Storming Of The Capitol Building

[Benton]

(01-12-2021, 01:50 PM)Mer Wrote: I'm not going to waste my time reading all the MSM stupidity that is most likely being spread in all the previous pages. I will tell you this:

I was at the capital on January 6th and I can give you a first hand account. Everyone there that I encountered were wonderful, peace loving Americans. There was a lot of prayer and patriotism. When it was time to walk to the capital building a bus pulled up and a bunch of people dressed in black with helmets and clear shields came out and stormed the capital. Now you can assume whatever you want but I know those people were not Trump supporters. I saw the whole thing with my own eyes.

Buckle up!  You're all about to see history happen in the next 8 days. Please remember when it's all done that we're all Americans and on the same side.  May God Bless you all and keep you safe.

If you say that's what happened, ok, I don't have reason to doubt you 

But it raises the question: at what point did they undress, smear on body paint,throwing trump shirts, etc? And why was a republican lawmaker with them? 

[Rotobeast]

(01-12-2021, 03:50 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: The real question is how do we pull it back, a question no one seems to have an answer for.

My money is on a small scale "Independence Day" alien invasion.
(The threat was obviously there to create Space Force, right ?)

Nothing brings us together like slaughtering the enemy of the week.

[*Nately120*]

(01-12-2021, 04:03 PM)Au165 Wrote: Isn't the whole thing about terrorism is they are trying to manipulate your life and actions through fear? So they are saying we shouldn't do something because of...the threat of more terrorism? I am pretty sure this is what the mob did when there were threats of prosecution, they would "make an example" out of people to deter prosecutors from coming after them.

Letting Trump off the hook AGAIN is like declining to go after Osama Bin Laden AGAIN.


Trump is a repeat offender and his "shoulda been" rap sheet is long as hell. It's pretty wacky. I'm sure getting away with this will calm him down though.

[BigPapaKain]

(01-12-2021, 03:52 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Dead is dead.  You can certainly make a point that the Capitol incident is the worst single day incident, but the time frame of the deaths to me is unimportant and I'm sure it's unimportant to the families of the deceased.

I should point out that the 2nd half of my statement was meant to be a joke.

[Au165]

(01-12-2021, 04:05 PM)Benton Wrote: If you say that's what happened, ok, I don't have reason to doubt you 

But it raises the question: at what point did they undress, smear on body paint,throwing trump shirts, etc? And why was a republican lawmaker with them? 

It also doesn't explain why everyone who has been caught on video committing the crimes has turned out to be right-wing nuts who post constantly on social media about Trump and a stolen election. It's possible it was all a deep state ploy to plant people for months, even years, just so they could send them in to commit crimes then get caught.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(01-12-2021, 04:05 PM)BigPapaKain Wrote: I should point out that the 2nd half of my statement was meant to be a joke.

No worries, and I didn't take it as you being flippant or dismissive.

[GMDino]

(01-12-2021, 04:05 PM)Rotobeast Wrote: My money is on a small scale "Independence Day" alien invasion.
(The threat was obviously there to create Space Force, right ?)

Nothing brings us together like slaughtering the enemy of the week.

All seriousness aside actually holding people who threw the gas on the wood and then told people throw a match on it might be a good start.

But it seems when we want to hold people responsible for the things they do that gets frowned upon.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(01-12-2021, 04:05 PM)Rotobeast Wrote: My money is on a small scale "Independence Day" alien invasion.
(The threat was obviously there to create Space Force, right ?)

Nothing brings us together like slaughtering the enemy of the week.

Maybe China can nut up and we can vent our spleen on them? 

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(01-12-2021, 04:13 PM)GMDino Wrote: But it seems when we want to hold people responsible for the things they do that gets frowned upon.

Except you have no issue with it when it's the DA in Los Angeles doing exactly that.  I'm loving the inconsistency. 

[CJD]

(01-12-2021, 03:02 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: https://www.forbes.com/sites/jemimamcevoy/2020/06/08/14-days-of-protests-19-dead/?sh=36170914de4f

As of 06/08/20 there were 19 deaths directly related to the protests.  I think it's only logical to assume a few more have occurred in the intervening six and half months.

See, we can condemn the incident at the Capitol Building without resorting to hyperbole or falsehoods.

I was actually looking over the deaths that were associated with the protests too. I knew 19 people had died but I didn't know if they were killed by protesters or were protesters (the difference is relevant, in my opinion, when discussing left violence) and who was responsible for those deaths. As far as I can tell, all the deaths can be broken down to the following six categories. And, in the interest of steel manning the argument that the protests are responsible for many deaths, let's assume that every police shooting was justified and every person killed by looters or robbers is also attributed to the protesters.



First category:
Third party (unrelated to police and were not protesters/looters) killed by protesters:
This category has four deaths, Chris Beaty, Victor Cazares Jr, John Tiggs and Jose Gutierrez. The first two were killed defending either their shop or a shop that they felt inclined to defend. The latter two were killed, seemingly, by circumstance during the robbery of a shop they were not related to (at least as far as I can tell from the news reports I've read). All 4 will be attributed to the protests.

Second category:
Looters killed by third party:
Calvin Horton Jr, James Scurlock and an unidentified man (according to the Forbes article) were killed in what appears to be self defense by shp owners. All three will be attributed to the protests.
There was also a guy who apparently blew himself up trying to destroy an ATM, so let's just throw him in here as well, making 4 total from this category.

Third category:
Protesters killed by police:
Marquise Tousant, David McAtee and Jorge Gomez were all killed by the police. Tousant may have been a victim of the same ambush that targeted the police that killed him, it's unclear. McAtee and Gomez allegedly were armed when killed by police. McAtee had reportedly fired on the police whereas Gomez had not, but they both posed a threat to the police. I'd like to attribute only 2 to the protests here since we don't know what happened with Tousant, but if Tousant was killed by protesters shooting on the police, then this one should also be attributed to the protests, so let's say all 3 are because of the protests.

Fourth category:
Protesters killed by a third party:
Barry Perkins, Italia Kelly, Marvin Francois and Robert Forbes were protesters who were killed by someone other than the police.  Perkins was run over by a FedEx truck. The FedEx driver claims he saw two people with guns and panicked, running Perkins over in the process. Kelly was killed as she was leaving a protest. Initially, police believe she was killed by other protesters, but then they found out she was actually killed by her sister's best friend and suspect that he may have tried to use the protests to "disguise" his murder as just wanton violence. Francois was a protester who was coming home after photographing the recent peaceful protest when he was killed getting in his car. It's not clear if the robbers were associated with the protests at all or if they were just out for his car. Forbes was run over while attending a peaceful protest. The driver apparently got away and was later killed in Mexico. No indications that he was killed because of this murder.

This group I'm not certain what to make of. All four did nothing wrong. Kelly's death and Forbes' death were clearly not caused by the protests (other than the time and place was made possible because of the protest), but Francois and Perkins are a little less cut and dry. Can you blame the protests because the FedEx driver thinks he saw a gun and panicked? I'm not certain. I'm inclined to attribute none of these deaths to the protests, but I'd understand if you want to attribute Perkins' death to them, since the FedEx driver was obviously under duress due to fear of being robbed.

Fifth category:
Police killed by Protesters:
Dave Patrick Underwood and David Dorn were both killed protecting property and, under the aforementioned steel man clause, will be attributed directly to the protesters.

Sixth category:
Indeterminate cause/undetermined if it was associated with the protests:
Javar Harrell and Dorian Murrell. Harrell was not a protester or police and was not shot protecting any property. Police indicate they are not even certain his death was related to the protests at all, as written in the Forbes article. Murrell was killed by a man who immediately turned himself in. The man who killed him said that he was confronted by a group of 10 people and was shoved to the ground. He pulled his gun and fired, killing Murrell. Murrell's friends say there was no physical altercation prior to the shooting. The killer has been charged with murder. I call it undetermined because it's not clear what the killer had to do with the protests, if anything. However, there is an article that believes Murrell may have been part of the group that robbed and subsequently killed Chris Beaty from the first category. So, given our steel man clause, let's attribute Murrell's death to the protests, and Harrell's death will be remain indeterminate.

That leaves the death toll directly caused by the protesters/looters or incited by the protesters/looters at 14 deaths, with the 4 from the fourth category and the 1 from the sixth category left out.

This is, of course, assuming every looter was a protester which, as you know, I completely disagree with but I understand why you feel that way.

I've been meaning to do this for a while just so I had a better understanding of exactly what caused these deaths and how we could categorize them and your post was just a good reason for me to take the time to do it. Thanks for the link! :)

[Rotobeast]

(01-12-2021, 04:16 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Maybe China can nut up and we can vent our spleen on them? 

I doubt it.
They'd hate to forfeit our debt like that.

[BrownAssClown]

I wonder if Trump will make a speech telling those groups that are planning more "protest" this coming weekend and early next week to protest peacefully or not protest at all and finally accept the results of the free and fair election that had taken place. Hell, who am I kidding, of course he won't. It's all about the Donald! The more blood spilled over him the better in his eyes. If he can't get his way might as cause as much mayhem as possible on the way out, after all he was ROBBED for god's sake! Love him or hate him, you won't soon forget him because he and his cult wouldn't have it any other way.

[Bengalzona]

(01-12-2021, 01:50 PM)Mer Wrote: I'm not going to waste my time reading all the MSM stupidity that is most likely being spread in all the previous pages. I will tell you this:

I was at the capital on January 6th and I can give you a first hand account. Everyone there that I encountered were wonderful, peace loving Americans. There was a lot of prayer and patriotism. When it was time to walk to the capital building a bus pulled up and a bunch of people dressed in black with helmets and clear shields came out and stormed the capital. Now you can assume whatever you want but I know those people were not Trump supporters. I saw the whole thing with my own eyes.

Buckle up!  You're all about to see history happen in the next 8 days. Please remember when it's all done that we're all Americans and on the same side.  May God Bless you all and keep you safe.

Interesting. Those guys must not have stopped to take selfies, eh.

Except for this guy, but he probably wasn't on the buses because he brought his mom with him:

[Rotobeast]

(01-12-2021, 04:50 PM)Bengalzona Wrote: Interesting. Those guys must not have stopped to take selfies, eh.

Except for this guy, but he probably wasn't on the buses because he brought his mom with him:

Chicken nuggies don't fix themselves, you know !

[Au165]

GOP leaders today told members to not speak out against other members of their own party who do vote to impeach Trump in fear that they would be physically harmed. That is where we are right now...it is literal terrorism.

[*Nately120*]

Trump is speaking now at the border. He said China virus and China plague, so I guess he's back to talking about covid, technically.

[GMDino]

(01-12-2021, 05:27 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Trump is speaking now at the border.  He said China virus and China plague, so I guess he's back to talking about covid, technically.

Right now?  While they are talking to about all the charges they are filing against his followers?

Weird.  It's like he wants to distract from that.

Too bad the news station aren't carrying him....

[Au165]

DJ currently giving a briefing. 70+ charged with over 170 open investigations still pending. Charges range from misdemeanors to potentially sedition and Murder. They noted many will be charged with misdemeanors first so they can further investigate much larger crimes as they go. He mentioned people will be shocked as they investigate significant sedition and conspiracy charges.

This is just the U.S. Attorney General's Office and does not include charges that could be brought by other jurisdictions.

[masonbengals fan]

(01-12-2021, 04:13 PM)GMDino Wrote: All seriousness aside actually holding people who threw the gas on the wood and then told people throw a match on it might be a good start.

But it seems when we want to hold people responsible for the things they do that gets frowned upon.

Some people or all people ? 

 I'll vote for all. 

[Lucidus]

(01-12-2021, 01:50 PM)Mer Wrote: I'm not going to waste my time reading all the MSM stupidity that is most likely being spread in all the previous pages. I will tell you this:

I was at the capital on January 6th and I can give you a first hand account. Everyone there that I encountered were wonderful, peace loving Americans. There was a lot of prayer and patriotism. When it was time to walk to the capital building a bus pulled up and a bunch of people dressed in black with helmets and clear shields came out and stormed the capital. Now you can assume whatever you want but I know those people were not Trump supporters. I saw the whole thing with my own eyes.

Buckle up!  You're all about to see history happen in the next 8 days. Please remember when it's all done that we're all Americans and on the same side.  May God Bless you all and keep you safe.

Your comments are a perversion of reality. When you assert that is was a group of nefarious "men in black" that actually invaded the Capital, you are purposely ignoring and / or being dishonest about the actuality of what transpired by way of photos, video, accounts from law enforcement and social media posting from Trump supporters who recorded themselves and others actually partaking in the seditious events. 

To proclaim that all was peaceful and patriotic is to spit in the face of reality, in order to spin a false narrative that attempts to provide cover to those that knowingly committed treason. It's an approach often adopted by the cowardly -- refusing to own the very actions they assert to be righteous.