The New NAFTA

[*bfine32*]

While everyone else was worried about Kav's drinking and referring to fart as a kid. The great negotiator was orchestrating a new agreement more beneficial to the US:

https://www.pri.org/stories/2018-10-02/how-new-nafta-different-trade-expert-explains

It also serves as a big FU to China.

[GMDino]

All I heard about this so far is that there are few "major" changes and afew "minor" one.  And that Kushner is getting lots of credit for being the "negotiator".

WTS, I'll be glad if the US gets a better deal.  That will be good for all of us.  Good job.

[Benton]

The original was one of the earliest signs that both major parties don't care much about average voters. This incarnation is more of the same.

It'll do next to nothing to encourage us job growth. It is a great deal for Mexico though, boosting worker income and requiring more production. Doubtful those jobs come back to the US though.

Just surface impression,but the benefits to Mexico look like a barganing chip in convincing them to help build the wall. 'hey, well boost your economy even more, you make some concessions on the wall so the administration doesn't look like complete wimps.'

[jj22]

Minor changes all of which was covered in the TPP Trump and his supporters rallied against. Comedy.

From all accounts, this "new" agreement was just symbolic. Reestablishing the old one.

[Belsnickel]

Trump the populist shows how much he isn't a populist.

[CKwi88]

There are some minor improvements, and Trump deserves credit for that, but as someone who called NAFTA"the worst approved trade deal, maybe ever" this is pretty underwhelming.

But hey, US comes first in the name, campaign promise fulfilled, #MAGA!!!!1!!!!1!!!1!!!1!!!1!

[Au165]

Is this like the great North Korea deal or did this one actually do something?

[*bfine32*]

(10-03-2018, 11:14 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: Trump the populist shows how much he isn't a populist.

Yeah, but is he still a Nationalist ultra-isolationist?

FWIW, I could have gauged the responses before they were typed.

[GMDino]

(10-03-2018, 01:06 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Yeah, but is he still a Nationalist ultra-isolationist?

FWIW, I could have gauged the responses before they were typed.

[*bfine32*]

(10-03-2018, 01:15 PM)GMDino Wrote:

I deserve no accolades; it's like clockwork. For instance I can predict what time it will be in 5 minutes.


As to the deal itself. It seems North American Automakers got a great deal; as did the mechanics that work on the vehicles south of the border. The dairy farming community got a big boost. Our steel tariffs remain in effect and there are much needed protections on Intellectual property.

It also makes it nearly impossible for either neighbor to work a trade deal with China. Seems the biggest drawback will be increase auto costs. So if you're in the market for a new auto, you might want to make the jump.

[GMDino]

(10-03-2018, 01:33 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I deserve no accolades; it's like clockwork. For instance I can predict what time it will be in 5 minutes.


As to the deal itself. It seems North American Automakers got a great deal; as did the mechanics that work on the vehicles south of the border. The dairy farming community got a big boost. Our steel tariffs remain in effect and there are much needed protections on Intellectual property.

It also makes it nearly impossible for either neighbor to work a trade deal with China. Seems the biggest drawback will be increase auto costs. So if you're in the market for a new auto, you might want to make the jump.

Deserve?  No.

But you mention it often enough I thought you needed a little positive feedback.  

[Belsnickel]

(10-03-2018, 01:06 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Yeah, but is he still a Nationalist ultra-isolationist?

FWIW, I could have gauged the responses before they were typed.

I'm not a free-trade fan. One of the only things I liked about Trump was the rhetoric favoring the working class in our country. This is a move in the opposite direction of that. I don't like NAFTA, I don't like the TPP, I don't like this.

And yes, he is still a nationalist. I've never called him an isolationist, or an ultra one, though.

[jj22]

Bfine knew the responses this would get because Bfine was trolling folks acting like Trump had accomplished something (Or he really believed it which I doubt). Trump just signed TPP and suddenly all his supporters are happy. They hypocrisy wouldn't make sense unless you understood the political climate we are in.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2018/10/03/usmca-new-trade-deal-canada-borrows-pact-trump-abandoned/1498224002/

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/10/02/trumps-dairy-fight-with-canada-gets-only-70-million-more-than-tpp.html

[ballsofsteel]

(10-03-2018, 01:47 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I'm not a free-trade fan. One of the only things I liked about Trump was the rhetoric favoring the working class in our country. This is a move in the opposite direction of that. I don't like NAFTA, I don't like the TPP, I don't like this.

And yes, he is still a nationalist. I've never called him an isolationist, or an ultra one, though.

Excuse me. Why would you think that when its been documented that Trump cheated thousands of workers (part of the working class),  out of pay for work done on all his failed real estate deals that he would favor the working class?

[Mike M (the other one)]

Love the Dairy part.
Now we can sell our dairy products there with out all the silly tariffs that keep us out.
Been one of my biggest gripes for ages.

And no more cheap labor in Mexico for autos at least.

[NATI BENGALS]

Econ 101 is telling me if our dairy is being shipped out that lowers the supply and increases the demand...

So my next vehicle will be more expensive and my milk and cheese?

[Millhouse]

Hopefully it wont be as bad as last NAFTA was in drugs coming across. One of those little talked about side effects of NAFTA was the massive increase in illegal drugs coming over from Mexico after NAFTA passed. Coincidentally that led to the Mexican cartels becoming more rich and powerful, which is effecting their current state today.

[Belsnickel]

(10-03-2018, 06:04 PM)ballsofsteel Wrote: Excuse me. Why would think that when its been documented that Trump cheated thousands of workers (part of the working class),  out of pay for work done on all his failed real estate deals?

Oh, I had no delusions about what he would actually do, but it was good rhetoric. It has caused a stir in the political community because it is obvious that the people liked the message given the successes of Trump and Sanders.

[Benton]

(10-03-2018, 01:06 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Yeah, but is he still a Nationalist ultra-isolationist?

FWIW, I could have gauged the responses before they were typed.

Oh, he's no ultra-isolationist and I don't know who ever made that claim. It's hard to gauge all his holdings, but just off what's transparent he makes several hundred million dollars per year in dealings with foreign investors. Much of that from Russian and Chinese investors. He's not a communist, but his business relies heavily on communism. Weird.

(10-03-2018, 07:18 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: And no more cheap labor in Mexico for autos at least.

Which is what makes this a little absurd. Automakers will pass the increased expense on to consumers (mostly in the US), but this does nothing to bring jobs back to the US. So it's just costing US consumers more for boosting Mexico's economy.

[ballsofsteel]

(10-03-2018, 08:36 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Oh, I had no delusions about what he would actually do, but it was good rhetoric. It has caused a stir in the political community because it is obvious that the people liked the message given the successes of Trump and Sanders.

Good rhetoric is right. Its amazing people fall for this BS.
As to Trump's so called "tax cuts", I see now the Repubs want to make the indivdual tax cuts permanent now all of a sudden right before the mid-terms. Why didn't they do this before? Need more fuel for the base?
Doesn't anyone see or care about the long term implications of these "tax cuts"?
Opps, I think I answered my own question. Say anything to keep in power.