Faith

[Beaker]

(09-05-2015, 11:36 AM)PhilHos Wrote: Two things: say religious extremists (or some variation) and don't say they "always" do something.

That would be true if what he said was just coming from the extremists.  But I hear that from my "regularly" religious friends frequently too. So his comment was pretty on target.

[*rfaulk34*]

(09-05-2015, 08:58 AM)BmorePat87 Wrote: My biggest beef with religious people is that they always try to play the martyr. 

Sweeping generalizations are always a good point to argue from. 

[*rfaulk34*]

(09-05-2015, 11:41 AM)BmorePat87 Wrote: "Extremists" it is, then. The issue is I don't lump people who are devote in their faith but don't shove it down other's throats with those who I am referring to. So when I typed that out, I am not thinking to specify in my post because I know what I mean. It's a bad habit in an informal setting like a message board, and obviously one that can leave me with egg on my face.

[xxlt]

(09-04-2015, 10:51 AM)Rotobeast Wrote: Not very high, because it's technically a learned behavior.
I suppose if you want to subscribe to the "God Gene" theory,  you might have some traction.

It seems lots of mental illness is arguably learned: antisocial personality disorder, paranoia, alcoholism, borderline personality disorder, agoraphobia, arachnophobia... Chemical imbalances in the brain can't be learned, but it seems much of what constitutes mental illness is based on behavioral criteria, and thus could be learned.

[*PhilHos*]

(09-05-2015, 01:24 PM)Beaker Wrote: That would be true if what he said was just coming from the extremists.  But I hear that from my "regularly" religious friends frequently too. So his comment was pretty on target.

They ALWAYS cry martyr or play the victim card? I have a hard time believing that.

[Beaker]

(09-05-2015, 06:46 PM)PhilHos Wrote: They ALWAYS cry martyr or play the victim card? I have a hard time believing that.

Frequently....as I said.

[*PhilHos*]

(09-06-2015, 12:30 AM)Beaker Wrote: Frequently....as I said.

Okay, but Bmore said "always". Always does NOT = frequently. Ergo, his comments were NOT "on target". 

And, honestly, if your religious friends do play the martyr frequently, then chances are they're actually one of those religious extremists I mentioned.

[BmorePat87]

(09-06-2015, 10:23 AM)PhilHos Wrote: Okay, but Bmore said "always". Always does NOT = frequently. Ergo, his comments were NOT "on target". 

And, honestly, if your religious friends do play the martyr frequently, then chances are they're actually one of those religious extremists I mentioned.

I corrected myself on the label we'll use to describe this group, but I stand by my hyperbole as we all understood its use for dramatic effect.

[Beaker]

(09-06-2015, 10:23 AM)PhilHos Wrote: Okay, but Bmore said "always". Always does NOT = frequently. Ergo, his comments were NOT "on target". 

And, honestly, if your religious friends do play the martyr frequently, then chances are they're actually one of those religious extremists I mentioned.

Frequently is close enough to always to be "on target" in my opinion. And no, the folks that I'm referring to are nowhere near extremists. So I stand by my comment. The "war on christians" subject tends to come up with them often...especially when talking news or politics.

[fredtoast]

(09-05-2015, 06:46 PM)PhilHos Wrote: They ALWAYS cry martyr or play the victim card? I have a hard time believing that.

That is all some of us hear.

I am sure that when you all get together you talk about other things, but pretty much 100% of the time I see a religious person on the national media they are crying about how their religious freedoms are under attack.  It usually bubbles over around Christmas time, but with the issue of same sex marriage dominating the news it has been pretty constant for months now.

[Blutarsky]

(09-06-2015, 12:27 PM)Beaker Wrote: Frequently is close enough to always to be "on target" in my opinion. And no, the folks that I'm referring to are nowhere near extremists. So I stand by my comment. The "war on christians" subject tends to come up with them often...especially when talking news or politics.

To you they are not extremists because you are rational, but to many a flaming liberal any Christian that would go so far as to allege that there is a war on Christianity is an "extremist".

[GMDino]

(09-03-2015, 02:42 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Showed up for me this morning.  Been praying my friends wife's cancer would go into remission and it has ...  Just got the good news earlier.

Just curious:  Was she also going to treatment or just having people pray for her?

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(09-03-2015, 02:42 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Showed up for me this morning.  Been praying my friends wife's cancer would go into remission and it has ...  Just got the good news earlier.

1)  Whose plan was it to giver her cancer?

2)  Why are you trying to screw up his plan?

3)  Just got back from out of state funeral.  Friend's family prayed for three weeks while he was on life support.  I guess they were doing it wrong?

[WhoDeyWho]

(09-04-2015, 12:31 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You completely missed the point.

I don't even know how to try to believe something when no proof exists.  

I've had discussions like this with other Christians and almost all of them claim that their proof is the feeling they got when Jesus "touched" or "spoke to" them.  

I had an emotional experience when I was 9 years old, but looking back on it I was just a scared kid that had been indoctrinated since birth through my family and community.  Every single person I knew was a Christian.  It was impossible for me not to believe all of that at that age.  But as I got older I started learning more about the Bible and the history of religions around the world.  The god who supposedly saved my soul refused to answer the questions I had.  So I had no choice but to change my beliefs.

And although at times I am highly critical of the way some Christians act I am actually the product of two devout Christian parents who are NOT hypocrites, self-righteous, or judgmental.  They believe in kindness and charity, and they live the life instead of just preaching about it.  And, most important, they keep their politics and religion separate.

Peer pressure is a *****.  Especially at such a young and impresionable age.  No wonder they start early.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(09-06-2015, 06:41 PM)Blutarsky Wrote: To you they are not extremists because you are rational, but to many a flaming liberal any Christian that would go so far as to allege that there is a war on Christianity is an "extremist".

Members of the largest religious faith in America who allege there is a war against them do so because they aren't allowed to impose their religious beliefs upon others.  That is a completely irrational ideological belief; whether it is extremist depends upon one's definition of extremist.

[xxlt]

(09-16-2015, 06:06 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Members of the largest religious faith in America who allege there is a war against them do so because they aren't allowed to impose their religious beliefs upon others.  That is a completely irrational ideological belief; whether it is extremist depends upon one's definition of extremist.

In psychology they call it "projection." It is when you accuse others of having a trait you have and/or doing a thing you do. Irrational ideological belief or psychological projection: kind of the same thing.

[Johnny Cupcakes]

(09-03-2015, 02:42 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Showed up for me this morning.  Been praying my friends wife's cancer would go into remission and it has ...  Just got the good news earlier.

I'm happy for you, your friend, and his wife, that she is in remission of her cancer.  It's a horrible disease, and it's good to see people win thief battle with it.

You should thank her doctors though. I'm sure that she was provided with great care that helped her to beat the disease to this point.  Medical advancements have saved millions of lives and a large amount of cancer survivors are less thankful to the people that actually did the work of saving their lives than they are to an invisible man that they talk to at night who gave them the cancer to begin with.

[*bfine32*]

(09-16-2015, 06:57 PM)Johnny Cupcakes Wrote: I'm happy for you, your friend, and his wife, that she is in remission of her cancer.  It's a horrible disease, and it's good to see people win thief battle with it.

You should thank her doctors though. I'm sure that she was provided with great care that helped her to beat the disease to this point.  Medical advancements have saved millions of lives and a large amount of cancer survivors are less thankful to the people that actually did the work of saving their lives than they are to an invisible man that they talk to at night who gave them the cancer to begin with.

How do you know the cancer wasn't the result of exposure to made man products?

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(09-16-2015, 07:05 PM)bfine32 Wrote: How do you know the cancer wasn't the result of exposure to made man products?

Like the sun?  The most common cause of the most common type of cancer in the US? 

Previously, you cited the complexity of humans as evidence of intelligent design.  If we assume your evidence is true, man made products can't cause cancer in an divinely designed process unless:

1) Cancer is designed into the system intentionally.

2) Cancer is a design flaw, e.g. a mistake.  However, gods don't make mistakes.  Therefore, man made products cannot cause cancer unless the system was designed to operate that way. 

[*bfine32*]

(09-16-2015, 07:15 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Like the sun?  The most common cause of the most common type of cancer in the US? 

Previously, you cited the complexity of humans as evidence of intelligent design.  If we assume your evidence is true, man made products can't cause cancer in an divinely designed process unless:

1) Cancer is designed into the system intentionally.

2) Cancer is a design flaw, e.g. a mistake.  However, gods don't make mistakes.  Therefore, man made products cannot cause cancer unless the system was designed to operate that way. 

...or Cigarette smoking. Man can absolutely kill each other; it's one of the first stories of the Old Testament. 

Some folks choose to blame God and some folks choose to thank God. The non-believer really has no say; as they cannot give an opinion on something they do not believe in. They can just simply say "I don't believe".