White terrorist kills muslims with car

[*michaelsean*]

(06-27-2017, 10:17 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Thankfully this is not necessary as Western society discovered the cure for this some time ago.  The answer to religious extremism is severe intolerance.  Not intolerance of religious belief itself, but intolerance of religious belief that leads to extremist behavior.  Is the Westboro Baptist church not roundly mocked and looked down upon.  Does anyone take them seriously?  

And even the teachings.  I think teaching creationism is close to extinct.  There may be some side by side teaching left.  I'm not sure.  Even my Catholic schools 40 years ago were teaching evolution and the creation story was a myth or metaphor.  Not sure what word I want.  I don't have an issue with teaching about the Bible as it's one of history's most important books, but I have no urge to try to make people believe a certain way, and I believe most people have moved there.

[GMDino]

(06-27-2017, 11:35 AM)michaelsean Wrote: And even the teachings.  I think teaching creationism is close to extinct.  There may be some side by side teaching left.  I'm not sure.  Even my Catholic schools 40 years ago were teaching evolution and the creation story was a myth or metaphor.  Not sure what word I want.  I don't have an issue with teaching about the Bible as it's one of history's most important books, but I have no urge to try to make people believe a certain way, and I believe most people have moved there.

https://mic.com/articles/80179/14-states-use-tax-dollars-to-teach-creationism-in-public-schools#.WLCWGiSO7

Quote:14 States Use Tax Dollars to Teach Creationism in Public Schools


Do you live in Texas, Louisiana or Kentucky? Maybe even Washington, D.C.? Then, as Slate reports, your taxes are likely going to schools — public, private or charter — that are teaching creationism to students. Below is a complete list along with "facts" that are often taught by creationists.

[Benton]

(06-27-2017, 11:42 AM)GMDino Wrote: https://mic.com/articles/80179/14-states-use-tax-dollars-to-teach-creationism-in-public-schools#.WLCWGiSO7

Not saying Kentucky doesn't, but the dots pictured are in Indiana, Tennessee, Ohio and possibly Missouri... but not Kentucky.

[GMDino]

(06-27-2017, 11:45 AM)Benton Wrote: Not saying Kentucky doesn't, but the dots pictured are in Indiana, Tennessee, Ohio and possibly Missouri... but not Kentucky.

And they don't mention it in the listings in the rest of the article.  I missed that in the lead.

[Dill]

(06-27-2017, 11:35 AM)michaelsean Wrote: And even the teachings.  I think teaching creationism is close to extinct.  There may be some side by side teaching left.  I'm not sure.  Even my Catholic schools 40 years ago were teaching evolution and the creation story was a myth or metaphor.  Not sure what word I want.  I don't have an issue with teaching about the Bible as it's one of history's most important books, but I have no urge to try to make people believe a certain way, and I believe most people have moved there.

In Fairfax County VA, middle school teachers of biology must read a statement at the beginning of the term that evolution and creation are both "equally" explanations of how life originated. Then after that they must not discuss evolution. Not sure what happens in HS.

42% of Americans still believe god created us as we are now.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/21814/evolution-creationism-intelligent-design.aspx

Also, another large percentage belief in intelligent design. Mike Pence may fit into this group.

I think the Bible should be taught as a book formative of European/US culture, or at least offered as an elective, in high schools.

[Benton]

(06-27-2017, 11:57 AM)GMDino Wrote: And they don't mention it in the listings in the rest of the article.  I missed that in the lead.

It happens. In the writer's defense, it's sort of like the Bengals: we were ranked so low for so long, the Commonwealth just comes to mind when talking about the worst. 

I've been pretty proud of Kentucky's educational growth the last couple decades. We were one of the last public non-voucher hold outs, and we were improving year after year. 

[Dill]

(06-27-2017, 10:47 AM)Benton Wrote: You put the facts out there — all of them — and let the reader make their own decision. Like giving someone a jigsaw puzzle. You give them all the pieces and the picture they make from it is their own, even if they force a few of the corners here and there. 

What you're asking is possible. I've had it happen to me (the one that always sticks out is I had an editor that was opposed to anything the local school board did, and he pretty well murdered everything I wrote to make them sound as bad as possible). But it should not happen, and the majority of reporters and editors are opposed to it. Just like putting an individual's beliefs into a story, that's not really journalism.

You have to select which facts to put out there though, right?

Also, I am not just talking about an editor with an axe to grind. I noticed that during the Vietnam War, journalists often were overwhelmed with "data" and so had to make choices about what to report. Many lacked area knowledge about Indochina, and this affected what they selected to report. They could not tell what, in hindsight, was relevant. They often confused the actions of very different groups. Some gradually realized the problem when they were on the spot in Vietnam, though editors back home did not.

The problem has continued into the present wars.

[*michaelsean*]

(06-27-2017, 12:30 PM)Dill Wrote: In Fairfax County VA, middle school teachers of biology must read a statement at the beginning of the term that evolution and creation are both "equally" explanations of how life originated. Then after that they must not discuss evolution. Not sure what happens in HS.

42% of Americans still believe god created us as we are now.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/21814/evolution-creationism-intelligent-design.aspx

Also, another large percentage belief in intelligent design. Mike Pence may fit into this group.

I think the Bible should be taught as a book formative of European/US culture, or at least offered as an elective, in high schools.

Not just Mike Pence, but I would think virtually every person of faith believes in intelligent design unless I'm misunderstanding the term.  I understand it to mean God had some role in at least kicking off the process.  

[*michaelsean*]

(06-27-2017, 11:42 AM)GMDino Wrote: https://mic.com/articles/80179/14-states-use-tax-dollars-to-teach-creationism-in-public-schools#.WLCWGiSO7

I did mean to say public schools.  Private schools teaching creationism and receiving funding doesn't mean much.  Their parents pay taxes and they receive money for things such as non-religious texts, bus service etc.  

[Benton]

(06-27-2017, 12:39 PM)Dill Wrote: You have to select which facts to put out there though, right?

Also, I am not just talking about an editor with an axe to grind. I noticed that during the Vietnam War, journalists often were overwhelmed with "data" and so had to make choices about what to report. Many lacked area knowledge about Indochina, and this affected what they selected to report. They could not tell what, in hindsight, was relevant. They often confused the actions of very different groups. Some gradually realized the problem when they were on the spot in Vietnam, though editors back home did not.

The problem has continued into the present wars.

Similar to some of the problems covering the ME. I'm local and don't do any of that kind of coverage, but I thought I was fairly well informed on what was going on over there... until a friend of mine in the military made a napkin flow chart over coffee one night explaining just who everybody was.

But that's not embedding opinions consciously or otherwise. You try to put as much factual information out there as you can. You can't fit everything into every story and stories get less and less in depth as reader and viewer attention spans shrink. But the trend (both financially motivated and readership pattern motivated) has been to chop the same information up. If you're doing a story on a bank robbery what would have been one story 30 years ago is probably going to be 3 or 4 now as you pull out the robbery, the suspect, the police response.

[Griever]

(06-27-2017, 12:30 PM)Dill Wrote: In Fairfax County VA, middle school teachers of biology must read a statement at the beginning of the term that evolution and creation are both "equally" explanations of how life originated. Then after that they must not discuss evolution. Not sure what happens in HS.

42% of Americans still believe god created us as we are now.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/21814/evolution-creationism-intelligent-design.aspx

Also, another large percentage belief in intelligent design. Mike Pence may fit into this group.

I think the Bible should be taught as a book formative of European/US culture, or at least offered as an elective, in high schools.

when i was in high school bible was an elective

was an easy A too

[Dill]

(06-27-2017, 01:40 PM)Griever Wrote: when i was in high school bible was an elective

was an easy A too

What did they have you read?

[Dill]

(06-27-2017, 12:59 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Not just Mike Pence, but I would think virtually every person of faith believes in intelligent design unless I'm misunderstanding the term.  I understand it to mean God had some role in at least kicking off the process.  

Well, it is a term used by creation "science" to replace "creationism" in textbooks, or at least that is how it started. Now there are degreed biologists who are trying to develop it into a scientific theory. They grant the overall tendency of evolution, but latch onto fuzzy areas where they think the sudden appearance of complexity means a controlling "intelligence" must account for it.

It is still Paley's clockwork argument, just reduced and applied to different points in the course of evolution.

[Matt_Crimson]

(06-27-2017, 01:18 PM)Benton Wrote: But that's not embedding opinions consciously or otherwise. You try to put as much factual information out there as you can. You can't fit everything into every story and stories get less and less in depth as reader and viewer attention spans shrink. But the trend (both financially motivated and readership pattern motivated) has been to chop the same information up. If you're doing a story on a bank robbery what would have been one story 30 years ago is probably going to be 3 or 4 now as you pull out the robbery, the suspect, the police response.

Yeah, news is much more opinion than "news". It's why news programs spend hours talking about the same thing because everyone feels the need to inject their opinions in the matter rather than focus on facts. Imagine how much news could actually be covered throughout the day if it wasn't so opinion based.

I think it is good to have opinions mixed with news, but it seems pretty over saturated with the constant "I think" and "I feel.

[*michaelsean*]

(06-27-2017, 01:54 PM)Dill Wrote: Well, it is a term used by creation "science" to replace "creationism" in textbooks, or at least that is how it started. Now there are degreed biologists who are trying to develop it into a scientific theory. They grant the overall tendency of evolution, but latch onto fuzzy areas where they think the sudden appearance of complexity means a controlling "intelligence" must account for it.

It is still Paley's clockwork argument, just reduced and applied to different points in the course of evolution.

Oh well I don't think intelligent design should be taught in public schools either,  but I would say that most people who believe in God believe in it.  Maybe not like you described, but God as the unmoved mover.  The uncaused cause or the first cause.

[Griever]

(06-27-2017, 01:44 PM)Dill Wrote: What did they have you read?

the teacher taught it like a history class, and focused mainly on the major and minor prophets of the bible

[*michaelsean*]

(06-27-2017, 02:46 PM)Griever Wrote: the teacher taught it like a history class, and focused mainly on the major and minor prophets of the bible

Oh I thought he was making a joke.

[BmorePat87]

(06-27-2017, 12:30 PM)Dill Wrote: In Fairfax County VA, middle school teachers of biology must read a statement at the beginning of the term that evolution and creation are both "equally" explanations of how life originated. Then after that they must not discuss evolution. Not sure what happens in HS.

Can you get a source for this? Fairfax County isn't too far from me and very similar to my own county. I seriously doubt this is their current policy and any sources I could find date between 1995-1999.

[Griever]

(06-27-2017, 03:15 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Oh I thought he was making a joke.

nope, it was an elective in NC

might not be in other states, but like i said, it was an easy A and it was my senior year and i had half days at school anyways

[*michaelsean*]

(06-27-2017, 04:33 PM)Griever Wrote: nope, it was an elective in NC

might not be in other states, but like i said, it was an easy A and it was my senior year and i had half days at school anyways

No when he asked what they had you read.  You know.  In a Bible class.