Holy ********* Crazy

[Belsnickel]

(06-01-2017, 12:34 PM)xxlt Wrote: I get the criticism of the 1D chart. I also get that a lot of them exist because they are simple to read, particularly for the political neophyte. I would be delighted to see where you or anyone else critical of that placement would place libertarians (libertarians in the US in the current era) on the admittedly flawed 1D chart. Would they be just left of communist? Just right of communist? Would they be right where socialist is? Are all the born again libertarians really socialists just afraid to call themselves that because their daddy Rupert told them socialists are evil for so long they can't get it out of their heads, even though they are starting to think maybe daddy didn't always know best?

Again, it was not my chart, but it was pretty consistent with everything I have read or seen visually represented (including more artful and complex representations). We have had more than one person here call fascists leftists and communists right wingers, so perhaps this is another one of those post racial and post factual moments where left and right mean whatever you want - and you call your opponent whatever you think will hurt her more, be it a no good lefty or a no good righty!

So, I don't know what would be a good visualization for these sorts of things. I know that I could see a compilation of many 1D charts for components of the various political ideologies would be eye-opening. You mention libertarianism being around communism, and what is interesting is that on several of those charts those two would be very close to each other. At least as the ideologies are typically looked at in theory in the realm of political science.

I get what you are saying, though. I make the comment that people on here would call me a communist, or just to the right of Stalin, but that my ideological bent is center-left on the global scale. So perspectives on the left-right spectrum in this country are skewed because of the shift to the right leaving a center/center-right party that is left of a party on the right. I mean, there are ways that the Democrats are more conservative than the center-right CDU/CSU party in Germany. Of course, I am speaking of the way these politicians in these parties vote in their blocs in Congress. Since the parties themselves don't really care about policy in this country and the politicians themselves don't have to adhere to the party's platform, it's hard to really assign these things.

(06-01-2017, 12:34 PM)xxlt Wrote: Oh, and for the record, I have said more than once that there are nuggets of libertarian thought that are really appealing. In total though, I see it as problematic and moving toward, yes, fascism. (I know you know this Belsnickel, but for those who don't, know that does not mean I think libertarians where swastikas and want to kill Jews! Many people mistakenly think the Third Riech was the beginning and end of fascism. It wasn't. And more than one political scientist told me over a decade ago they were concerned America was flirting with fascism. I believe with Trump's ascension they would be even more frightened and not because of his worship of "strong men" leaders, but because of his policy leanings.)

The Republican party in America has moved so far right (toward fascism) that many commentators acknowledge that former shining stars Nixon and Reagan would not be accepted in the party today. The Democratic party has moved right too. So, rather than having two parties either side of the moderate middle, we have one to the right of the moderate middle (the Democratic party) and one far to the right of the moderate middle and moving at warp speed if people like McConnell and Trump have their way.

I split your post up and typed up my part one response before reading this section. I took a walk around the quad, then came back to my office and read this more thoroughly. I find it funny that I said the same thing you said in the last portion, here. But yes, the GOP and the way their elected officials have been voting in a group is more akin to the AfD or Front national rather than the CDU/CSU or, say, Les Républicains, which is where the GOP under Reagan and Nixon would have aligned with.