Tensions with Russia

[samhain]

I'm actually really surprised that there's no thread discussing this, so here goes.

In the last week or so many media outlets are reporting (mostly below election headlines and Kim Kardashian robbery news) that US-Russian tensions have reached a level not seen since the Cuban Missle Crisis. The two nations are no longer negotiating over their operations in Syria and the situation has been termed as "conflict". Another article I read stated that relations between the two nations have moved from plan A to plan B, plan B being anything ranging from non-negotiation to all out war.

Why the hell is this not a bigger deal in the national media? It seems there is now real animosity between the US and a near-peer military that is more likely than ever to evolve into war. My limited reading seemed to suggest that the only thing preventing the US from striking Syrian/Russian targets in Syria is Obama not wanting to start WWIII in his last 3 months of office. Outside of that, officials at the State Department and military brass are all ready to launch airstrikes.

Any thoughts? Is it all posturing? Are we headed to WWIII? Are we facing the threat of a nuclear showdown? Should I try heroin before we get incinerated by Iskander missiles in a few weeks? I mean, shit, I hate to sound paranoid, but this seems like kind of a massive deal to me.

[Au165]

(10-13-2016, 09:55 AM)samhain Wrote: I'm actually really surprised that there's no thread discussing this, so here goes.  

In the last week or so many media outlets are reporting (mostly below election headlines and Kim Kardashian robbery news) that US-Russian tensions have reached a level not seen since the Cuban Missle Crisis.  The two nations are no longer negotiating over their operations in Syria and the situation has been termed as "conflict".  Another article I read stated that relations between the two nations have moved from plan A to plan B, plan B being anything ranging from non-neotiation to all out war.  

Why the hell is this not a bigger deal in the national media?  It seems there is now real animosityl between the US and a near-peer military that is more likely than ever to evolve into war.  My limited reading seemed to suggest that the only thing preventing the  US from striking Syrian/Russian targets in Syria is Obama not wanting to start WWIII in his last 3 months of office.  Outside of that, officials at the State Department and military brass are all ready to launch airstrikes.

Any thoughts?  Is it all posturing?  Are we headed to WWIII?  Are we facing the threat of a nuclear showdown?  Should I try heroin before we get incinerated by Iskander missiles in a few weeks?  I mean, shit, I hate to sound paranoid, but this seems like kind of a massive deal to me.

I don't think WW3 starts, but another proxy war is probable. It will be unfortunate for the fronts it gets fought on, but I don't believe it happens here or in Russia. Don't get me wrong there will continue to be posturing of the nuclear kind, I don't think it gets that far. I believe if it came to it we would take Putin out before he could do it.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

Probably not helped by the DNC saying the leak was a hack by Russia to divert attention from what the leaks exposed, and continuing to say it over and over until people started repeating it.

[samhain]

(10-13-2016, 10:06 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Probably not helped by the DNC saying the leak was a hack by Russia to divert attention from what the leaks exposed, and continuing to say it over and over until people started repeating it.

You think it was someone else?  

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(10-13-2016, 10:08 AM)samhain Wrote: You think it was someone else?  

Sure, probably the DNC staffer who was shot multiple times in the back just a couple days later, with his wallet/phone/watch untouched.

Not normally a huge conspiracy guy, but that seemed rather suspicious.

[Rotobeast]

(10-13-2016, 10:15 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Sure, probably the DNC staffer who was shot multiple times in the back just a couple days later, with his wallet/phone/watch untouched.

Not normally a huge conspiracy guy, but that seemed rather suspicious.

Don't forget that there is a lost laptop that Hills had chock full of emails, as well.


Btw.... there's been other supposed hushed activities between the U.S. and Russia.
There were rumors circulating of a skirmish near the arctic circle.
This was right after the increase in activity of Russian bombers flying off of our West Coast.
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[tigerseye]

They probably want to start a war before people realize the crimes they have commited and start calling for it to be looked into. The Main Stream Propaganda outlets are trying to convence everyone that the economy is great and it's not. Now they are over there poking Russia with a stick.

Probably trying to divert everybodys attention away from the Clinton's crimes/lies/emails/media bias/debate moderator bias/haiti's money/the clinton foundation/rape/Bengazi/james comey and hsbc/destruction of evidence/body count and all the other s@#! they have done. 

This whole thing is a mess. Corruption protecting corruption.

[Rotobeast]

(10-13-2016, 12:39 PM)tigerseye Wrote: They probably want to start a war before people realize the crimes they have commited and start calling for it to be looked into. The Main Stream Propaganda outlets are trying to convence everyone that the economy is great and it's not. Now they are over there poking Russia with a stick.

Probably trying to divert everybodys attention away from the Clinton's crimes/lies/emails/media bias/debate moderator bias/haiti's money/the clinton foundation/rape/Bengazi/james comey and hsbc/destruction of evidence/body count and all the other s@#! they have done. 

This whole thing is a mess. Corruption protecting corruption.

Maybe Obama is trying to find a way to stay in office.


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[Vas Deferens]

(10-13-2016, 12:52 PM)Rotobeast Wrote: Maybe Obama is trying to find a way to stay in office.


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Daddy will fix it.

[Millhouse]

I found this interesting from a Putin ally, though he is also regarded for his 'fiery rhetoric'. And per articles he is also regarded by the Russian people as a clown that wants headlines, but also is faithful to Kremlin policy.

"Americans voting for a president on Nov. 8 must realise that they are voting for peace on Planet Earth if they vote for Trump. But if they vote for Hillary it's war. It will be a short movie. There will be Hiroshimas and Nagasakis everywhere."

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/putin-ally-tells-americans-vote-trump-or-face-nuclear-war/ar-AAiROc2?OCID=ansmsnnews11

[Belsnickel]

(10-13-2016, 10:06 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Probably not helped by the DNC saying the leak was a hack by Russia to divert attention from what the leaks exposed, and continuing to say it over and over until people started repeating it.

(10-13-2016, 10:08 AM)samhain Wrote: You think it was someone else?  

(10-13-2016, 10:15 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Sure, probably the DNC staffer who was shot multiple times in the back just a couple days later, with his wallet/phone/watch untouched.

Not normally a huge conspiracy guy, but that seemed rather suspicious.

It was most assuredly Russia. It wasn't just the DNC that said it, the White House made the statement as well. The geopolitical implications are much, much different if a party is saying it versus the head of state. The White House would not have said it if they didn't have solid evidence to back up the claim.

[Belsnickel]

(10-13-2016, 01:08 PM)Millhouse Wrote: I found this interesting from a Putin ally, though he is also regarded for his 'fiery rhetoric'. And per articles he is also regarded by the Russian people as a clown that wants headlines, but also is faithful to Kremlin policy.

"Americans voting for a president on Nov. 8 must realise that they are voting for peace on Planet Earth if they vote for Trump. But if they vote for Hillary it's war. It will be a short movie. There will be Hiroshimas and Nagasakis everywhere."

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/putin-ally-tells-americans-vote-trump-or-face-nuclear-war/ar-AAiROc2?OCID=ansmsnnews11

Putin and his fellow oligarchs want Trump in office because [they believe] they can manipulate him more. But, have no doubt, Russia doesn't want peace with us. Putin thrives on tension with the US, it is what fuels his nostalgia based campaign for more and more power. "The good ol' days of the USSR" is what he and his ilk rely on and that is dependent on tensions with the US.

The only way those tensions die down is if they are able to manipulate the POTUS into a deal that favors Russia in a way that they can claim victory over their long time nemesis.

But WWIII isn't going to happen. Neither Russia or the US is stupid enough to pull that trigger.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(10-13-2016, 01:31 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: It was most assuredly Russia. It wasn't just the DNC that said it, the White House made the statement as well. The geopolitical implications are much, much different if a party is saying it versus the head of state. The White House would not have said it if they didn't have solid evidence to back up the claim.

Forgive me as I have a bit of skepticism about the White House, as Obama took a break from his vacation not to visit a US natural disaster zone, but to use Air Force One to fly Hillary around for campaigning together.

It's not exactly the most unbiased place right now. You know?

Everything I have read about it uses words like "probable" or "alleged" or "most likely" or "is believed" when connecting Russia to the DNC leaks.

[Benton]

I was watching the Russian ambassador (I think it was on CSPAN) last night. He was pretty relaxed, basically saying Russia and the US weren't communicating very well concerning Syria and fighting terrorism, but there wasn't anything to be concerned about.

[Rotobeast]

(10-13-2016, 01:05 PM)Vas Deferens Wrote: Daddy will fix it.

Man..... that just seems so sexy, coming from you.

I just imagine a deep, Trace Adkins-like voice coming from your avatar.


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[Belsnickel]

(10-13-2016, 01:48 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Forgive me as I have a bit of skepticism about the White House, as Obama took a break from his vacation not to visit a US natural disaster zone, but to use Air Force One to fly Hillary around for campaigning together.

It's not exactly the most unbiased place right now. You know?

Everything I have read about it uses words like "probable" or "alleged" or "most likely" or "is believed" when connecting Russia to the DNC leaks.

That still doesn't take into account the implications of making the accusation without being able to back it up. And the DHS and DNI said they were confident it was Russia. That's about the strongest language you will get with the intelligence community.

[Rotobeast]

(10-13-2016, 01:35 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: But, have no doubt, Russia doesn't want peace with us. Putin thrives on tension with the US, it is what fuels his nostalgia based campaign for more and more power. "The good ol' days of the USSR" is what he and his ilk rely on and that is dependent on tensions with the US.

It also fuels tons of weaponry sales, from both the U.S. and Russia.



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[samhain]

(10-13-2016, 01:35 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Putin and his fellow oligarchs want Trump in office because [they believe] they can manipulate him more. But, have no doubt, Russia doesn't want peace with us. Putin thrives on tension with the US, it is what fuels his nostalgia based campaign for more and more power. "The good ol' days of the USSR" is what he and his ilk rely on and that is dependent on tensions with the US.

The only way those tensions die down is if they are able to manipulate the POTUS into a deal that favors Russia in a way that they can claim victory over their long time nemesis.

But WWIII isn't going to happen. Neither Russia or the US is stupid enough to pull that trigger.

I'm not sure they want all out war with us, either.  They want to have amped-up rhetoric without the repercussions of war.  What worries me is that at some point our elected officials and military will have to decide where the line is and what they'll do when he crosses.  It may not be a huge deal to people over here, but I don't think for a minute that out government and military want to be upstaged by Putin.  We should have given the Ukranian govt the heavy weaponry to smack him down when they invaded that country.  He won't stop until he meets some form of force.

[fredtoast]

(10-13-2016, 10:15 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Sure, probably the DNC staffer who was shot multiple times in the back just a couple days later, with his wallet/phone/watch untouched.

Not normally a huge conspiracy guy, but that seemed rather suspicious.

Why did it seem suspicious?  It was a botched robbery and the killer had to flee before getting a chance to steal anything.

Even Wikielinks said this.

"We treat threats toward any suspected source of WikiLeaks with extreme gravity. This should not be taken to imply that Seth Rich was a source to WikiLeaks or to imply that that his murder is connected to our publications."





Just stop an use your brain for a moment and you will realize how silly this conspiracy is.  If the info had already been leaked it would be political suicide to have him murdered.  As soon as it was disclosed that Rich was the source of the leak the media and law enforcement would be all over Clinton.

[fredtoast]

Back to the OP.


Syria is hugely important to Russia but not very important to the US. That is why we will probably just let Russia have their way there. It is not worth the trouble to the US, but it is to the Russians.