Paycor Stadium Welcome to the Jungle

[*pally*]

Fans will notice some new signage around the stadium Friday (beyond Paycor). The old Sam Wyche “You live in a Cincinnati” wall covering has been replaced with a celebration shot from last year’s playoffs. pic.twitter.com/YHmO4aOsFU

— Paul Dehner Jr. (@pauldehnerjr) August 10, 2022

[Leon]

not a fan of the new name and will miss paul browns name bein on it, but its a new era an if it helps get everyone paid then i guess its a good thing.

[masonbengals fan]

I'd rather it remain PBS but that's not going to happen. Too much money involved.

[*PhilHos*]

As a banker, I would love to chime in but we're not allowed to give out anything that could constitute as financial advice (and I'm currently on my work computer) but let me just say that I find this discussion fascinating.

[BFritz21]

(08-10-2022, 03:25 PM)masonbengals fan Wrote: I'd rather it remain PBS but that's not going to happen. Too much money involved.

PCS now 

We'd all rather it remain PBS because of the history and tradition behind it but it's a business move and needed to be done to help the team.

[PDub80]

(08-10-2022, 01:17 PM)fredtoast Wrote: The Browns family has collected hundreds of millions of dollars in salary from the Bengals over the years.

Plus they own an asset worth over $2 BILLION dollars.

They could easily come up with a couple of hundred million dollars to invest in bonds and fund an escrow account.  It is not like they have to BUY something and lose the use of the money.  They can invest the money and receive a return while it is in the escrow account.

No large business... or small one, for that matter, should borrow personal funds, monies already earned, future monies projected to be earned, or assets to pay for liabilities (players and salaries are liabilities to the Bengals). That is a recipe for disaster and losing your ass as well as a sign of an unhealthy business. Let the Brown family make changes to the Bengals revenue streams to pay for this stuff. That is how good businesses operate. They can easily do so and make the Bengals as a company pay for these incoming expenses rather than go into a personal checking account, stock portfolio, etc.

Elon Musk is about to lose $1B because he thought it was fine to borrow against personal assets to buy another tech business (a liability).

I'm not saying businesses don't do it all the time... they do... but typically those moves are done with corporate money and with protection. When individuals do it? Not good.

Now, borrowing personal money or against already owned assets for a small business owner or corporation (assets or stock) to purchase more hard ASSETS? Smart and done every day.

[Essex Johnson]

(08-10-2022, 12:03 PM)Roland Wrote: Again, depends on the bond.  Even with a secured bond if there is a prepayment option they can pay off the bond early at a reduced rate and you don't get face value.

Still get face value, yes a issuer can return the principal or part of principal early but it only impacts interest accured not the face value... anyway moving on to more football chat over econ chat.. 

[fredtoast]

(08-10-2022, 04:05 PM)PDub80 Wrote: I'm not saying businesses don't do it all the time... they do... but typically those moves are done with corporate money and with protection. When individuals do it? Not good.

Now, borrowing personal money or against already owned assets for a small business owner or corporation (assets or stock) to purchase more hard ASSETS? Smart and done every day.

First of all I agree that they should not use personal wealth.  But most corporations run on debt and the Bengals have none.

The team is worth $2 billion.  If they borrowed money for funds to fund an escrow account it would have zero risk and would generate income.

I am not an accountant or a tax expert, but it seems to me that if teams are forced to put the guaranteed money in escrow the team would immediately get to claim the escrow amount as an expense (salary) and get the tax credit.  An accelerated tax deduction would amount to some real savings when we are talking about $50-$100 million.

[*pally*]

(08-10-2022, 04:46 PM)fredtoast Wrote: First of all I agree that they should not use personal wealth.  But most corporations run on debt and the Bengals have none.

The team is worth $2 billion.  If they borrowed money for funds to fund an escrow account it would have zero risk and would generate income.

I am not an accountant or a tax expert, but it seems to me that if teams are forced to put the guaranteed money in escrow the team would immediately get to claim the escrow amount as an expense (salary) and get the tax credit.  An accelerated tax deduction would amount to some real savings when we are talking about $50-$100 millio

How do you know what debt they do or do not have?

[fredtoast]

(08-10-2022, 04:50 PM)pally Wrote: How do you know what debt they do or do not have?

All the stock is held by the family.

They did not have to borrow to build their stadium.

NFL teams are money machines.  The reason the salary cap is growing so fast is that NFL profits are growing that fast.

How could the Bengals possibly have any debt?

[Mgbrown66]

They should put a big ass statue of Paul Brown in front of the main gate. Problem solved.

[Roland]

The fact remains that the Browns are not mega-rich compared to other NFL owners. It's nonsense to suggest that there's some mechanism where bond backed escrow funds are going to solve that in the near term. It's a complete non sequitur.

The Brown family needs to strike while the iron is hot. The returns on a Super Bowl ring will make anything else look like chump change.

[AlphaBengal]

(08-10-2022, 05:19 PM)Mgbrown66 Wrote: They should put a big ass statue of Paul Brown in front of the main gate.  Problem solved.

I'm honestly surprised there isn't one. This name change might speed things up.

[PDub80]

(08-10-2022, 06:31 PM)Roland Wrote: The fact remains that the Browns are not mega-rich compared to other NFL owners.  It's nonsense to suggest that there's some mechanism where bond backed escrow funds are going to solve that in the near term.   It's a complete non sequitur.  

The Brown family needs to strike while the iron is hot.  The returns on a Super Bowl ring will make anything else look like chump change.

I agree. There are simple mechanisms the Bengals can put into place to generate more revenue. They just have never tried to do anything even remotely outside of the shared revenue from the NFL box. The shared income has always been plenty enough for the Bengals org and those that run it to continue on through life comfortably. 

I wonder if the mindset of not efforting is because of the shared income? I would imagine that, yes, the Bengals brass never needed to kill it on the local level due to the national money being shared, but now they feel the heat.

Here is a link simply breaking this down. It will be interesting to see what the Bengals do from a work perspective now that they actually need more money to compete.....

http://www.thehogsty.com/2020/01/23/nfl-revenue-sharing-101/

[BFritz21]

(08-10-2022, 06:31 PM)Roland Wrote: The fact remains that the Browns are not mega-rich compared to other NFL owners.  It's nonsense to suggest that there's some mechanism where bond backed escrow funds are going to solve that in the near term.   It's a complete non sequitur.  

The Brown family needs to strike while the iron is hot.  The returns on a Super Bowl ring will make anything else look like chump change.

(08-10-2022, 07:06 PM)PDub80 Wrote: I agree. There are simple mechanisms the Bengals can put into place to generate more revenue. They just have never tried to do anything even remotely outside of the shared revenue from the NFL box. The shared income has always been plenty enough for the Bengals org and those that run it to continue on through life comfortably. 

I wonder if the mindset of not efforting is because of the shared income? I would imagine that, yes, the Bengals brass never needed to kill it on the local level due to the national money being shared, but now they feel the heat.

Here is a link simply breaking this down. It will be interesting to see what the Bengals do from a work perspective now that they actually need more money to compete.....

http://www.thehogsty.com/2020/01/23/nfl-revenue-sharing-101/

Yes to both of you. The franchise is worth 2.8 billion, which isn't chump change, but it's also the lowest valued franchise in the NFL.

[*bfine32*]

(08-10-2022, 03:30 PM)PhilHos Wrote: As a banker, I would love to chime in but we're not allowed to give out anything that could constitute as financial advice (and I'm currently on my work computer) but let me just say that I find this discussion fascinating.

As a Message Board member I'd like to say: Thanks for nothing (and I'm currently on my home computer)

[Frank Booth]

(08-10-2022, 07:51 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: Yes to both of you. The franchise is worth 2.8 billion, which isn't chump change, but it's also the lowest valued franchise in the NFL.

thats not accurate anymore with the new stadium name

[BFritz21]

(08-10-2022, 08:04 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: thats not accurate anymore with the new stadium name

How much more are we worth?

A hundred million more would still leave us in the bottom four of the league.

[Frank Booth]

(08-10-2022, 08:21 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: How much more are we worth?

A hundred million more would still leave us in the bottom four of the league.

...yea, prob still last

[*Go Cards*]

Am certain Paul Brown is still going to be well represented at the stadium as he should be..

Loving the Bengals managements new approach the last few years, they want it and I applaud Katie if she is the one in control now.

Either way, kudos to MB for accepting the change of culture and direction.

At one time I coveted Marvin as GM, yet so happy this did not happen now. Still respect Marvin and thank him for turning things around.

Just believe he took the Bengals as far as he could looking back now.