FBI executes search warrant at Mar-A-Lago

[StrictlyBiz]

Well, it was certainly fun going back and reading this thread.

Quite a few who talked a lot back in August are eerily silent now.

[Belsnickel]

(01-16-2023, 04:50 PM)StrictlyBiz Wrote: Well, it was certainly fun going back and reading this thread.

Quite a few who talked a lot back in August are eerily silent now.

What's to talk about at this point? Biden is under investigation and no one is really arguing against that.

[*Nately120*]

(01-16-2023, 06:57 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: What's to talk about at this point? Biden is under investigation and no one is really arguing against that.

Amusingly enough, between the Trump documents snafu and the Biden one I had to take my yearly training on various types of classified document mishandling and protocol for recovery etc.  As usual, Biden's way of doing things is far more status quo than Trump who really took things up to 11.

Same ol' same ol, isn't it?

[BengalYankee]

(01-16-2023, 06:57 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: What's to talk about at this point? Biden is under investigation and no one is really arguing against that.

DOJ & FBI

[*Nately120*]

(01-16-2023, 04:50 PM)StrictlyBiz Wrote: Well, it was certainly fun going back and reading this thread.

Quite a few who talked a lot back in August are eerily silent now.

Seems to me like the political party of "Just stop resisting" is intentionally ignoring the different responses to this stuff by Hillary/Biden compared to Trump.

Also, it's boring bureaucratic stuff, but there are different types of, protocols for, and responses to the mishandling of the various levels of classified information. If I leave CUI on a cleared printer too long that doesn't make me Chelsea Manning, but I digress.

Also again, people tossing these incidents into the same bucket are probably infuriating the people who want to move from Trump to DeSantis more than anyone else.

[StrictlyBiz]

(01-19-2023, 11:13 AM)Nately120 Wrote: Seems to me like the political party of "Just stop resisting" is intentionally ignoring the different responses to this stuff by Hillary/Biden compared to Trump.

Their responses to this stuff is different and noteworthy. 

Their having this stuff is exactly the same. 

I see a narrative that conflates the two. 

[*Nately120*]

(01-19-2023, 09:29 PM)StrictlyBiz Wrote: Their responses to this stuff is different and noteworthy. 

Their having this stuff is exactly the same. 

I see a narrative that conflates the two. 

We don't know it is the same.  We may be looking at a case of spillage versus a case of espionage.  You're free to place them in any pile you wish, but this is why investigations take place rather than people just claiming "planted!" or "corrupt FBI!" or "banana republic!" and so on.  I'm not saying you are saying those things, but some people who are unfortunately very important have said them.

People are free to conflate though, I can see why it'd be nice to just say Biden and Trump both need to piss off and go into exile but we both know that hain't gonna happen.

[Belsnickel]

I was listening to a news story about this whole situation and it was very interesting. Apparently, the whole way the Presidential Records Act makes administrations handle their documents actually increases the risk of mishandling of classified information. In addition, the way there is a reliance on paper for these documents is also an issue. For instance, the PDB has long been printed and delivered, but Obama opted for an iPad that contained the information. This option was actually more secure and provided fewer opportunities for the mishandling of the information.

One former official, I forget which one, discussed stories of a number of folks who would retire and eventually find classified materials in their box. They would handle it by calling the local office and having them pick it up. Considered no harm no foul, and this is much like how the Biden team handled it. There was also discussion of someone taking a binder of 30-40 unclassified documents home after work to read some more, not realizing that in the appendices there was a classified page.

All of this goes to what I have been saying which is that the way in which the two president's handled these situations after discovery of the documents is what makes all the difference here.

[*Nately120*]

(01-20-2023, 08:11 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: I was listening to a news story about this whole situation and it was very interesting. Apparently, the whole way the Presidential Records Act makes administrations handle their documents actually increases the risk of mishandling of classified information. In addition, the way there is a reliance on paper for these documents is also an issue. For instance, the PDB has long been printed and delivered, but Obama opted for an iPad that contained the information. This option was actually more secure and provided fewer opportunities for the mishandling of the information.

One former official, I forget which one, discussed stories of a number of folks who would retire and eventually find classified materials in their box. They would handle it by calling the local office and having them pick it up. Considered no harm no foul, and this is much like how the Biden team handled it. There was also discussion of someone taking a binder of 30-40 unclassified documents home after work to read some more, not realizing that in the appendices there was a classified page.

All of this goes to what I have been saying which is that the way in which the two president's handled these situations after discovery of the documents is what makes all the difference here.

That would also explain why the first few months of the whole Trump document issue involved a whole lotta "Hey, just give those things back and we'll move on with our lives, ok?" from the government. 

[CarolinaBengalFanGuy]

Well I was going to ask why we didn't have a Biden document blah blah thread but we just lumped them all together lol

[Dill]

(01-19-2023, 09:29 PM)StrictlyBiz Wrote: Their responses to this stuff is different and noteworthy. 

Their having this stuff is exactly the same. 

I see a narrative that conflates the two. 

I don't see any kind of logical, fact-based narrative which can conflate the two.

So whom would narrative "conflation" serve here? 

Certainly not the side of the guy who returned documents he found, in contrast
to the guy who fought to keep his stolen docs and attempted to deceive the National Archives and the FBI. 

[Dill]

(01-20-2023, 08:11 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: All of this goes to what I have been saying which is that the way in which the two president's handled these situations after discovery of the documents is what makes all the difference here.

Seems like we have two standards of justice in the U.S.:

One for people who commit crimes and another for people who don't.

It's like Biden has "weaponized" DOJ to go after criminals. 

[StrictlyBiz]

(01-19-2023, 09:49 PM)Nately120 Wrote: We don't know it is the same.  We may be looking at a case of spillage versus a case of espionage.  You're free to place them in any pile you wish, but this is why investigations take place rather than people just claiming "planted!" or "corrupt FBI!" or "banana republic!" and so on.  I'm not saying you are saying those things, but some people who are unfortunately very important have said them.

The only one that I saw claiming that they were planted is the same guy who thought that Guam was going to capsize if it became too populated. I guess he's important (and sane) in the same way the Majorie Taylor Green is.  

[*Nately120*]

(01-21-2023, 05:35 PM)StrictlyBiz Wrote: The only one that I saw claiming that they were planted is the same guy who thought that Guam was going to capsize if it became too populated. I guess he's important (and sane) in the same way the Majorie Taylor Green is.  

Trump suggested they we're planted.  

[jmccracky]

(01-21-2023, 05:54 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Trump suggested they we're planted.  

Yup. And the DOJ gave him and his lawyers until September 30th to present their case of the planted evidence, since Trump was the one making that assertion. It's shocking, I tell ya, that Trump and his lawyers didn't present the evidence. But hey, one side did this and one side did that. Ugh. 

[StrictlyBiz]

(01-21-2023, 05:54 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Trump suggested they we're planted.  

Well that shows you how much attention I pay to Trump. 

I didn't see it. I just looked briefly on line and still didn't see it, but I a found another esteemed member of the press, Joy Behar, also thinks they were planted. 

[*Nately120*]

(01-22-2023, 09:53 AM)StrictlyBiz Wrote: Well that shows you how much attention I pay to Trump. 

I didn't see it. I just looked briefly on line and still didn't see it, but I a found another esteemed member of the press, Joy Behar, also thinks they were planted. 

Well one of the people you mentioned in your post was president, and is going to pretty much determine who wins in 2024.  Bogus, eh?


EDIT - Also, polls 2 years out should be taken with a grain of salt and all, but Biden having this document snafu may actually help him get re-elected, because that's how nuts our politics is. Biden matches up better vs Trump in 2024 than DeSantis, but the right-wing media's ability to spin that Biden's case is comparable to Trump's has so far helped take a major strike against Trump off the table.

So this can actually lead to the GOP primary going with Trump, a guy who like Walker and Lake and Oz has a better chance of winning the primary but a lesser chance of winning the national election.

Biden may have blundered his way into a much easier path to victory in 2024.

[*pally*]

Now there have been documents found at Mike Pence's home in Indiana.

Trump's problem remains the fact that he refused to return them when asked. And then his lawyer lied in an affidavit about having returned them all.

[basballguy]

(01-24-2023, 04:39 PM)pally Wrote: Now there have been documents found at Mike Pence's home in Indiana.

Trump's problem remains the fact that he refused to return them when asked. And then his lawyer lied in an affidavit about having returned them all.

Shit the way this is going they might find documents in our houses next.  

[*Nately120*]

(01-24-2023, 05:06 PM)basballguy Wrote: Shit the way this is going they might find documents in our houses next.  

You have to pass a costly and stringent background check to even be admitted access into an area where even the lowest levels of classification are held...well, unless people vote you into office in which case your background doesn't matter.