currency, it is almost like they were never really there. 

The UK and the EU will carry on without each other. And, as I mentioned before, I see the UK having a future relationship with the EU like Norway. 

The bigger question may be, "What are the Scots going to do?"

Caber Toss! 

[Bengalzona]

(06-26-2016, 08:27 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Caber Toss! 

I'm up for it!

But make mine a 'small' please. 

[*bfine32*]

(06-26-2016, 08:37 PM)Bengalzona Wrote: I'm up for it!

But make mine a 'small' please. 

Got a hunch that your caper is already small

[Bengalzona]

(06-27-2016, 12:58 AM)bfine32 Wrote: Got a hunch that your caper is already small

"Anybody else feel like a little giggle when I mention my fwiend, Biggus Dickus?"

[Rotobeast]

(06-27-2016, 01:40 PM)Bengalzona Wrote: "Anybody else feel like a little giggle when I mention my fwiend, Biggus Dickus?"

I want to know more about Incontinentia Buttocks.


On topic....

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/06/27/parliament_takes_axe_to_2nd_referendum_petition/

[Belsnickel]

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jun/27/brussels-rejects-boris-johnson-pipe-dream-over-single-market-access?CMP=share_btn_tw

Sounds like even more of the claims by the leave side may be exposed as fallacious thinking.

Quote:European diplomats have dismissed claims from Boris Johnson that the UK could negotiate access to the EU single market without obeying any of the rules.

“You cannot have your cake and eat it,” said an EU diplomat, echoing a phrase the former mayor of London used during the campaign and which looks set to come back to haunt him.

In a further blow to the leave camp’s credibility, Germany’s leading business group distanced itself from Johnson’s suggestion that German business expected Britain’s free trade with Europe to continue seamlessly.

After more than two days of silence following the leave campaign’s stunning victory, Johnson set out his pitch for the UK’s future relationship with the EU in one of his highly lucrative Daily Telegraph columns.

The Brexit leader, who is the favourite to succeed David Cameron as prime minister, claimed that Britain would remain a member of the EU’s single market while introducing a points-based immigration system to limit the right of EU citizens to work in Britain.

British people would still be able to live, travel, study and buy homes on the continent but the same rights would not be automatically extended to EU citizens in the UK, he wrote. Britain would also be freed from sending “a substantial sum of money” to the EU budget, which he said “could” be used for the NHS.

Johnson insisted the only change – “and it will not come in any great rush – is that the UK will extricate itself from the EU’s extraordinary and opaque system of legislation”.

EU diplomats reacted witheringly to the idea that the UK could stay in the single market without following the rules.

“It is a pipe dream,” said the EU diplomat. “You cannot have full access to the single market and not accept its rules. If we gave that kind of deal to the UK, then why not to Australia or New Zealand. It would be a free-for-all.”

A second EU diplomat said: “There are no preferences, there are principles and the principle is ‘no pick and choose’.”

The diplomat stressed that participating in the single market meant accepting EU rules, including the jurisdiction of the European court of justice, monitoring by the European commission and accepting the primacy of EU law over national law – conditions that will be anathema to leave advocates who campaigned on the mantra “take back control”.

“There is no logic of punishment or sanction but the application of the law,” the diplomat said.

A third EU diplomat said the Brexit side had “no clue” what was going on and did not have a plan.

There is also some more about the claims from Johnson regarding the BDI and them calling him out on it.

[Bengalzona]

[Belsnickel]

I think my biggest problem with the whole situation has been a big propaganda machine on both sides pushing out tons of misinformation. Those on the remain side really have no idea how things will shake out economically, which is really their biggest argument. This has never happened before and so it is difficult for economists to accurately predict. On the leave side, they made a lot of claims with no basis for as well. The 350 million quid claim, the immigration claims, all of that stuff is not rooted in fact.

This is why I have a problem with politics these days, because this is becoming the norm. We have access to more information than ever before in the history of mankind yet we fall prey to campaigns designed to take advantage of the naivete and laziness of the average person.

[Rotobeast]

(06-27-2016, 02:34 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I think my biggest problem with the whole situation has been a big propaganda machine on both sides pushing out tons of misinformation. Those on the remain side really have no idea how things will shake out economically, which is really their biggest argument. This has never happened before and so it is difficult for economists to accurately predict. On the leave side, they made a lot of claims with no basis for as well. The 350 million quid claim, the immigration claims, all of that stuff is not rooted in fact.

This is why I have a problem with politics these days, because this is becoming the norm. We have access to more information than ever before in the history of mankind yet we fall prey to campaigns designed to take advantage of the naivete and laziness of the average person.

I guess that's a good cue to share a link that a friend shared with me.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-06-26/civil-uprising-escalates-8th-eu-nation-threatens-referendum

[BengalHawk62]

http://money.cnn.com/2016/06/27/news/economy/brexit-broken-promises/index.html

[Belsnickel]

(06-27-2016, 02:43 PM)Rotobeast Wrote: I guess that's a good cue to share a link that a friend shared with me.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-06-26/civil-uprising-escalates-8th-eu-nation-threatens-referendum

See, I'm actually in favor of these votes. Member states should have periodic votes on whether they will or will not be a part of the EU. I also think the EU needs to rethink how it is going to exist. Trying to make the single market into this government for the continent wasn't the best move. This doesn't mean I am opposed to the EU as a whole, I just think that there should have been a line, and not a fine one, between the European market and the EU.

[Bengalzona]

I just read where the EU is removing English translations from some of their transmittals.

Thanks, Britain!!!

Now, we here in the U.S. won't know what they are saying about us!!!!!1!!!11!!!!

[Rotobeast]

(06-27-2016, 03:16 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: See, I'm actually in favor of these votes. Member states should have periodic votes on whether they will or will not be a part of the EU. I also think the EU needs to rethink how it is going to exist. Trying to make the single market into this government for the continent wasn't the best move. This doesn't mean I am opposed to the EU as a whole, I just think that there should have been a line, and not a fine one, between the European market and the EU.

Totally agree.
The people deserve to be informed of a well defined plan and given the opportunity to make their decision.
Sensationalism and deception have been rolling far too long.

[*bfine32*]

Belsnickle Wrote:I think my biggest problem with the whole situation has been a big propaganda machine on both sides pushing out tons of misinformation. Those on the remain side really have no idea how things will shake out economically, which is really their biggest argument. This has never happened before and so it is difficult for economists to accurately predict. On the leave side, they made a lot of claims with no basis for as well. The 350 million quid claim, the immigration claims, all of that stuff is not rooted in fact.

This is why I have a problem with politics these days, because this is becoming the norm. We have access to more information than ever before in the history of mankind yet we fall prey to campaigns designed to take advantage of the naivete and laziness of the average person.

(06-27-2016, 03:28 PM)Rotobeast Wrote: Totally agree.
The people deserve to be informed of a well defined plan and given the opportunity to make their decision.
Sensationalism and deception have been rolling far too long.

What?!?!?!?! You mean these Brits might make false claims in order to obtain votes.

[*jason*]

(06-27-2016, 03:24 PM)Bengalzona Wrote: I just read where the EU is removing English translations from some of their transmittals.

Thanks, Britain!!!

Now, we here in the U.S. won't know what they are saying about us!!!!!1!!!11!!!!

The immigrant hordes that are flooding our country can translate for us.... ninja face.

[Bengalzona]

(06-27-2016, 04:02 PM)jason Wrote: The immigrant hordes that are flooding our country can translate for us.... ninja face.

But...but.... 

They're not required to learn English. 

Now we'll never know!!!

[Millhouse]

(06-27-2016, 03:24 PM)Bengalzona Wrote: I just read where the EU is removing English translations from some of their transmittals.

Thanks, Britain!!!

Now, we here in the U.S. won't know what they are saying about us!!!!!1!!!11!!!!

Since when do us Americans care what those freeloaders off of our military might think?  

[Rotobeast]

(06-27-2016, 03:56 PM)bfine32 Wrote: What?!?!?!?! You mean these Brits might make false claims in order to obtain votes.

Do you think anyone in The Hague might do such a thing, next ?

[*bfine32*]

(06-23-2016, 12:13 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Huge Soccer fan and I have no idea how leaving the EU would affect English soccer players playing in other countries.

Players from all over the world play throughout Europe. hell, Iceland just advanced in the European Championships and they are not members of the EU.

Hell Iceland just beat England in the Euros.