Net neutrality repealed!

[Au165]

(12-21-2017, 12:47 PM)bfine32 Wrote: You do not need a phone. Also not sure the internet should be considered a luxury item; however, access to the faster lanes so you can stream entertainment might be, sorta like a 900 number. I have a phone line for communication and bill paying purposes, why you want to charge me more if I use the dial pad to dial 1-900

If you don't need a phone ,then you do not believe it should be a utility then correct? Should power be a utility? We don't actually need that either as it is more about luxury and convenience than anything. We own a hunting cabin with no power and can live there if we choose using candles and wood burning stoves but it isn't comfortable or convenient to do so. 

As to the fast lane thing, that actually has nothing to do with the consumer side of this. We already pay for that with bandwidth, the fast lane slow lane is more of a website to ISP issue. The consumer issue is being able to completely restrict access to websites, or require payment to get to those websites (not enter just get there). It's not a matter of getting "entertainment" slow it is that they could in theory keep you from communicating by restricting which email systems you can use (or even communicate to using your own), or not allowing you to pay your credit card/other bills online because they have deals with competitors to those organizations and want to restrict access to these site. They could choose to block you from going to a competitor's website so you can't look at pricing, essentially trying to lock you into their service.

[Benton]

(12-21-2017, 12:47 PM)bfine32 Wrote: You do not need a phone. Also not sure the internet should be considered a luxury item; however, access to the faster lanes so you can stream entertainment might be, sorta like a 900 number. I have a phone line for communication and bill paying purposes, why you want to charge me more if I use the dial pad to dial 1-900

You also don't need potable water and electricity. You want those things. 

If you hope to have a competitive business — in a growing number of industries — you need those things (internet access, phone access, water and electricity). Even businesses not traditionally technology dependent are heading that way, like agriculture, mining and food services. 

Businesses pay a fee for a utility so that they can in turn create a product or fulfill a labor. To stay competitive with foreign markets (or with super big companies), domestic companies and small businesses need everything they can to level that playing field. A tree nut farmer in Kentucky managing 3,000 acres via his phone shouldn't have to charge a higher price when he's upcharged because he bought an app used from a different company. That hurts his ability tol remain competitive with a tree nut farmer in South America who isn't getting hit with an upcharge.

[*bfine32*]

(12-21-2017, 01:05 PM)Au165 Wrote: If you don't need a phone ,then you do not believe it should be a utility then correct? Should power be a utility? We don't actually need that either as it is more about luxury and convenience than anything. We own a hunting cabin with no power and can live there if we choose using candles and wood burning stoves but it isn't comfortable or convenient to do so. 

As to the fast lane thing, that actually has nothing to do with the consumer side of this. We already pay for that with bandwidth, the fast lane slow lane is more of a website to ISP issue. The consumer issue is being able to completely restrict access to websites, or require payment to get to those websites (not enter just get there). It's not a matter of getting "entertainment" slow it is that they could in theory keep you from communicating by restricting which email systems you can use (or even communicate to using your own), or not allowing you to pay your credit card/other bills online because they have deals with competitors to those organizations and want to restrict access to these site. They could choose to block you from going to a competitor's website so you can't look at pricing, essentially trying to lock you into their service.

Lots of "woulds and coulds" really do not help when trying to make a solid point.

[Au165]

(12-21-2017, 03:50 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Lots of "woulds and coulds" really do not help when trying to make a solid point.

Sure they do, legislation aimed at preventing things from occurring are built around those very concepts. When talking about a law to disallow murder you’d probably say “without this law it would be okay to walk up and kill someone, you could even do it for no reason”.

I get you’re just deflecting, but it’s not wouldd and coulds as it has already happened in other countries who do allow ISPs to have free Reign. Failing to acknowledge the outcomes of other siimilar situations is simply willful ignorance of a likely outcome.

[*bfine32*]

(12-21-2017, 05:28 PM)Au165 Wrote: Sure they do, legislation aimed at preventing things from occurring are built around those very concepts. When talking about a law to disallow murder you’d probably say  “without this law it would be okay to walk up and kill someone, you could even do it for no reason”.

I get you’re just deflecting, but it’s not wouldd and coulds as it has already happened in other countries who do allow ISPs to have free Reign. Failing to acknowledge the outcomes of other siimilar situations is simply willful ignorance of a likely outcome.

No deflection, just kind of hard to argue against what "could" happen. For now all the repeal of net neutrality is done is made is so the government cannot tell this private business how to package its product.

Get back to me when you lose your internet.

[Au165]

(12-21-2017, 05:52 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Get back to me when you lose your internet.

Ummm....wouldn’t that be kind of hard?

[*bfine32*]

(12-21-2017, 06:00 PM)Au165 Wrote: Ummm....wouldn’t that be kind of hard?

Not if you went to the library and used theirs 

[Vas Deferens]

(12-21-2017, 05:52 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Get back to me when you lose your internet.

Way to stand up for the common good bro.

[*bfine32*]

(12-21-2017, 08:51 PM)Vas Deferens Wrote: Way to stand up for the common good bro.

Never was much of a fan of Chicken Little or the Boy that cried Wolf. 

Net Neutrality enforcement by the government could be the first step in a state controlled internet . Where everything you do or say is not only monitored by the government but the content is controlled by it. 

[Vas Deferens]

(12-21-2017, 09:38 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Never was much of a fan of Chicken Little or the Boy that cried Wolf. 

Net Neutrality enforcement by the government could be the first step in a state controlled internet . Where everything you do or say is not only monitored by the government but the content is controlled by it. 

I think its funny when people are afraid of the gov and completely disregard the corp that control it.  

Best of luck with your travel planning.

[JustWinBaby]

My internet still works!!!!!

[JustWinBaby]

(12-21-2017, 09:38 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Never was much of a fan of Chicken Little or the Boy that cried Wolf. 

This is why you'll never be a liberal.

[Dill]

(12-21-2017, 09:38 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Never was much of a fan of Chicken Little or the Boy that cried Wolf.

So you say, and then you warn us about that big, bad government wolf . . .

(12-21-2017, 09:38 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Net Neutrality enforcement by the government could be the first step in a state controlled internet . Where everything you do or say is not only monitored by the government but the content is controlled by it. 

If someone said laws against counterfeiting money could be the first step toward state-controlled banks, where our bank accounts are controlled by the government, I would hardly know where to begin a response.

Why wouldn't Net Partiality be the first step toward a one-party state?

[Dill]

(12-22-2017, 12:40 AM)Vas Deferens Wrote: I think its funny when people are afraid of the gov and completely disregard the corp that control it.  

Best of luck with your travel planning.

So many people now think of the government like a private corporation with private interests, rather than an institution representing the public interest and accountable to them. Same for the free press.  Institutions, laws, and conventions which evolved to enable and protect individual freedom are recast as threats to it.

[Vlad]

(12-21-2017, 02:48 PM)Benton Wrote: You also don't need potable water and electricity. You want those things. 

Lol. Yeah you want those things because you choose to stay alive.

[GMDino]

(12-27-2017, 11:00 AM)Vlad Wrote: Lol. Yeah you want  those things because you choose to stay alive.

You don't need electricity to live.  And you can dig your own well and boil your own water.

[Vlad]

(12-27-2017, 11:11 AM)GMDino Wrote: You don't need electricity to live.  And you can dig your own well and boil your own water.

What happened to the compassion?
Tell hurricane victims they don't need electricity... or an 80 yr old to dig a well and boil his water, provided he has electricity.
How about in home patients who require electricity to operate their medical devices?

Water and electricity are basic life sustaining utilities. The internet not so much.

https://www.army.mil/article/198561/us_army_corps_of_engineers_delivers_life_sustaining_power_to_puerto_rican_citizens

[GMDino]

(12-27-2017, 11:51 AM)Vlad Wrote: What happened to the compassion?
Tell hurricane victims they don't need electricity... or an 80 yr old to dig a well and boil his water, provided he has electricity.
How about in home patients who require electricity to operate their medical devices?

Water and electricity are basic life sustaining utilities. The internet not so much.

https://www.army.mil/article/198561/us_army_corps_of_engineers_delivers_life_sustaining_power_to_puerto_rican_citizens

You don't need electricity.  Humans survived for thousands of years without it.

You don't need fresh water delivered to your home.

[Vlad]

(12-22-2017, 12:40 AM)Vas Deferens Wrote: I think its funny when people are afraid of the gov and completely disregard the corp that control it.  

Best of luck with your travel planning.

Like when you completely disregarded then presidential candidate Obama setting the record for receiving donations from Wall Street?

[Vlad]

(12-27-2017, 11:55 AM)GMDino Wrote: You don't need electricity.  Humans survived for thousands of years without it.

You don't need fresh water delivered to your home.

You need electricity. You wouldn't survive a day without it.
You need water. You cant live without it.

Carry on with your circular argument.