The First GOP Debate

[Dill]

(08-23-2023, 04:48 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I predict Christie will get aggressive and the rest of them will defend Trump, because they're all really just planning for the future or to be in Trump's circle, not to be the president in 2024.  Christie wants to be the first notable republican to FINALLY point out that emperor Trump has no clothes, Pence...who knows, DeSantis is trying to set himself up to be the candidate in 2028 if Trump is dead by then, and the rest are looking to kiss Trump's ass so they can be VP or get cabinet positions.

Trump won't be around forever, and anyone who goes after him today will be toast.  Defend him and then hope he's unavailable to run soon and you can say "I never turned on Trump, but he's gone now and you need me to take his place."

He's the only one who will flat out admit that Trump lost in 2020 and Trump should not be the GOP candidate in 2024, so I have to back him by default.  How anyone can win a political debate while refusing to admit who the current president is just shows how feelings matter over facts.

Christie should just point out that he's the only person there who will admit that Trump shouldn't be the first choice for president and everyone else is full of crap.

Christie probably knows he won't win this primary. But he may be thinking 4-6 years ahead. 

It's a good bet that Trump support will wane as the trials force more and more legal details into the MAGA bubble. And if he wins the nomination, then trails in right wing polls all the way up to the election and loses it, the inevitable cry of "rigged again" won't have much traction. His voters won't finally see through him, but they'll be exhausted, and may wonder if another candidate might have beaten "crooked Joe," still not in jail after we KNOW that he took millions in bribes from China. (lol) 

In six years it may even be possible that those who spoke the truth directly today will have a better standing in the GOP than the sycophants who WANT Trump to fall but don't want their voters to know that. Especially if Trump loses to Biden, as Christie publicly predicts. ('Course, people could also blame Christie for bringing Trump down, diverting votes, etc.  It's a gamble.)

Christie also has an aggressive, authoritarian streak which could endear him to some Trump supporters. After what happened to Rubio in the previous GOP debates, I'm betting that each candidate is more worried about him than anyone else. 

I expect a mediocre performance from DeSantis. I think most everyone BUT him will improve their poll numbers in the coming week--taking percentages from him though, not Trump. 

[GMDino]

I guess Trump is trying to send some of his minions to the debate and FOX was hip to the sitch:

️This was on the security table near the metal detectors at the entrance to the debate spin room.

Jason Miller, Justin Caparole and Danny Tiso — all three Trump staffers — are specifically listed as being barred from the debate.
More on our live blog: https://t.co/51xgn19YEF pic.twitter.com/V88DdJDRY9

— Dasha Burns (@DashaBurns) August 23, 2023

[Vas Deferens]

Ronny busts out the old “Betty, the attempted aborted fetus in a pan” bit early.

[*Nately120*]

The first shot at Trump is fired.

[Vas Deferens]

Diet Coke can flung across the room.

[*Nately120*]

They're hitting Vivek with the "we're fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them over here" rhetoric. So the GOP is going back 20 years...that's a small amount of regression for them these days.

Also, I wouldn't have guessed Pence vs Vivek would have been the featured bout.

[Dill]

(08-23-2023, 11:16 PM)Nately120 Wrote: They're hitting Vivek with the "we're fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them over here" rhetoric.  So the GOP is going back 20 years...that's a small amount of regression for them these days.

Also, I wouldn't have guessed Pence vs Vivek would have been the featured bout.

LOL EVERYONE vs VIVEK.  

Haley got some good shots in too--"You don't know foreign policy and it shows!"

And what an unruly crowd.

[Vas Deferens]

1single Percocet!

Really odd delivery there Ronny.

[Rotobeast]

Pence, Christie, DeSantis, and Haley looked solid enough to advance. The others just don't have the presence.

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[HarleyDog]

(08-23-2023, 11:30 PM)Vas Deferens Wrote: 1single Percocet!  

Really odd delivery there Ronny.

I believe he said it was laced with fentanyl.

[Luvnit2]

(08-24-2023, 12:09 AM)Rotobeast Wrote: Pence, Christie, DeSantis, and Haley looked solid enough to advance.  The others just don't have the presence.

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This is my take after debate:

No shot at ever winning a Trump supporter thus no shot at the nomination:
Christie, Pence

Best Debate:
1. Desantis
2. Haley
3. Scott
4. Vivik Ramaswamy 

After debate GOP polling
Trump - 53%
Desantis - 26%
Ramaswamy - 16%

Rest of field less than 10%

[Rotobeast]

(08-24-2023, 12:58 AM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Best Debate:
1. Desantis
2. Haley
3. Scott
4. Vivik Ramaswamy 

I felt like Ramaswamy started out ok, but his inexperience showed in the end. Scott went to the "I'm a child of a single parent" well too often for my liking.

I'd agree Christie doesn't really have a shot. However, I could see him get behind Pence and help him make a ruckus.

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[*pally*]

(08-24-2023, 01:25 AM)Rotobeast Wrote: I felt like Ramaswamy started out ok, but his inexperience showed in the end. Scott went to the "I'm a child of a single parent" well too often for my liking.

I'd agree Christie doesn't really have a shot. However, I could see him get behind Pence and help him make a ruckus.

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Christie won’t support Pence unless he has to. Christie was Trump’s choice to be VP before they talked him into Pence to help with the evangelical vote.

[GMDino]

I did not watch.  None of these guys are running for POTUS right now...they are running for the gop nomination.  So whatever they say is skewed for that audience.

Bus as I read through the stories this morning...oy:

Hey I thought Vivek’s opening sounded a little familiar #DebateNight pic.twitter.com/zwcJTAb6PZ

— philip lewis (@Phil_Lewis_) August 24, 2023

[CJD]

Why did the GOP host a Vice Presidential debate this early in the election cycle?

[GMDino]

(08-24-2023, 09:02 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: Why did the GOP host a Vice Presidential debate this early in the election cycle?

Well, Trump had nothing else to do last night so they figured they'd help him out. 

[masonbengals fan]

I thought Nikki Haley had a good, bordering on great night.

[GMDino]

(08-24-2023, 09:33 AM)masonbengals fan Wrote: I thought Nikki Haley had a good, bordering on great night.

It's funny but as I'm listening to the coverage this morning almost every one of the talking heads had a different take and almost every one of the debaters had someone say they did better or the best.

I suppose it depends a lot on what the listener/viewer was looking for from the debate and maybe pre-debate biases.

Tim Scott isn't getting a lot of love yet though.

[Dill]

(08-24-2023, 09:33 AM)masonbengals fan Wrote: I thought Nikki Haley had a good, bordering on great night.

She seemed the smartest and most competent person on the stage, with a knowledge of 
how government works AND foreign policy. She was the anti-Vivek. 

Haley was also a truth-teller, more clearly identifying the origins of expanded government
spending over the last 6 years--but only up to a point.

Saying she would support Trump were he the nominee seemed to take it all back. That's indirectly
endorsing the Big Lie (or saying it and its consequences were not really consequential) and 
condemning the justice system trying to protect the US from an incompetent and also seditious 
former president. At least Christie and Hutchinson came down on the side of principle. 

The moderators never asked if any candidates still thought the election 
was stolen. Wonder if that was deliberate.

[Mike M (the other one)]

Point blank, if any of these guys bring up Trump, then Trump wins the Debate.