Iraq Veteran Fired Due To Skin Color

[Belsnickel]

(07-30-2019, 12:04 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: https://www.politico.com/story/2019/07/29/top-dccc-staffer-out-amid-diversity-uproar-1439525

Allison Jaslow
Jared Smith
Melissa Miller
Molly Ritner
Nick Pancrazio

Van Ornelas  _ hmm, maybe 5 white people maybe, not sure can't find anything about her.

Remember, they called for resignations on Sunday, then On Monday was the massacre.

Soooo, where in there does it say there was a call for their firing? I must've missed that part in there.

Also, a line in that article does seem to support one of my theories about the resignation of the original topic from the OP:

Quote:Jaslow convened an emergency all-staff meeting Friday that was described as "very emotional" by a committee aide present. Jaslow cried as she took responsibility for not doing enough to diversify the upper ranks as some staffers complained that neither she or her deputies were people of color.

So if she was fired, which there is not substantial evidence of at this time, it would be because of her actions (or lack thereof) rather than her skin color based on this.

[*bfine32*]

Folks will use the term "forced" however it fits their agenda. Many folks around here tell me they are "forced" to stand for the Anthem; even though no one told them to. But stating these folks were forced to resign doesn't fit the bill in their opinion.

[Dill]

(07-30-2019, 10:50 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: No such thing as reverse discrimination. Or reverse racism.

It's just plain discrimination and racism, regardless of who did it.

Leonard, what is the purpose of the DCCC? What is its stated "mission"?

Isn't that sort knowledge required to determine whether these "firings" were "just plain discrimination" or not? Or even "firings"? 

E.g., If a fundamental organizational goal of the DCCC is to itself reflect the diversity it requires of partners, seems like white people could be legitimately fired for "just being white," if someone had hired them heedless of stated diversity goals.
 

[*bfine32*]

(07-30-2019, 12:04 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: https://www.politico.com/story/2019/07/29/top-dccc-staffer-out-amid-diversity-uproar-1439525

Allison Jaslow
Jared Smith
Melissa Miller
Molly Ritner
Nick Pancrazio

Van Ornelas  _ hmm, maybe 5 white people maybe, not sure can't find anything about her.

Remember, they called for resignations on Sunday, then On Monday was the massacre.

Obviously resigned without issue because she was the Director of Diversity.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(07-30-2019, 12:20 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Soooo, where in there does it say there was a call for their firing? I must've missed that part in there.

Also, a line in that article does seem to support one of my theories about the resignation of the original topic from the OP:


So if she was fired, which there is not substantial evidence of at this time, it would be because of her actions (or lack thereof) rather than her skin color based on this.

I didn't make the claim that any of them were fired, only that they were pressured.

But I guess when it suits you, you can play the literal game vs the figurative one. So I guess next time one of Trump's people resign, we should take it literally right?

[GMDino]

(07-30-2019, 01:08 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: I didn't make the claim that any of them were fired, only that they were pressured.

But I guess when it suits you, you can play the literal game vs the figurative one. So I guess next time one of Trump's people resign, we should take it literally right?

I'm thinking that Matt is still referring back to the thread title:

Quote:Iraq Veteran Fired Due To Skin Color

I linker two more article showing there was concern about diversity and the people in charge chose to step down.

No one was fired or "forced" to resign.  There is nothing in any of the articles that says that.

[*bfine32*]

(07-30-2019, 12:50 PM)Dill Wrote: Leonard, what is the purpose of the DCCC? What is its stated "mission"?

Isn't that sort knowledge required to determine whether these "firings" were "just plain discrimination" or not? Or even "firings"? 

E.g., If a fundamental organizational goal of the DCCC is to itself reflect the diversity it requires of partners, seems like white people could be legitimately fired for "just being white," if someone had hired them heedless of stated diversity goals.
 

https://dccc.org/about/

Quote:D-Triple-C

• the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee
• the official campaign arm of the Democrats in the House of Representatives
• the only political committee in the country whose principal mission is to support Democratic House candidates every step of the way to fortify and expand our new Democratic Majority

So "just being white" is probably reason enough to introduce a hostile work environment.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(07-30-2019, 01:11 PM)GMDino Wrote: I'm thinking that Matt is still referring back to the thread title:



I linker two more article showing there was concern about diversity and the people in charge chose to step down.

No one was fired or "forced" to resign.  There is nothing in any of the articles that says that.

Matt quoted me not the OP, so I figured he was commenting at me.

Give it another couple days and there will be plenty of links.

[Belsnickel]

(07-30-2019, 01:08 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: I didn't make the claim that any of them were fired, only that they were pressured.

But I guess when it suits you, you can play the literal game vs the figurative one. So I guess next time one of Trump's people resign, we should take it literally right?

Well, actually, you said:

(07-30-2019, 11:45 AM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Hahaha funny.
First complaints about diversity at the top.
Then in a matter of days, 6 white people resign, but they weren't forced to resign, just pressured right?

"In a statement Sunday that was first reported by Politico, Reps. Vicente Gonzalez and Filemon Velam, both of Texas, called for Jaslow’s firing and said the DCCC was “in complete chaos.” "

Again just a coincidence right, no pressure from anyone.

and

(07-30-2019, 12:04 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: https://www.politico.com/story/2019/07/29/top-dccc-staffer-out-amid-diversity-uproar-1439525

Allison Jaslow
Jared Smith
Melissa Miller
Molly Ritner
Nick Pancrazio

Van Ornelas  _ hmm, maybe 5 white people maybe, not sure can't find anything about her.

Remember, they called for resignations on Sunday, then On Monday was the massacre.

The link you provided did not say anything about anyone calling for resignations or firings. I said there was nothing about a call for such action in the article.

If someone asks for someone's resignation, that is the same as firing them in my book, I'm not arguing that semantic difference. I am saying there was no call for their firing or resignations, and there is no evidence their resignations were requested, based upon what I have read in this thread and through the sources provided.

[*bfine32*]

(07-30-2019, 01:18 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Well, actually, you said:


and


The link you provided did not say anything about anyone calling for resignations or firings. I said there was nothing about a call for such action in the article.

If someone asks for someone's resignation, that is the same as firing them in my book, I'm not arguing that semantic difference. I am saying there was no call for their firing or resignations, and there is no evidence their resignations were requested, based upon what I have read in this thread and through the sources provided.

Most likely just a coincidence.

[Belsnickel]

(07-30-2019, 01:22 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Most likely just a coincidence.

Well, we know the veteran for whom this thread was made took responsibility for not doing enough about the diversity according to staffers in the meeting. It is very possible that she resigned on her own.

I'm also not saying it definitely didn't happen, only that based upon the information we have provided to us that it is an assumption to make the claim that she, or any of the other staffers, we asked to resign or fired. If they were, there is evidence that it was because they held some responsibility in the hiring practices for the staff.

Pardon me for not jumping to conclusions without supporting evidence, something some individuals seem more than happy to do even though they get pissy about the media doing it.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(07-30-2019, 11:06 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: I only see mention of one person in the article you posted resigning. Also, one of the most important principles in thinking critically about information is recognizing that correlation does not equal causation. There needs to be more information to create a causal link between two things. All you have is correlational evidence, or what is called circumstantial.

You joke about the fake news claims, but making these logical leaps and assumptions is what has led to this. News agencies, specifically the corporate 24/7 news channels, have long been sensationalizing stories by doing the sort of thing you're doing in this thread. Instead of getting these opinions on the news we should be saying, to quote Sgt. Friday, "all we want are the facts, ma'am."

(07-30-2019, 01:18 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Well, actually, you said:


and


The link you provided did not say anything about anyone calling for resignations or firings. I said there was nothing about a call for such action in the article.

If someone asks for someone's resignation, that is the same as firing them in my book, I'm not arguing that semantic difference. I am saying there was no call for their firing or resignations, and there is no evidence their resignations were requested, based upon what I have read in this thread and through the sources provided.

So lets put it this way... Mitch McConnell looks at an organization that he contributes funds to, has power over, and also has power over other people who contribute funds/have power in the organization. He shouts out to all the press he can find that he wants more white people in charge of that organization and demands some action be taken.

6 black people in the top of the hierarchy of that organization promptly "resign" and a committee or board or whatever is made to hire 6 specifically white people to replace them.

Would there still be 0 connection between McConnell's demand for more white people and the sudden and sweeping "resignations" of 6 black people for jobs you are now looking to hire white people for? Is it racist now? 

1. Demands are made that there be more leadership diversity.
2. Immediately after a bunch of white people in leadership positions are "resigned".
3. They are now looking are filling those leadership jobs with specifically non-whites.

You keep making a really weak argument that 1 plus 1 doesn't equal 2.

"Not proof!" you say... in the words of Chad Johnson, I say "Child please."

- - - - - - - - - - - - - -

You say "they didn't specifically call out for resignations or firings" but if you have power and you demand that more of the leadership of the organization is immediately diverse, how exactly are you expecting those positions to be immediately open? If you demand for your school to have a black principal, and currently have a white principal, how do you think they are going to hire a black principal without the white one being fired or being told to resign? 

"I didn't steal their money officer, I just held my gun out and said I want some money now. It's not my fault some people took my gun and my open desire for money right now as a prompt for them to give me theirs."

[Mike M (the other one)]

(07-30-2019, 01:18 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Well, actually, you said:


and


The link you provided did not say anything about anyone calling for resignations or firings. I said there was nothing about a call for such action in the article.

If someone asks for someone's resignation, that is the same as firing them in my book, I'm not arguing that semantic difference. I am saying there was no call for their firing or resignations, and there is no evidence their resignations were requested, based upon what I have read in this thread and through the sources provided.

Oh it was in the WAPO.

I don't have a subscription, so I can't view it again for today/this week I think.
If you google the line

"In a statement Sunday that was first reported by Politico, Reps. Vicente Gonzalez and Filemon Velam, both of Texas, called for Jaslow’s firing and said the DCCC was “in complete chaos.”

It will bring up the WAPO article.

[Belsnickel]

(07-30-2019, 01:41 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: You keep making a really weak argument that 1 plus 1 doesn't equal 2.

Look, I get that from your first response to me you have felt the need to insult me in some way, likely because I somehow struck a nerve, but this isn't the case at all. You had your mind made up that this was the case from the outset and nothing is going to change that, that's fine. All I'm saying is that you are jumping to the answer of 2 without knowing all of the variables. Feel free to justify it however you like.

[GMDino]

I'm just glad we can have a thread on racism against some whites for a change.  We don't hear enough about that in this day and age. 

[Belsnickel]

(07-30-2019, 01:46 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Oh it was in the WAPO.

I don't have a subscription, so I can't view it again for today/this week I think.
If you google the line

"In a statement Sunday that was first reported by Politico, Reps. Vicente Gonzalez and Filemon Velam, both of Texas, called for Jaslow’s firing and said the DCCC was “in complete chaos.”

It will bring up the WAPO article.

Ok, I found the WaPo article and then the Politico article it points to: https://www.politico.com/story/2019/07/29/cheri-bustos-democrats-diversity-1438867

It looks like the timeline of events was that Jaslow accepted blame for the lack of diversity in the DCCC on Friday, and then the two Representatives did indeed call for her to be fired on Sunday. So it is likely she was asked to resign (I don't know anything about the others), but it is because of her actions and not because of her skin color, as has been claimed by some.

[GMDino]

(07-30-2019, 01:46 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Oh it was in the WAPO.

I don't have a subscription, so I can't view it again for today/this week I think.
If you google the line

"In a statement Sunday that was first reported by Politico, Reps. Vicente Gonzalez and Filemon Velam, both of Texas, called for Jaslow’s firing and said the DCCC was “in complete chaos.”

It will bring up the WAPO article.

I shared that Politico story.

The word "fire" "fired" "firing" does not appear in that story according to a quick search by me. The Sunday article makes no reference to any statement by Gonzalez or Velam either.

Edit: I also cited the first story about this and there is this quote:

Quote:CHC members were incensed in late June when The Washington Free Beacon published a story revealing that DCCC aide Tayhlor Coleman sent a series of derogatory tweets roughly a decade ago, including one that was portrayed as her being afraid of Mexicans. Coleman publicly apologized for the tweets late last month.

The day after the story ran, Bustos announced in a caucus meeting at the party headquarters that Coleman was getting a promotion to be director of cycle of engagement, a minority outreach program. Some lawmakers — well aware of her tweets — turned to look at each other in shock, according to multiple sources present.

Rep. Vicente González, a second-term Texas Democrat shocked by the tweets, said he asked Bustos the next day if they were “fake.” Bustos texted González back, writing: “I want you to know I listened, I acted. She is no longer in the job.” Coleman is, however, still working at the DCCC.

House Majority Whip Jim Clyburn (D-S.C.) said in an interview that he asked Bustos to keep Coleman on staff.

“I asked for her not to be terminated but to please be given different duties and responsibilities, but don’t terminate a young African American woman for something she may have done on social media when she was 19 years old,” Clyburn said.

Clyburn added it is his understanding Coleman was removed from her position as director of the cycle of engagement and moved to a different post.

Similarly, Rep. Tony Cárdenas (D-Calif.) didn’t call for Coleman to be fired but wanted her moved elsewhere. The DCCC told Cárdenas that Coleman would no longer be working on the minority engagement project or on any issues concerning minorities at all.

But Coleman was scheduling meetings regarding minority outreach strategy as recently as last week, according to messages seen by POLITICO. A DCCC aide said the committee does not discuss staffing issues.

“Wow, it was my understanding that that individual was no longer in the title that she’d recently been promoted to and that she was in a different position,” Cárdenas said. “And also not in the diversity team.”

Cardenas said Bustos has made herself available for meetings with BOLD PAC, the campaign arm of the Hispanic Caucus which he chairs. “I want to see progress. [Rep.] Ben Ray [Luján] really took it to another level in a good way but we can’t rest on our laurels and we can’t assume it’s going to stay that way,” he said.

[Belsnickel]

(07-30-2019, 01:59 PM)GMDino Wrote: I shared that Politico story.

The word "fire" "fired" "firing" does not appear in that story according to a quick search by me. 

They definitely called for Jaslow to be replaced, albeit after she had taken responsibility for the diversity issues in the staffing.

[Dill]

(07-30-2019, 01:17 PM)bfine32 Wrote: https://dccc.org/about/
So "just being white" is probably reason enough to introduce a hostile work environment.

LOL you have topped Len in the race to extend conclusions beyond what given facts/premises allow.

This is maybe the page you were looking for, which requires that vendors affiliated with the DCCC demonstrate commitment to diversity.
https://action.dccc.org/sign-up/political-vendors

If everyone recently hired to the DCCC is "just being white," and the competent people not hired were just being black or hispanic, then yes, that could be cause for hostility. 

Do as we say but not as we do.

[GMDino]

(07-30-2019, 02:00 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: They definitely called for Jaslow to be replaced, albeit after she had taken responsibility for the diversity issues in the staffing.

So they fired a white, female veteran due to racism?