Corey Dillon asks-all time team

[*bfine32*]

(12-20-2023, 05:16 PM)J24 Wrote: QB- Burrow, Anderson, Boomer
RB- Dillon, Brooks, R.Rohnson, Mixon
FB- Neal
TE-  Holman, Eifert, Tumpy, Gresham
Wr- Chase, C.Johnson, Green, Curtis, Pickens, Housh
OT-Munoz, Anderson,  Whitworth
G- Max M, B.Wiiams, Lap, Zeitler
C- Barham, R.Cook

3T- Geno, Wilkerson,
NT- Krumi, Reader, Peko
E- Bacon, Hendrickson, Dunlap, J.Smith
MLB- L.Wilson, B Simmons, Bill Bergy
WLB- Vontaz, Spikes,
CB- Riley, Parrish,  Joseph, E Thomas,
NB- Hall, Hilton
FS- Bates, Casanova
SS- Fulcher, Nelson

LS- Clark Harris
P- Huber
K-;Pelfry

That's a lot of starters

[*bfine32*]

QB- Boomer Esiason
RB- James Brooks
WR- Chad Johnson
WR- Issac Curtis
WR- Carl Pickens
TE- Dan Ross
LT- GOAT
LG- Andrew Whitworth
C- Bob Johnson
RG- Max Montoya
RT- Willie Anderson
DE- Eddie Edwards
DT- Geno Atkins
DT- Mike Reid
DE- Carlos Dunlap
SLB- Jim LeClair
MLB- Vontaze Burfict
WLB- Reggie Williams
CB- Ken Riley
SS- David Fulcher
FS- Reggie Nelson
CB- LaMar Parrish

[ElkValleyBengal]

(12-20-2023, 07:53 PM)bfine32 Wrote: QB- Boomer Esiason
RB- James Brooks
WR- Chad Johnson
WR- Issac Curtis
WR- Carl Pickens
TE- Dan Ross
LT- GOAT
LG- Andrew Whitworth
C- Bob Johnson
RG- Max Montoya
RT- Willie Anderson
DE- Eddie Edwards
DT- Geno Atkins
DT- Mike Reid
DE- Carlos Dunlap
SLB- Jim LeClair
MLB- Vontaze Burfict
WLB- Reggie Williams
CB- Ken Riley
SS- David Fulcher
FS- Reggie Nelson
CB- LaMar Parrish

That's a pretty strong list. Might change a position or two (maybe Braham or Kozerski at center for example) but nevertheless I"d like to field that team.

[HarleyDog]

(12-20-2023, 05:19 PM)Sled21 Wrote: *&#$ Corey Dillon coming around now acting like he's still part of the family. The man left throwing his equipment into the stands and badmouthed the Bengals for decades. Now that they're winning, he wants to be part of it again. Child please, go away.

The only thing that pisses me off about this is I wasn't one of the fans who caught his things.

[HarleyDog]

(12-20-2023, 07:53 PM)bfine32 Wrote: QB- Boomer Esiason
RB- James Brooks
WR- Chad Johnson
WR- Issac Curtis
WR- Carl Pickens
TE- Dan Ross
LT- GOAT
LG- Andrew Whitworth
C- Bob Johnson
RG- Max Montoya
RT- Willie Anderson
DE- Eddie Edwards
DT- Geno Atkins
DT- Mike Reid
DE- Carlos Dunlap
SLB- Jim LeClair
MLB- Vontaze Burfict
WLB- Reggie Williams
CB- Ken Riley
SS- David Fulcher
FS- Reggie Nelson
CB- LaMar Parrish

Thank you for not putting Collinsworth on that list.

[PDub80]

(12-20-2023, 06:01 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Chase isn't in front of Chad...yet. 

He blows the doors off of Chad in every possible way.

Faster, better after the catch, deep threat, short game, blocking, contested catches, route running, toughness.

I'm not sure which WR skill category Chad is better at? They are both spectacular sideline feet guys, but is chad better? Maybe hands.... but thats a push to me. So is body control.

Chase smokes Chad & AJ.

I would say Chase > TO > AJ > Chad > Curtis > Higgins > Housh > Pickens > Peter Warrick's Potential > Boyd > Collinsworth > Scott

[Clark W Griswold]

(12-20-2023, 07:53 PM)bfine32 Wrote: QB- Boomer Esiason
RB- James Brooks
WR- Chad Johnson
WR- Issac Curtis
WR- Carl Pickens
TE- Dan Ross
LT- GOAT
LG- Andrew Whitworth
C- Bob Johnson
RG- Max Montoya
RT- Willie Anderson
DE- Eddie Edwards
DT- Geno Atkins
DT- Mike Reid
DE- Carlos Dunlap
SLB- Jim LeClair
MLB- Vontaze Burfict
WLB- Reggie Williams
CB- Ken Riley
SS- David Fulcher
FS- Reggie Nelson
CB- LaMar Parrish

I love the Janes Brooks choice even though Dillon was probably better.
I also love Whit as the other G.
You are definitely short-changing the current players.
Most would have Boomer #3 but you could argue that I guess.
You can make an argument for Chad but that’s it. Pickens was tough and fun to watch but not the WR Chase is. No Bengal has ever been that impactful and that big of a HR threat IMO.
With a second or so more time for Burrow, Chase would have caught a SB winning TD.

Also, Dunlap was a good, solid DE for the Bengals but nowhere near the player Hendrickson is. Dunlap never impacted games on a regular basis the way Trey does. He never played at the level Trey has played at for the Bengals.

[KillerGoose]

(12-20-2023, 10:00 PM)PDub80 Wrote: He blows the doors off of Chad in every possible way.

Faster, better after the catch, deep threat, short game, blocking, contested catches, route running, toughness.

I'm not sure which WR skill category Chad is better at? They are both spectacular sideline feet guys, but is chad better? Maybe hands.... but thats a push to me. So is body control.

Chase smokes Chad & AJ.

I would say Chase > TO > AJ > Chad > Curtis > Higgins > Housh > Pickens > Peter Warrick's Potential > Boyd > Collinsworth > Scott

I think there's a case to be made for Chase being better but this is definitely some recency bias. Chad was an ironman and only missed five games due to injury in his 10 seasons in Cincinnati. He played in 96% of games available to him. Chase still has a long way to go in his career, but he has had a shaky start with injuries so far. He has only played in 84% thus far and is set to miss more this season. Chad also did it in a notoriously more physical era. I think it is hard to argue that Chase "blows the doors off Chad" when it comes to toughness. 

I would also claim Chad on route running, but this is a bit of a complex topic that we don't have all the information on because what they do can be dependent on how the defense plays them I.E. man vs. cover 2/quarters/quarters-half etc. Chase is more physical than Chad was, but Chad was exceptionally quick and savvy in getting open. This, I think was Chad's best trait along with his body control, which I would also give to Chad. Throwing an out route to Chad enabled you to throw it at one of the coaches on the bench and it was still a good ball for him with how he could lay out for a catch. Trying to go much deeper, I have no idea. When these guys are running option routes, who is consistently running the correct one for the defense they are seeing? Shit if I know. 

I think Chase cleanly wins when it comes to after the catch ability, contested catches, and his ability to make plays deep. This kind of goes hand-in-hand with his contested catches ability. Chase is so savvy with how he can get away with a push off to create separation right as the ball is arriving. I think he is also a more dynamic athlete than Chad was so once he gets the ball in his hands he is more dangerous in space. Both of them have/had good hands. The easiest thing to do would be to compare dropped passes but there aren't any publicly available resources to use for Chad's career. Chase has a 4.1% drop percentage this year, and a little over 6% for his career (21 drops in three seasons). He is in the upper 1/4 of the league this year, and his career percentage is roughly NFL average.

Chad was a dude, just like Chase is. He has multiple first team AP selections for a reason in a time where he was competing against some all-time greats. Chase very well could be better, but he isn't blowing the doors off him IMO. 

[*bfine32*]

(12-20-2023, 10:28 PM)Clark W Griswold Wrote: I love the Janes Brooks choice even though Dillon was probably better.
I also love Whit as the other G.
You are definitely short-changing the current players.  
Most would have Boomer #3 but you could argue that I guess.  
You can make an argument for Chad but that’s it. Pickens was tough and fun to watch but not the WR Chase is.  No Bengal has ever been that impactful and that big of a HR threat IMO.
With a second or so more time for Burrow, Chase would have caught a SB winning TD.

Also, Dunlap was a good, solid DE for the Bengals but nowhere near the player Hendrickson is. Dunlap never impacted games on a regular basis the way Trey does. He never played at the level Trey has played at for the Bengals.

I gave a lot of credit to longevity. Burrow and Chase may end up being the best QB/WR in Bengal history. I'm just gonna need more than 3-years in the NFL to but them "All-Time"

[*bfine32*]

(12-20-2023, 10:36 PM)KillerGoose Wrote: I think there's a case to be made for Chase being better but this is definitely some recency bias. Chad was an ironman and only missed five games due to injury in his 10 seasons in Cincinnati. He played in 96% of games available to him. Chase still has a long way to go in his career, but he has had a shaky start with injuries so far. He has only played in 84% thus far and is set to miss more this season. Chad also did it in a notoriously more physical era. I think it is hard to argue that Chase "blows the doors off Chad" when it comes to toughness. 

I would also claim Chad on route running, but this is a bit of a complex topic that we don't have all the information on because what they do can be dependent on how the defense plays them I.E. man vs. cover 2/quarters/quarters-half etc. Chase is more physical than Chad was, but Chad was exceptionally quick and savvy in getting open. This, I think was Chad's best trait along with his body control, which I would also give to Chad. Throwing an out route to Chad enabled you to throw it at one of the coaches on the bench and it was still a good ball for him with how he could lay out for a catch. Trying to go much deeper, I have no idea. When these guys are running option routes, who is consistently running the correct one for the defense they are seeing? Shit if I know. 

I think Chase cleanly wins when it comes to after the catch ability, contested catches, and his ability to make plays deep. This kind of goes hand-in-hand with his contested catches ability. Chase is so savvy with how he can get away with a push off to create separation right as the ball is arriving. I think he is also a more dynamic athlete than Chad was so once he gets the ball in his hands he is more dangerous in space. Both of them have/had good hands. The easiest thing to do would be to compare dropped passes but there aren't any publicly available resources to use for Chad's career. Chase has a 4.1% drop percentage this year, and a little over 6% for his career (21 drops in three seasons). He is in the upper 1/4 of the league this year, and his career percentage is roughly NFL average.

Chad was a dude, just like Chase is. He has multiple first team AP selections for a reason in a time where he was competing against some all-time greats. Chase very well could be better, but he isn't blowing the doors off him IMO. 

I think one of the things overlooked about Chad was his durability. I don't think he missed a game due to injury until about year 7-8 and dude took some shots

[Clark W Griswold]

(12-20-2023, 10:37 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I gave a lot of credit to longevity. Burrow and Chase may end up being the best QB/WR in Bengal history. I'm just gonna need more than 3-years in the NFL to but them "All-Time"

I figured but I think accomplishing more than any other players/team in just a few short years overrides longevity. They have done more in a shorter amount of time.
Kind of like Sandy Koufax and Gale Sayers’ careers : )

[Nicomo Cosca]

(12-20-2023, 10:43 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I think one of the things overlooked about Chad was his durability. I don't think he missed a game due to injury until about year 7-8 and dude took some shots

Yeah, Chad was tough as nails. Those Pittsburgh and Baltimore defenses were loaded with HoFers that he was going up against 4x a year.

[wanga]

(12-20-2023, 07:53 PM)bfine32 Wrote: QB- Boomer Esiason
RB- James Brooks
WR- Chad Johnson
WR- Issac Curtis
WR- Carl Pickens
TE- Dan Ross
LT- GOAT
LG- Andrew Whitworth
C- Bob Johnson
RG- Max Montoya
RT- Willie Anderson
DE- Eddie Edwards
DT- Geno Atkins
DT- Mike Reid
DE- Carlos Dunlap
SLB- Jim LeClair
MLB- Vontaze Burfict
WLB- Reggie Williams
CB- Ken Riley
SS- David Fulcher
FS- Reggie Nelson
CB- LaMar Parrish

Nice work

[*jason*]

(12-20-2023, 08:30 PM)HarleyDog Wrote: The only thing that pisses me off about this is I wasn't one of the fans who caught his things.

Yes... Reminds me of the time that asshat Keith Richards threw his guitar pick at me.

[Truck_1_0_1_]

(12-20-2023, 06:18 PM)wcu Wrote: Perhaps Woods or Johnson would have been a more logical or popular choice, but I don't think its crazy talk to have Neal in that spot.  Agree or not, he's considered one of the best pure blocking fullbacks in league history, not just Bengals history.  

I'm sure he's referring to Kyle Cook (and I'm sure you're aware of that too).

I'd probably go with Shayne Graham for best kicker due to his longevity, but hopefully McPherson surpasses him soon.  Evan certainly has made more big kicks for the franchise than any of these other guys.

I did a deep dive a few years ago and not only was Neal overrated, but the HBs he blocked for either did as well or BETTER without him blocking for them.

He also was not a great runner (though he had the one, great, fluke season with... NO, IIRC) and while he had soft hands, he wasn't the best pass catcher either.

Everyone seems to have forgotten about Alstott when talking about FBs, but they remember Neal.

(12-20-2023, 06:35 PM)TecmoBengals Wrote: And your team is? 

Lol lm having trouble copying/pasting my tweet, so I'll post it tomorrow

[BurrowTheGoat]

(12-20-2023, 05:16 PM)J24 Wrote: QB- Burrow, Anderson, Boomer
RB- Dillon, Brooks, R.Rohnson, Mixon
FB- Neal
TE-  Holman, Eifert, Tumpy, Gresham
Wr- Chase, C.Johnson, Green, Curtis, Pickens, Housh
OT-Munoz, Anderson,  Whitworth
G- Max M, B.Wiiams, Lap, Zeitler
C- Barham, R.Cook

3T- Geno, Wilkerson,
NT- Krumi, Reader, Peko
E- Bacon, Hendrickson, Dunlap, J.Smith
MLB- L.Wilson, B Simmons, Bill Bergy
WLB- Vontaz, Spikes,
CB- Riley, Parrish,  Joseph, E Thomas,
NB- Hall, Hilton
FS- Bates, Casanova
SS- Fulcher, Nelson

LS- Clark Harris
P- Huber
K-;Pelfry

PHEW that offensive tackle room is crazy.  Can imagine you run an extra tackle formation and bring Whitworth in off the bench lol (assuming Big Willie starts at RT) 

[No-huddle Joe]

(12-20-2023, 10:00 PM)PDub80 Wrote: He blows the doors off of Chad in every possible way.

Faster, better after the catch, deep threat, short game, blocking, contested catches, route running, toughness.

I'm not sure which WR skill category Chad is better at? They are both spectacular sideline feet guys, but is chad better? Maybe hands.... but thats a push to me. So is body control.

Chase smokes Chad & AJ.

I would say Chase > TO > AJ > Chad > Curtis > Higgins > Housh > Pickens > Peter Warrick's Potential > Boyd > Collinsworth > Scott

No Eddie Brown in there?  He was pretty damn good

[Sled21]

(12-20-2023, 05:32 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Not a single person will support you in this, unless they have similar beef.

He's basically been embraced by the fans and he has gone on the local shows and podcasts, apologised, cleared the air and is VERY much involved with doing stuff again.

He's had a troubled past, but he's moved on and become the alumnus we always wanted him to be.

That's perfectly fine, I'm not looking for support. These are MY feelings towards him.

[Sled21]

(12-20-2023, 06:08 PM)tms Wrote: I hear ya. But at the same time, maybe he's trying to have some fun and show that he still cares about the community, and I wouldn't wanna discourage him (or anyone) from doing that. Probably took him a long time to get to that point. 

Of course, it's possible he just wants to see fans mention his name and if that's the case he can go f___ .... lol  

He knows he's not going to the HOF, so he just wants on the ROH. That's all this is.... and he couldn't even do that without taking shots at other Bengals players. The man is a total douche....

[Sled21]

(12-20-2023, 06:35 PM)tms Wrote: No backups from me. That'd be cheating. I'm going all in with this group.

QB: Burrow - captain
RB: Dillon
FB: Ickey
TE: Holman
WR: Ocho
WR: Chase
LT: Munoz - captain
LG: Kozerski
C: Karras! (I never saw Bob Johnson play)
RG: Montoya
RT: Big Willie

DE: Hendrickson
1T: Reader - captain
3T: Atkins
DE: J. Smith
MLB: L. Wilson
OLB: Reggie Williams - captain
CB: Riley
CB: Parrish
NB: Hilton - captain
FS: Bates
SS: Fulcher

K: Mac
P: Huber - captain

KR: T. Mack
PR: Pac

I love me some Ted Karras, but Rich Braham definitely also belongs in front of him.