Eminem destroys Trump

[Belsnickel]

(10-13-2017, 10:25 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I just literally laughed out loud while reading that.

I laughed, and then immediately thought of Idiocracy. I feel like this is how that world would have started.

[*jason*]

(10-13-2017, 10:24 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: I saw something on Twitter, a headline that said something like "Senate candidate Kid Rock fires back at Eminem for his rap lambasting President Trump" or something to that effect. The commentary on it was "Imagine trying to explain this to someone in 2006."

I'm having a hard time digesting it in 2017. Kid Rock probably will win if he runs. Who do we blame for this? Jesse "the Body" Ventura?


I'm tellin' ya... Oprah's running for president in 2020.

Meanwhile, Nero fiddles away.

[Benton]

(10-13-2017, 10:22 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I just had to point this out. That sounds exactly like the wording someone would use so people can say "it's not a tax!" and be technically correct.

Just like calling it a "waste treatment facility" doesn't make your job less about dealing with poop water, calling it a "surcharge" doesn't make it less of a tax. Lol

Whoever started the misinformation changed it to a tax because everyone pays taxes; not everyone pays surcharges. It was more misinformation designed to get people angry at one side instead of the other.

That’s part of the problem. People say ‘well, It’s close to the truth. And I don’t like the truth, I prefer truth adjacent, sooooo....,

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(10-13-2017, 11:11 AM)Benton Wrote: Whoever started the misinformation changed it to a tax because everyone pays taxes;  not everyone pays surcharges. It was more misinformation designed to get people angry at one side instead of the other.

That’s part of the problem. People say ‘well, It’s close to the truth. And I don’t like the truth, I prefer truth adjacent, sooooo....,

Except more people pay phone surcharges than people pay income taxes.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/beltway/2015/10/06/new-estimates-of-how-many-households-pay-no-federal-income-tax/#5ec0c42261cb
Estimated 45.3% of households don't pay federal income taxes.


http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/06/06/cell-phone-ownership-hits-91-of-adults/
Estimated 91% of adults own a cell phone.


So more people pay phone "surcharges" than federal income taxes. Not even counting the fact that a large number of minors own cellphones which have "surcharges" too. Far more people pay a phone surcharge than any tax around... so I question the real distinction between the two.

[GMDino]

(10-13-2017, 11:11 AM)Benton Wrote: Whoever started the misinformation changed it to a tax because everyone pays taxes;  not everyone pays surcharges. It was more misinformation designed to get people angry at one side instead of the other.

That’s part of the problem. People say ‘well, It’s close to the truth. And I don’t like the truth, I prefer truth adjacent, sooooo....,

(10-13-2017, 11:31 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Except more people pay phone surcharges than people pay income taxes.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/beltway/2015/10/06/new-estimates-of-how-many-households-pay-no-federal-income-tax/#5ec0c42261cb
Estimated 45.3% of households don't pay federal income taxes.


http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/06/06/cell-phone-ownership-hits-91-of-adults/
Estimated 91% of adults own a cell phone.


So more people pay phone "surcharges" than federal income taxes. Not even counting the fact that a large number of minors own cellphones which have "surcharges" too. Far more people pay a phone surcharge than any tax around... so I question the real distinction between the two.

Everyone knows what a tax is...most don't even look at their phone bill to figure out what surcharge they are paying.

But Benton didn't say "income tax"...he said taxes.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(10-13-2017, 11:35 AM)GMDino Wrote: Everyone knows what a tax is...most don't even look at their phone bill to figure out what surcharge they are paying.

But Benton didn't say "income tax"...he said taxes.

And most people don't look at their receipts find out how much of what they paid was sales tax. That doesn't make it less of a tax.

Yes, he said everyone pays taxes, not everyone pays surcharges, but that's not a true distinction. Not everyone pays income tax, not everyone pays property tax, if you only buy groceries, you don't pay sales tax. That doesn't stop them from being taxes.

Surcharge is just a BS word for tax.

[Belsnickel]

(10-13-2017, 11:48 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: And most people don't look at their receipts find out how much of what they paid was sales tax. That doesn't make it less of a tax.

Yes, he said everyone pays taxes, not everyone pays surcharges, but that's not a true distinction. Not everyone pays income tax, not everyone pays property tax, if you only buy groceries, you don't pay sales tax. That doesn't stop them from being taxes.

Surcharge is just a BS word for tax.

To the bold, not true, everywhere. We have a sales tax on groceries in Virginia.

[GMDino]

(10-13-2017, 11:48 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: And most people don't look at their receipts find out how much of what they paid was sales tax. That doesn't make it less of a tax.

Yes, he said everyone pays taxes, not everyone pays surcharges, but that's not a true distinction. Not everyone pays income tax, not everyone pays property tax, if you only buy groceries, you don't pay sales tax. That doesn't stop them from being taxes.

Surcharge is just a BS word for tax.

All the rest aside that's exactly what Benton said.  

Ask the average Joe if they pay taxes and they'll all say yes even if they don't how much or how many.  Most probably don't even know what a surcharge is.

Now, when PA had a GOP Gov. he promised to never raise taxes...but he raised every charge in the state from driver's licences to auto inspection to anything he could get his hands on.  And we all knew this was a different way to collect the tax revenues.

But he never raised taxes.

Until right before he lost and left office and instituted, with the help of the GOP controlled legislature, a series of gas taxes on the gas companies...not the consumer.  Because those never get handed down to the end user.  

[Benton]

(10-13-2017, 11:48 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Surcharge is just a BS word for tax.

I’m not arguing the difference in taxes and surcharges. Only trying to explain why (most likely) the propaganda changed it from “surcharges” to “tax.” People are trained to get angry over taxes. Many people lump surcharge in with fees. It also makes it a broader issue as — like I said — everyone pays taxes, only users pay surcharges.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(10-13-2017, 11:50 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: To the bold, not true, everywhere. We have a sales tax on groceries in Virginia.

Fair enough, I will admit I forgot that a couple states do that. I've never lived in a state where they did.

(10-13-2017, 11:58 AM)GMDino Wrote: All the rest aside that's exactly what Benton said.  

1. Ask the average Joe if they pay taxes and they'll all say yes even if they don't how much or how many.  Most probably don't even know what a surcharge is.

Now, when PA had a GOP Gov. he promised to never raise taxes...but he raised every charge in the state from driver's licences to auto inspection to anything he could get his hands on. 2. And we all knew this was a different way to collect the tax revenues.

But he never raised taxes.

Until right before he lost and left office and instituted, with the help of the GOP controlled legislature, a series of gas taxes on the gas companies...not the consumer.  3. Because those never get handed down to the end user.  

1. So lying, using misleading terms, and taking advantage of ignorance makes it okay to not consider it a tax?

2. Yeah, and that's shady AF. Might as well mug you and say "at least I didn't raise taxes!" If a person did that where I lived, I would have seen about getting that person out of office as soon as possible be it petition or the next election. The benefit of me prioritizing my interests over party loyalty.

3. Yeah, could never imagine how consumers would end up paying for that. Lol

[GMDino]

(10-13-2017, 12:09 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Fair enough, I will admit I forgot that a couple states do that. I've never lived in a state where they did.



1. So lying, using misleading terms, and taking advantage of ignorance makes it okay to not consider it a tax?

2. Yeah, and that's shady AF. Might as well mug you and say "at least I didn't raise taxes!" If a person did that where I lived, I would have seen about getting that person out of office as soon as possible be it petition or the next election. The benefit of me prioritizing my interests over party loyalty.

3. Yeah, could never imagine how consumers would end up paying for that. Lol

Oh don't get me wrong its horrible and shady and I hate it!  LOL!

But the former gov did that as a little going away gift after he lost the election and the GOP signed right off on.  PA has the worst gas taxes in the country.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(10-13-2017, 12:25 PM)GMDino Wrote: Oh don't get me wrong its horrible and shady and I hate it!  LOL!

But the former gov did that as a little going away gift after he lost the election and the GOP signed right off on.  PA has the worst gas taxes in the country.

Yeah, the whole practice of law-bombing your successor if they're part of the "other team" is pretty awful, but I don't really know how you'd go about fixing it.

That governor screwed over the next one by jacking up gas taxes before leaving so it seems to be on the successor. Obama did that departmental intelligence sharing thing right before he left office which led to all the leaks. Trump will almost certainly do something awful right before he exits office, too.

Back on the topic of taxes, though.. I am of the mind that they need to vastly simplify the tax system anyway. Something like a flat 15% income tax (regardless of the source), 10% to Federal, 4% to State, 1% to Local. Done. Nothing else. No deductions, no loopholes, no property tax, no gas tax. Just figure a way to make it work within the budget, even if it means large cuts to services.

They keep adding more and more taxes and surcharges, and never less it seems. The first solution to budget shortfalls always seems to be a new tax/surcharge/fee, not cuts.

[*michaelsean*]

(10-13-2017, 11:50 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: To the bold, not true, everywhere. We have a sales tax on groceries in Virginia.

"Cause you hate poor people?

[Belsnickel]

(10-13-2017, 02:12 PM)michaelsean Wrote: "Cause you hate poor people?

Yes, this is true.

[JustWinBaby]

(10-13-2017, 11:58 AM)GMDino Wrote: ...a series of gas taxes on the gas companies...not the consumer.  Because those never get handed down to the end user.  

Yes, taxes trickle down.  Oddly, that's never stopped anyone on the left from calling for tax increases on the rich and corporations....because those taxes never get passed on down to the little guy.

[ballsofsteel]

Kid *ock, Ted poop pants Nugent and Sarah Palin. = axis of stupidity. Drumph supporters.

[StoneTheCrow]

(10-16-2017, 07:57 PM)ballsofsteel Wrote: Kid *ock, Ted poop pants Nugent and Sarah Palin. = axis of stupidity. Drumph supporters.

Ted poop pants Nugent. Those stupid drumph supporters would never have been able to come up with brilliance like that.

Rock rhymes with *ock? I hope you don’t let shit like that out for free. Eminem should sign you to Shady Records.

[*jason*]

(10-16-2017, 08:18 PM)StoneTheCrow Wrote: Ted poop pants Nugent. Those stupid drumph supporters would never have been able to come up with brilliance like that.

Rock rhymes with *ock? I hope you don’t let shit like that out for free. Eminem should sign you to Shady Records.

Let me go now....

Sarah Palin got the ol' "hit it, and quit it" treatment from Glen Rice.

[BmorePat87]

I thought it was lame

[*jason*]

(10-17-2017, 11:17 AM)BmorePat87 Wrote: I thought it was lame

It was.

I'm certainly no Trump supporter, conservative, alt guy or whatever, but the constant backlash toward Trump is starting to irritate me as much as he does.