ICE crackdown forcing some families to self deport

[StLucieBengal]

(07-11-2017, 06:26 PM)Benton Wrote: http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/green-card-holders-qualify-obamacare-not-medicare-article-1.1728340


It's the same with a lot of the safety net programs, there's typically work or time requirements. Immigrant (legal or illegal) impact on safety net programs is minuscule and nothing when compared to the taxes paid and income generated. If immigration services are working correctly and immigrants are checked up on to make sure they're holding down jobs, paying taxes, etc., then it's not really an issue if those same citizens eventually have to use some of the same safety net they've already been paying for.

If a guy comes here from Mexico, starts a catering business, becomes a legal citizen, pays taxes for 20 years and then has to go on food stamps for a couple months because his business hits a speed bump, I've got no issue with that. Same as I don't have any issue with an American born construction worker having to draw a couple months unemployment when he inevitably gets laid off in the winter — he was already paying into that system, it's his tax money he's getting back.

Mexican catering business owner is one thing. House full of Mexicans packed into a home living on blow up mattresses is quite another.

[Vlad]

(07-11-2017, 05:54 PM)Benton Wrote: My great grandfather came here from Germany after WW I. He had nothing of value (like a lot of Germans following the war), no skills and spoke only German, moving to a rural part of Illinois in a country not too found of Germans at the time. He worked hard, saved money, bought an empty building and turned it into a grocery store. He had a son and daughter, the son joined the Navy, served for four years and opened his own business. His daughter (my mom) was the first in the family to go to college. Etc., etc. 

I guess that's why I get a little frustrated with issues like the travel ban or 'build the wall.' I don't see a Middle Eastern fleeing from violence in his country with no marketable skills and not proficient in English as any different than Germans and others who fled here after WW I & II. Same with those coming from South America where there may not be fighting, but there's high poverty.

Don't be frustrated. The world was a much different place in 1918.

[Vlad]

More good news. Trump keeps on winning!

Illegals arrested in San Diego doubles under Trump.

Illegal border crossings way down.

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/immigration/sd-me-fugitive-operations-20170703-story.html

[Benton]

(07-11-2017, 11:20 PM)Vlad Wrote: Don't be frustrated. The world was a much different place in 1918.

Sarcasm is understood, but was more like the 20s.

Honestly, it's not that much different. War, fear of those who are different, misinformation about those coming into the country, government corruption, fleecing if the public, etc.

[*michaelsean*]

(07-11-2017, 06:46 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Mexican catering business owner is one thing. House full of Mexicans packed into a home living on blow up mattresses is quite another.

That's doing what it takes. I admire that. Now I'm still against people coming here illegally. We have a right to control our borders and the numbers that enter our country.

[RICHMONDBENGAL_07]

(07-11-2017, 06:00 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote:   I do not want the uneducated third worlders who are just going to take a job from someone who is currently living off the government.     

Why am not surprised that he's suspended...again.

[*michaelsean*]

(07-12-2017, 02:06 PM)RICHMONDBENGAL_07 Wrote: Why am not surprised that he's suspended...again.

We were talking about this over in the VIP Lounge where you can discuss this stuff outright with the mods.  Some fascinating stuff.

[Griever]

(07-12-2017, 02:11 PM)michaelsean Wrote: We were talking about this over in the VIP Lounge where you can discuss this stuff outright with the mods.  Some fascinating stuff.

i can only imagine some of the discussions about him

cant say im shocked though, i think i lost my bet though, so thats a bummer




edit: just noticed that whoever made my banner needs to update their account, lol

[Dill]

(07-11-2017, 11:28 PM)Benton Wrote: Sarcasm is understood, but was more like the 20s.

Honestly, it's not that much different. War, fear of those who are different, misinformation about those coming into the country, government corruption, fleecing if the public, etc.

Germans were "the enemy" back then. Many schools stopped teaching German during the war. And Germans did face discrimination in many places--especially "real" Germans, not the ones who had been living here for generations.

During the war stories circulated of Germans raping women and bayoneting babies.  The poster below is British but many Americans felt the same, and would not hire a German over an American. The war might be over but a "Hun" was still a Hun, however he was dressed.

[RICHMONDBENGAL_07]

(07-12-2017, 11:31 PM)Dill Wrote: Germans were "the enemy" back then. Many schools stopped teaching German during the war. And Germans did face discrimination in many places--especially "real" Germans, not the ones who had been living here for generations.

During the war stories circulated of Germans raping women and bayoneting babies.  The poster below is British but many Americans felt the same, and would not hire a German over an American. The war might be over but a "Hun" was still a Hun, however he was dressed.

True story:  My grandmother was off-the-boat German came here with her parents when she was 2yrs old.  If you spoke to her you wouldn't detect any accent at all.  Even when I was young, I knew she was from Germany, but I'll tell you what that house always felt like the most American house I've ever stepped in.   So when some distant relatives(distant to me at least) came from Germany, you can imagine my surprise when she started speaking fluent German (I was 13yrs old and never heard her speak German).  I was floored!  So of course I started peppering her with questions.  How do you know German? Why have I never heard you speak it before?....etc .  I should mention that my grandfather is a WWII vet.  She just quietly told me that she spoke German because her parents couldn't speak much English.  But she didn't have much of an accent because she was so young when she came here.  That and that she'd been hiding her German history for most of her life because of both World Wars and in particular WWII because she was married to my Grandfather during WWII.  I wish she would've passed the language along to my dad and in turn to me but alas it wasn't meant to be, my father can't speak German either.  He and I were talking one time about it and we both expressed the disappointment in not being taught it, but we understand why.  I keep telling my self that one of these days I'm going to try and learn through one of those teaching courses you can get (I forget the name) but life keeps distracting me.

[StLucieBengal]

(07-12-2017, 07:39 AM)michaelsean Wrote: That's doing what it takes. I admire that. Now I'm still against people coming here illegally. We have a right to control our borders and the numbers that enter our country.

So we are on the same page.

Here is that Australian immigration point system calculator I was posting about earlier.

https://www.acacia-au.com/skilled-migration-points-test.php

[StLucieBengal]

Y

(07-12-2017, 11:31 PM)Dill Wrote: Germans were "the enemy" back then. Many schools stopped teaching German during the war. And Germans did face discrimination in many places--especially "real" Germans, not the ones who had been living here for generations.

During the war stories circulated of Germans raping women and bayoneting babies.  The poster below is British but many Americans felt the same, and would not hire a German over an American. The war might be over but a "Hun" was still a Hun, however he was dressed.

People rally around a common enemy. Innocents get swept up in all of that.... the Germans were the enemy back then and until they set the standard to change they were treated as such.

This kind of stuff forces people to get with the program quickly. Same stuff going on with the Muslims now. As the normal Muslims get tired of all the heat they will get with the program and make changes.

Everyone used to be afraid of Russians as well. Well I guess democrats and leftists are still afraid of them.

[RICHMONDBENGAL_07]

(07-14-2017, 01:04 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Y
People rally around a common enemy.   Innocents get swept up in all of that....   the Germans were the enemy back then and until they set the standard to change they were treated as such.  

This kind of stuff forces people to get with the program quickly.   Same stuff going on with the Muslims now.   As the normal Muslims get tired of all the heat they will get with the program and make changes.

Everyone used to be afraid of Russians as well.   Well I guess democrats and leftists are still afraid of them.

Meh I'm not afraid of Russians, I actually work with several, and they're really nice people.  I will say though that any country that aligns itself with
the likes of Syria, Iran, and N. Korea?!  Lets just say it concerns me.

As for the rest of your post yes innocents get caught up in that.  Just because we had internment camps for Japanese in WWII, does not mean we should treat similar citizens and/foreign nationals that are innocent from countries that we are currently in conflict as second class people.  I agree with vetting of course, but an absolute ban...no.   It's a shame that Trump and other Republicans can't seem to learn from a Democrats mistake. Actually it's ironic.

[StLucieBengal]

(07-16-2017, 01:52 AM)RICHMONDBENGAL_07 Wrote: Meh I'm not afraid of Russians, I actually work with several, and they're really nice people.  I will say though that any country that aligns itself with
the likes of Syria, Iran, and N. Korea?!  Lets just say it concerns me.

As for the rest of your post yes innocents get caught up in that.  Just because we had internment camps for Japanese in WWII, does not mean we should treat similar citizens and/foreign nationals that are innocent from countries that we are currently in conflict as second class people.  I agree with vetting of course, but an absolute ban...no.   It's a shame that Trump and other Republicans can't seem to learn from a Democrats mistake. Actually it's ironic.

They aren't even fully banning the real problem nations. I would van the while Middle East with exception being Israel, Egypt, and Jordan.

If trump and republicans go full Democrat they will round up all Muslims and place them into camps without notifying their families.

[RICHMONDBENGAL_07]

(07-16-2017, 02:15 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: They aren't even fully banning the real problem nations.   I would van the while Middle East with exception being Israel, Egypt, and Jordan.  

If trump and republicans go full Democrat they will round up all Muslims and place them into camps without notifying their families.

You're advocating for this?

[StLucieBengal]

(07-16-2017, 02:44 AM)RICHMONDBENGAL_07 Wrote: You're advocating for this?

No. I just want to block all immigration from these areas until they can sort out their own nonsense.


Rounding up citizens or legal immigrants is just wrong.

[RICHMONDBENGAL_07]

(07-16-2017, 03:29 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: No.  I just want to block all immigration from these areas until they can sort out their own nonsense.


Rounding up citizens or legal immigrants is just wrong.

But a lot of the immigrants coming from the areas you want blocked are legal immigrants.  Not letting them in is just as bad as rounding them up IMO.  Especially if they are fleeing for their lives.

[GMDino]

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2017/07/17/immigration-arrests-up-deportations-down-under-trump/484437001/

Quote:Immigration arrests up, deportations down under Trump


Arrests of undocumented immigrants by federal agents increased in June, but deportations fell to their lowest point this year as the nation's court system sees bigger backlogs, according to data released Monday by Immigration and Customs Enforcement.

ICE agents arrested 13,914 people last month, following a trend since President Trump took office in January and his campaign promise to crack down on illegal immigration.

In the final three months of the Obama administration, ICE averaged 9,134 arrests per month. That number has steadily increased under Trump, with the agency averaging 13,085 each month from February through June.

The Trump administration has not turned those arrests into more deportations, however, as those numbers keep falling. 
In the final three months of the Obama administration, the agency averaged 22,705 deportations per month. That number has consistently fallen under Trump, with the agency averaging 16,895 from February through June, reaching its lowest point in June.
 
ICE Acting Director Thomas Homan recently said the drop in deportations is because of the backlog in federal immigration courts and the lengthy time to process each case. The number of cases waiting to be completed has surpassed 610,000 through June, according to the TRAC research project at Syracuse University. 

Immigration courts have long been overburdened, with regular deportation cases taking up to two years to complete because of the volume of cases. The Trump administration has added to that backlog by arresting more people and cutting back on the Obama administration policy of allowing undocumented immigrants to be free on bond as they await their court hearings.

Attorney General Jeff Sessions has dispatched 25 more immigration judges to detention centers along the southwest border with Mexico and wants to add more. The Justice Department's goal is to hire 50 immigration judges this year and 75 in the following year.

[*michaelsean*]

(07-17-2017, 04:17 PM)GMDino Wrote: https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2017/07/17/immigration-arrests-up-deportations-down-under-trump/484437001/

I'm confused by the explanation.  A backlog due to increased arrests shouldn't stop them from deporting at least an equal amount.  

[GMDino]

(07-17-2017, 05:19 PM)michaelsean Wrote: I'm confused by the explanation.  A backlog due to increased arrests shouldn't stop them from deporting at least an equal amount.  

Agreed.  Although I wonder if there the increase arrests have included people who shouldn't be deported so the clogging comes from those.

As an example I keep track of product we produce that is scrapped.  Management wants eight items a day produced but they don't take into account the ones that a guy works on for half a day that end of junk.  (Not the fault of the employee.  We repair here.)

So they get 8 a day.  Sometimes 8 are good.  Sometimes 1 is good and the rest are junk.