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With what isn't clear right now, but they were told to surrender, this morning.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/30/us/politics/paul-manafort-indicted.html
I want to say, though, that until more information is known, we have no idea what this means with regards to anything political. It is quite possible this is something not related to the campaign that was discovered through the course of the investigation.
Also, the Gates in question is Rick Gates, who was a Manafort protege and a part of Trump's circle until April, this year.
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(10-30-2017, 09:09 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: With what isn't clear right now, but they were told to surrender, this morning.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/30/us/politics/paul-manafort-indicted.html
I want to say, though, that until more information is known, we have no idea what this means with regards to anything political. It is quite possible this is something not related to the campaign that was discovered through the course of the investigation.
Thanks Matt. I was all over the place this weekend and really didn't follow this. No sense until the deal went down, so to speak.
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Also the POTUS tweeted about the same time about....the Obama campaign and Fusion GPS.
And also to thank Fox and Friends for their coverage....saying it probably was long before he knew the President.
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This indictment doesn’t touch Trump. But does cover when Manafort worked with the Podestas to sway Hillary Clinton’s state Department on Uranium.
The Manafort indictment does not allege what a lot of leftist regarding Trump and the election.
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(10-30-2017, 11:12 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: This indictment doesn’t touch Trump. But does cover when Manafort worked with the Podestas to sway Hillary Clinton’s state Department on Uranium.
The Manafort indictment does not allege what a lot of leftist regarding Trump and the election.
The Manafort indictment does, indeed, not relate to the Trump campaign. I'm curious where you are getting information that it has anything to do with the Uranium deal, though.
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(10-30-2017, 09:09 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: With what isn't clear right now, but they were told to surrender, this morning.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/30/us/politics/paul-manafort-indicted.html
I want to say, though, that until more information is known, we have no idea what this means with regards to anything political. It is quite possible this is something not related to the campaign that was discovered through the course of the investigation.
Also, the Gates in question is Rick Gates, who was a Manafort protege and a part of Trump's circle until April, this year.
Interesting, although I don't think anyone is surprised by Manafort being named. To me there are two possibilities, either this is as deep as it goes and these indictments are the end of it or, IMO far more likely, they're hoping to put the screws to Manafort and Gates and hope they flip on someone higher up/closer to Trump.
I do find it interesting that the Manafort indictment doesn't seem to be related to activities while engaged with Trump. This could get very interesting in an unexpected way.
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(10-30-2017, 11:26 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Interesting, although I don't think anyone is surprised by Manafort being named. To me there are two possibilities, either this is as deep as it goes and these indictments are the end of it or, IMO far more likely, they're hoping to put the screws to Manafort and Gates and hope they flip on someone higher up/closer to Trump.
I do find it interesting that the Manafort indictment doesn't seem to be related to activities while engaged with Trump. This could get very interesting in an unexpected way.
I was expecting either Manafort or Flynn (those two had the best Vegas odds, as well). I don't think there will ever be an indictment regarding actual campaign collusion from Trump's inner circle, but I do think there will be one for someone from this. Michael McFaul put it this way in a podcast not too long ago, that Russia just a few years ago did not understand our electoral system, so their specific targeting of ads in certain areas points to someone here with greater knowledge of the political system. Granted, I don't know how true this is, but given his expertise on Russia, I'd tend to defer to him on this. Whether that person was with the campaign or not, though, I have no idea.
I have also felt like the ties to Russia within the Trump campaign inner circle, even if not campaign related, were going to be the weight around their neck on this. I don't think this would have been such a big deal if they would have been open and honest about their business dealings with Russia. But, because of the friendliness towards Putin, the inaccurate/misleading statements, and the lack of public tax returns, it has caused the public to speculate. When the public speculates, it gets crazy.
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Interesting addition to all of this: http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/trumps-former-foreign-policy-adviser-pleads-guilty-to-lying-about-contact-with-russians/article/2638962
Quote:A former foreign policy advisor for Donald Trump’s presidential campaign pleaded guilty weeks ago to making false statements to the FBI as part of Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s probe.
According to court documents released Monday, George Papadopoulos, 30, pleaded guilty to making “material false statements and material omissions” during an interview with the FBI in January as part of its investigation into Russian meddling in the 2016 presidential election and possible collusion with the Trump campaign.
The document said Papadopoulos "lied to special agents of the Federal Bureau of Investigation, concerning a federal investigation... about the timing, extent, and nature of his relationships and interactions with certain foreign nationals whom he understood to have close connections with senior Russian government officials."
The news of Papadopoulos’ admission comes as Mueller unveiled two indictments of Trump associates on Monday: former campaign chairman Paul Manafort and his business partner and so-called protégé Rick Gates.
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Omertà
(10-30-2017, 11:35 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: I was expecting either Manafort or Flynn (those two had the best Vegas odds, as well). I don't think there will ever be an indictment regarding actual campaign collusion from Trump's inner circle, but I do think there will be one for someone from this. Michael McFaul put it this way in a podcast not too long ago, that Russia just a few years ago did not understand our electoral system, so their specific targeting of ads in certain areas points to someone here with greater knowledge of the political system. Granted, I don't know how true this is, but given his expertise on Russia, I'd tend to defer to him on this. Whether that person was with the campaign or not, though, I have no idea.
I have also felt like the ties to Russia within the Trump campaign inner circle, even if not campaign related, were going to be the weight around their neck on this. I don't think this would have been such a big deal if they would have been open and honest about their business dealings with Russia. But, because of the friendliness towards Putin, the inaccurate/misleading statements, and the lack of public tax returns, it has caused the public to speculate. When the public speculates, it gets crazy.
Well stated. Unless Trump, or his campaign, actively courted the Russians to hack Hillary and DNC, subsequently releasing what they found, I see little difference between this and the anti-Trump "dossier" put together largely with the "testimony" of Russian nationals. Everyone knows you can't sneeze in Russia without Putin's permission, so saying he had no hand in the contents of such a "dossier" would be naïve in the extreme.
As to my earlier point about hoping someone flips upon being indicted, I don't see it happening. If they truly have damaging information on Trump then the best course of action for them would be to engage in a little omertà and sit tight for the eventual clemency/pardon Trump gives them in his final months in office. Such are the vagaries and corruptibility's of our current system of government. Taking down a POTUS is near impossible without smoking gun type evidence. On the bright side, this will give Maxine Waters a new reason to scream at the camera for a few weeks.
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But if there is one thing Trump is good at it's milking people for his own benefit...especially at someone else's expense! 
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2017/10/30/trump-campaign-sends-out-fundraising-email-after-paul-manafort-indictment/812776001/
Quote:Trump campaign sends out fundraising email after Paul Manafort indictment
Less than two hours after President Trump's former campaign manager was indicted Monday, the Trump re-election campaign decided to send out a fundraising email.
The email, entitled "Still Standing" and from presidential son Eric Trump, describes the the "opposition" to the administration.
"The mainstream media continues to play politics, creating division and turning the American people against one another," the email reads. "But as a loyal supporter of our movement, I know you know the truth."
The email asks for supporters to contribute $1 before the end of the month.
The campaign email comes after charges against former 2016 campaign manager Paul Manafort and campaign associate Rick Gates were announced, including conspiracy and money laundering.
Read the full email below:
Quote:Friend,
There’s new opposition against my father and this Administration every day. The mainstream media continues to play politics, creating division and turning the American people against one another.
But as a loyal supporter of our movement, I know you know the truth.
My father has spoken out time and time again against those who have tried to bring this country down, and will always do so to protect hardworking Americans whose values have been forgotten by Washington.
To stand with us, please consider making a crucial end-of-month contribution before the deadline tomorrow: Contribute $1.
We’re working to change the course of this country for the better. My father will always stand for what is right, Friend, and hopes you will too.
Please, make a contribution of just $1 to help us crush our goal this month.
Thank you,
Eric Trump
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(10-30-2017, 01:44 PM)GMDino Wrote: But if there is one thing Trump is good at it's milking people for his own benefit...especially at someone else's expense!
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2017/10/30/trump-campaign-sends-out-fundraising-email-after-paul-manafort-indictment/812776001/
Not really germane to the discussion at hand, but well in keeping with your established pattern of not contributing anything to threads but articles written by someone else. 
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(10-30-2017, 01:56 PM)GMDino Wrote: 
Stick to the facts Joe.
What does fundraising have to do with the indictment? Other than it took place chronologically after said indictments were issued? The explanation should be interesting, we'll wait for it. I imagine Joe will too.
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So the campaign had knowledge of hacked Clinton emails months before they were released due to contacts with access to high level Russian officials?
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(10-30-2017, 02:59 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: So the campaign had knowledge of hacked Clinton emails months before they were released due to contacts with access to high level Russian officials?
Where are you getting that? I didn't see anything in the NYT article to suggest that.
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(10-30-2017, 03:16 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Where are you getting that? I didn't see anything in the NYT article to suggest that.
this was all i could find
http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/357851-timeline-campaign-knew-russia-had-clinton-emails-months-before-trump
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Some interesting reading that crossed my Twitter feed. A lot of speculation going around, today, and I would like to make it clear that I consider all of this to be purely that. I am not one of those that is all in on the Mueller investigation because that's not where we should pin all of our hopes if we disagree with Trump and the GOP, but it's still interesting to watch.
https://hotair.com/archives/2017/10/30/george-papadopoulos-wear-wire-mueller/
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(10-30-2017, 04:57 PM)Belsnickel Wrote:
Those don't necessarily have anything to do with Mueller at all. Sealed cases could be anything sensitive, such as terrorism or interstate criminal activity/drug trafficking.
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(10-30-2017, 05:12 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Those don't necessarily have anything to do with Mueller at all. Sealed cases could be anything sensitive, such as terrorism or interstate criminal activity/drug trafficking.
I know, entirely speculation. I'm just bringing anything to the table from the Twitterverse. The mixture of liberals, conservatives, and centrists in my feed creates a fun atmosphere with today's news.
I've been especially fond of the rug jokes.
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