Europe and Muslim Immigrants

[StLucieBengal]

(03-15-2016, 08:20 PM)Benton Wrote: 1. No. If you don't have a ssn, you don't get govt aide. Yes, there are a few loop holes. That's an overwhelming minority of minorities.
2a. Ok, ill take your word for it that you polled every bellarussian you met on the cost of immigrating to the us. Guess you got me there.
2b this is a dumb statement. I don't normally try to be that undiplomatic, but telling someone who lives on less than $2 a day to save up tens of thousands to come here? That's just dumb. Without some sort of mechanism in place that would limit all immigrants to a handful of countries.

and that's really the point, right? Handful of Europeans, some Russians?


3. Immigration law? You're complaining because people who dont want to follow immigration laws want to come to a country founded on breaking emigration laws?

4. Who was president in 2001?

They send their kids to public school right? That's gov aid.

Handful of Russians? In Belarus typical monthly salary is $250. Yet they still manage to save to follow the immigration laws. I don't know the income levels of all nations but I do know that "Russians" don't make much, so if they manage to get the money together they spend to make a better life.

Now if it isn't about poor people and more about how you think we need more non Europeans/Russians around here then just admit that for you its all about colour... Personally I don't care where they come from as log as they follow the laws and apply legally.

[GMDino]

(03-15-2016, 08:12 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: They are in trouble with the law.    They are here illegally.  

Why should they get funding over people who are actively trying to do it the legal way?    

How about send these law breakers home and use the money to fund legal applicants.  These illegals can go home and get in line legally.    Then of the money is there when it's there time they can get some benefit.  

My sister in law has been trying to come legally for while now.    Why shouldn't she get any help?   She hasn't broken any laws and followed the law to the letter.    She would be a better citizen just based on her ability to not break the law.

And the drug dealer contributed to society as well.    So should his crimes be wiped aside as well?

How about they both get funding?

Rather they waste money chasing them down and whatever.

[StLucieBengal]

(03-15-2016, 08:55 PM)GMDino Wrote: How about they both get funding?

Rather they waste money chasing them down and whatever.

In my example they would both get funding.   They just go home to apply.  

Then no one has to round them up and pay that cost.    If they have to be rounded up then they get no money and wait 10 years.  Then it's just reloading the very popular Eisenhower program.... Operation wetback.    Supported widely by unions.  
Actually one of the things I like about trump, he will reactivate that program.

[GMDino]

(03-15-2016, 09:06 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: In my example they would both get funding.   They just go home to apply.  

Then no one has to round them up and pay that cost.    If they have to be rounded up then they get no money and wait 10 years.  Then it's just reloading the very popular Eisenhower program.... Operation wetback.    Supported widely by unions.  
Actually one of the things I like about trump, he will reactivate that program.

Why break up a family or make a person lose their income if you are going to put them through the system anyway?  That's waste of time and resources.

[StLucieBengal]

(03-15-2016, 09:09 PM)GMDino Wrote: Why break up a family or make a person lose their income if you are going to put them through the system anyway?  That's waste of time and resources.

How is that breaking up a family? They all move . They all apply.

And on wasting resources..... What sacrifice are these people making? They came here lived a great life while breaking the law.... So now they get to be citizens with zero sacrifice? How is that even appropriate?

[GMDino]

(03-15-2016, 09:18 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: How is that breaking up a family?  They all move .  They all apply.  

And on wasting resources.....   What sacrifice are these people making?   They came here lived a great life while breaking the law....   So now they get to be citizens with zero sacrifice?     How is that even appropriate?

I just wonder what it is like in your head.  Where living hear illegally is a piece of cake and moving a family member (or an entire family) out of the country is no big deal vs trying to get them legal.

In another thread we are talking about compassion and morals and whether they come from a god/religion or not.

Too often I see people who claim to believe in god/religion and have no compassion for their fellow man because of man's laws.

To me it is a damn shame.

[StLucieBengal]

(03-15-2016, 09:22 PM)GMDino Wrote: I just wonder what it is like in your head.  Where living hear illegally is a piece of cake and moving a family member (or an entire family) out of the country is no big deal vs trying to get them legal.

In another thread we are talking about compassion and morals and whether they come from a god/religion or not.

Too often I see people who claim to believe in god/religion and have no compassion for their fellow man because of man's laws.

To me it is a damn shame.

I had to move my wife back to Belarus for a little bit to move our file forward. I know the costs involved. I also know that you do what you have to do to follow the laws.

Compassion is great. And we are showing compassion by allowing them to apply after they have broken the laws.

Compassion and morals don't allow us break laws as we see fit with zero consequence. The piper always gets paid in the end. You can't and shouldn't be able to cheat him. We are all responsible for the consequences of our own actions.

[GMDino]

(03-15-2016, 09:51 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: I had to move my wife back to Belarus for a little bit to move our file forward.   I know the costs involved.    I also know that you do what you have to do to follow the laws.    

Compassion is great.    And we are showing compassion by allowing them to apply after they have broken the laws.  

Compassion and morals don't allow us break laws as we see fit with zero consequence.    The piper always gets paid in the end.   You can't and shouldn't be able to cheat him.     We are all responsible for the consequences of our own actions.

The man who steals a fish because his family is starving and the man who steals his clients' retirement because he wants more money are both breaking laws.

Would you punish them the same?

[StLucieBengal]

(03-15-2016, 10:10 PM)GMDino Wrote: The man who steals a fish because his family is starving and the man who steals his clients' retirement because he wants more money are both breaking laws.

Would you punish them the same?

Yes. Just because you think you have a good reason to break a law doesn't mean you can just do it..... I have a legitimate reason to not pay taxes. However if I do that I will be in jail. If we start picking and choosing which laws we follow and which we don't then where will that put us? A person will always find a justification to break a law. They don't become a criminal until they knowingly break a law.

[GMDino]

(03-15-2016, 10:15 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Yes.  Just because you think you have a good reason to break a law doesn't mean you can just do it.....      I have a legitimate reason to not pay taxes.     However if I do that I will be in jail.     If we start picking and choosing which laws we follow and which we don't then where will that put us?    A person will always find a justification to break a law.    They don't become a criminal until they knowingly break a law.

I didn't ask if one should not be punished.  I asked if you would punish them the same.

Your answer is telling.

That is the difference between true compassion and what you think.

[StLucieBengal]

(03-15-2016, 10:19 PM)GMDino Wrote: I didn't ask if one should not be punished.  I asked if you would punish them the same.

Your answer is telling.

That is the difference between true compassion and what you think.

So if you have a good reason then you should get less punishment for a crime?

I don't want to pay taxes anymore. So I can use the money on my kids. So for my punishment I will accept counseling for 6 months.

[GMDino]

(03-15-2016, 10:33 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: So if you have a good reason then you should get less punishment for a crime?    

I don't want to pay taxes anymore.   So I can use the money on my kids.   So for my punishment I will accept counseling for 6 months.

It is always about money...that says a lot.

You don't want to understand.  That's OK.  We're off topic.

Moving on.

[StLucieBengal]

(03-15-2016, 11:10 PM)GMDino Wrote: It is always about money...that says a lot.

You don't want to understand.  That's OK.  We're off topic.

Moving on.

Lol if these criminals didn't know they were breaking the law all these years then you would have a leg to stand on. But they knew and kept on knowing all along. Until they get caught.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(03-15-2016, 08:23 PM)fredtoast Wrote: How do they get the EIC if they don't file taxes?

It's an Obama thing.

Under Obama's temporary amnesty program (all done via Executive order) is allowing millions to get a work Permit and that gives them a SSN. Once they have an SSN, they can go back and file taxes for the past 3 years and if they qualify (which most do) they can also claim EIC.

[fredtoast]

(03-16-2016, 01:22 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: It's an Obama thing.

Under Obama's temporary amnesty program (all done via Executive order) is allowing millions to get a work Permit and that gives them a SSN. Once they have an SSN, they can go back and file taxes for the past 3 years and if they qualify (which most do) they can also claim EIC.

Wait.  What?

So what about all that squealing about how none of them could legally work or file taxes?  I thought they were all working illegally and paying zero taxes?

I am confused now.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(03-15-2016, 03:51 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Right, because a Mexican child educated in the United States could never accomplish anything greater than being a greeter at Wal Mart.

And I thought your argument all along was that they were ALREADY getting all of these benefits.

If you would learn to read posts in their entirety and quote them correctly, you might not get so confused in conversations.

yes Anchor babies that get educated in the US can be more than Wal-Mart greeters, how ever, my comment is referring to the millions of illegal adults that were not US educated and if we offered them amnesty of some kind, then they would be a bigger drain on the Welfare system and that the US would not gain anything positive from their taxes vs the amount we have to pay for them being able to collect our generous government benefits.

So they government will never truly offer this group of illegals amnesty until we are absolutely forced to.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(03-15-2016, 09:09 PM)GMDino Wrote: Why break up a family or make a person lose their income if you are going to put them through the system anyway?  That's waste of time and resources.

Good idea, maybe I'll ask my filpino friend why he has to go back home for a year while his family (wife and daughter) stays here?

Silly me, how could I forget, he wants to become a legal US Citizen and that is part of the process.

[fredtoast]

(03-16-2016, 02:40 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: yes Anchor babies that get educated in the US can be more than Wal-Mart greeters, how ever, my comment is referring to the millions of illegal adults that were not US educated and if we offered them amnesty of some kind, then they would be a bigger drain on the Welfare system and that the US would not gain anything positive from their taxes vs the amount we have to pay for them being able to collect our generous government benefits.

Except this is pretty much all in your imagination.  Many immigrants work hard in construction, lawn care, agriculture, and many other jobs.  They are all not just sitting around 100% living on government benefits.

[fredtoast]

(03-16-2016, 03:07 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Good idea, maybe I'll ask my filpino friend why he has to go back home for a year while his family (wife and daughter) stays here?

Silly me, how could I forget, he wants to become a legal US Citizen and that is part of the process.

Why don't you ask him if it is a good idea that he has to do that.

That was the question that was asked of you and you refused to answer.

[StLucieBengal]

(03-16-2016, 03:07 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Good idea, maybe I'll ask my filpino friend why he has to go back home for a year while his family (wife and daughter) stays here?

Silly me, how could I forget, he wants to become a legal US Citizen and that is part of the process.

Spot on post.

I honestly wish some of you (not mike) who are just casual observers of the immigration process. Please do some homework and talk to people who have done this process or even go to visa journey and get some info for yourselves. You can disregard this as a post from st Lucie and stay uninformed or you can take a little time and read up on the expierences from their forum if you don't believe me or even mike.