(05-07-2021, 11:54 AM)J24 Wrote: 1.) Hendrickson was a product of the players around him in New Orleans. It would be a surprise if he has the same success here as he did last season.

2.) Both Oassai and Sample are rookie expecting them to be significant contributors is not smart.

1) And he will be playing here beside Reader, Ogunjobi and Hubbard. I suspect he will do just fine.

2)Yeah, we never have rookies be contributors..... 

(05-07-2021, 12:02 PM)TJ528 Wrote: Sled that's the problem though.  You shouldn't have to take that comment public for it to be addressed in the lock room. 

Evidently he wasn't being heard or listened to so he figured he'd tell the press the communications issues as well.  

Hey, I never said Lou is perfect. He was called out on the issue and it was fixed however. 

(05-07-2021, 12:14 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Lots of people saying TE is a weakness.  And I don't think it has to do with Uzo's injury.

If he is healthy then we have a very solid TE corps.  Not elite, but I think most people here think there are pore elite TEs putting up huge receiving numbers than there really are.

Since we don't use TE all that much, if we are going to be weak at a position, that's the one I would pick.

(05-07-2021, 11:54 AM)J24 Wrote: 1.) Hendrickson was a product of the players around him in New Orleans. It would be a surprise if he has the same success here as he did last season.

2.) Both Oassai and Sample are rookie expecting them to be significant contributors is not smart.

I definitely agree with this.  Hendrickson was a product of the players around him New Orleans.  New Orleans had good DB's.  New Orleans had a good defense.   They have other players on the DL.   We had none of that last season.  

Anyone who's expecting Hendrickson to have 15 or 16 sacks this season in Cincy this season might want to temper those expectations and lower them to something obtainable like 7 or 8 at max.  

When it come to draft picks I never expect them to come in and make an instant impact.  Usually the biggest impact is their 2nd or 3 years.  They get comfortable with the offense or defense systems, players, the speed of the game, atmophere, practice schedule.  Everything is different in the NFL than college.  That's why i personally would expect Chase to come in this year and get 900 yards and 5 TD's.  There's 2 other great receivers on this team and not everyone's going to have 1,400 and 10 TD's, especially in their first season. 

(05-07-2021, 11:46 AM)Sled21 Wrote: And we brought in an All Pro FA DE to help with that, and drafted Ossai and others to help that out.

They also lost their best pass rusher from last year in free agency.  And throwing some mid round picks on some lineman won't necessarily make any significant impact year one.

(05-07-2021, 12:37 PM)TJ528 Wrote: I definitely agree with this.  Hendrickson was a product of the players around him New Orleans.  New Orleans had good DB's.  New Orleans had a good defense.   They have other players on the DL.   We had none of that last season.  

Anyone who's expecting Hendrickson to have 15 or 16 sacks this season in Cincy this season might want to temper those expectations and lower them to something obtainable like 7 or 8 at max.

When it come to draft picks I never expect them to come in and make an instant impact.  Usually the biggest impact is their 2nd or 3 years.  They get comfortable with the offense or defense systems, players, the speed of the game, atmophere, practice schedule.  Everything is different in the NFL than college.  That's why i personally would expect Chase to come in this year and get 900 yards and 5 TD's.  There's 2 other great receivers on this team and not everyone's going to have 1,400 and 10 TD's, especially in their first season. 

Yup

I'm hoping he can get 7-10 range.

Part of having a player with sack totals like Hendrickson
Put up is relative to.your offense.
Since the Saints could put up points in.the 30 with ease
And having leads quite abit it forces the other team to play
From.behind aka throw the ball more than.they want too.

If a your on defense and in the 4th q. The other team is
Up by 8 or 10...they will be content to just run power fball
Or when they throw the depth of the dropback is smaller
And the release of the ball is faster.

(05-07-2021, 11:46 AM)Sled21 Wrote: And we brought in an All Pro FA DE to help with that, and drafted Ossai and others to help that out.

All Pro FA DE is...Hendrickson?
If so, Hendrickson didn't make All Pro nor did he make Pro Bowl.
The edge rushers that made All Pro were TJ Watt and Myles Garrett.
Hendrickson didn't even make 2nd Team All Pro, who were Khalil Mack and Za'Darius Smith.

Well the o-line is fixed, so that’s not a weakness anymore. The linebackers are weak, and so is the wr depth behind the big 3.

Not sure if it was mentioned yet but one area of concern for the Bengals has to be the secondary.

Now wait... don't freak out. I know they were active and made moves but all the moves were to get guys that fit the zone scheme that Lou wants to run. If the zone fails, there is a lack of man cover corners in the secondary.

If the zone works, no worries but this should be a concern especially against the higher tier QBs in the league that can pick zones apart.

(05-07-2021, 01:53 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Not sure if it was mentioned yet but one area of concern for the Bengals has to be the secondary.

Now wait... don't freak out. I know they were active and made moves but all the moves were to get guys that fit the zone scheme that Lou wants to run. If the zone fails, there is a lack of man cover corners in the secondary.

If the zone works, no worries but this should be a concern especially against the higher tier QBs in the league that can pick zones apart.

Murdock, this was my initial thought during free agency.  They brought in all these player especially DB's who are familiar and excel in zone defense.  What happens if that defense fails this year and Lou's ass is kicked out the door mid season?  What happens if Zac's staff is fired at the end of the season?  

You really don't have any personnel on defense that allows you to play any man to man defense.  So you're stuck playing zone until you can bring in different players in free agency again.  

(05-06-2021, 11:23 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: We're still not getting a ton of respect around the league, in the media, or even really on this board, so my question is: what are this team's weaknesses?  What's keeping us from being mentioned as contenders or even sleepers?

I like our team, and I realize that the division's tough, but is it just that and uncertainty?

The only major weaknesses that I see on our team are the offensive line (but they should be majorly improved), inside linebacker, and maybe defensive line but that's just because they're young and I think keeping them in a rotation could make for a solid squad.

Maybe throw in Taylor as a weakness.  

What do you see as this team's weaknesses?

Our coaching #1, followed by the unknown.

We certainly addressed our needs IMO. We just don't know how it will turn out or will be negated cause of poor coaching.

(05-07-2021, 02:50 PM)TJ528 Wrote: Murdock, this was my initial thought during free agency.  They brought in all these player especially DB's who are familiar and excel in zone defense.  What happens if that defense fails this year and Lou's ass is kicked out the door mid season?  What happens if Zac's staff is fired at the end of the season?  

You really don't have any personnel on defense that allows you to play any man to man defense.  So you're stuck playing zone until you can bring in different players in free agency again.  

Certainly tossed all their eggs in one basket.

And you are correct, if the defense fails and Lou is gone the rebuild after that will be kind of horrible.

I also really question basically telling every team you are going to face all season that hey, we are a zone team. Just seems like it would be easier to game-plan against.

(05-07-2021, 02:56 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Certainly tossed all their eggs in one basket.

And you are correct, if the defense fails and Lou is gone the rebuild after that will be kind of horrible.

I also really question basically telling every team you are going to face all season that hey, we are a zone team. Just seems like it would be easier to game-plan against.

We aren't all Zone with the guys we brought in, they can play Man. The problem with guys like WJ3 is they were horrible in Zone.

You have to be able to play both.

(05-07-2021, 03:00 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: We aren't all Zone with the guys we brought in, they can play Man. The problem with guys like WJ3 is they were horrible in Zone.

You have to be able to play both.

Fair enough, I was reading about Hilton and the Cowboys guy whose name I won't try to spell and it was talking about how they excel in zone coverage. It seems like the general consensus was the Bengals let guys go who were better suited for man and struggled in zone for guys who were better suited for zone and struggled in man.

(05-07-2021, 02:56 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Certainly tossed all their eggs in one basket.

And you are correct, if the defense fails and Lou is gone the rebuild after that will be kind of horrible.

I also really question basically telling every team you are going to face all season that hey, we are a zone team. Just seems like it would be easier to game-plan against.

It's kinda like basketball.  If you're playing someone and you can't stop them man to man you usually will switch it up to a zone defense.  

Well if you have personnel only for zone defense and that's your bread and butter you better be damn good at that zone or else they're gonna eat you alive if you ever have to switch to man to man.  

(05-07-2021, 03:04 PM)Murdock2420 Wrote: Fair enough, I was reading about Hilton and the Cowboys guy whose name I won't try to spell and it was talking about how they excel in zone coverage. It seems like the general consensus was the Bengals let guys go who were better suited for man and struggled in zone for guys who were better suited for zone and struggled in man.

Awuzie, yeah, he is a very good Zone Corner as is Hilton, but they CAN play Man. WJ3 couldn't and I guess they wanted a stud
blitzing Slot Corner. These guys fit the bill, Waynes is my questionable Corner right now. Bringing in Ricardo Allen was a good
move too and I think underrated, he can play Corner too as well as FS or as a nickel LB same as Vonn.

Allen is kind of a swiss army knife player for us.

(05-07-2021, 03:10 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Awuzie, yeah, he is a very good Zone Corner as is Hilton, but they CAN play Man. WJ3 couldn't and I guess they wanted a stud
blitzing Slot Corner. These guys fit the bill, Waynes is my questionable Corner right now. Bringing in Ricardo Allen was a good
move too and I think underrated, he can play Corner too as well as FS or as a nickel LB same as Vonn.

Allen is kind of a swiss army knife player for us.

I would also say that we went for secondary players who are ABLE to play Man but who are excellent in Zone. What they aren't is flashy. Like our draft our Free Agency was meat and potatoes. What we had before (the players we let leave) we people who in Man were effective but in zone were incompetent. We also were doing what ZT said needed to happen once the season ended - restock the depth. When the "next man up" is someone like LeShaun Sims the result is disaster (and yes I know the injury/opt-out avalanche on the DL would have ruined ANY team's defensive line). 

As to Hendrickson, I actually went and studied the stats at Pro Football Reference - and what I saw did not support this notion that he was made off of the success of others. What it did support was he broke into the starting lineup late in 2019 and in 2020 he was a force. Yes you can say one year wonder and yes it is a small gamble on his 2020 being his new norm, but a worthwhile wager to take. At worst he is the same as Lawson and the upside is considerable. Then there is Ogunboji at DT who gives us the interior pass rush that was absent last year. Hubbard is competent at his spot and not only may bring more results in this lineup but has a platoon mate who is a top EDGE prospect out of college. 

So on to the topic at hand....weaknesses.

Well, one for sure is game day coaching and scheming. We do not always seem to scheme properly to get the best out of our players. Lou especially is guilty of this but you also saw it in some of the offensive play designs.

Another possible weakness is ability to create turnovers. Yes we improved our secondary abilities in zone scheme coverage and also tackling and rushing the passer. But the only true ball hawk back there is Bates. So I think we may see more passes broken up and such but not a lot of INTs. In the same vein our DTs and LBs seem sound but are not notable as turnover forcers.

Finally of course, there is the potential of a rocky start as the new pieces all need play time to fit together properly. Hopefully we can manage at least .500 while they are adjusting then go on a tear.

(05-07-2021, 01:24 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Yup

I'm hoping he can get 7-10 range.

If he can get 7-10 sacks that would be a huge plus, and with the talent we are surrounding him with on the DL I can see it happening. I'm just glad we got him and Hubbard some depth in the draft. I remember when we had a really sweet rotation of guys on the DL. Our D was fun to watch back then. 


Overall I think the coaches and FO have done a good job addressing weaknesses, and now its just staying healthy and coaching. The sky is the limit for this young team in my eyes. Not saying we are going to win a playoff game this year, but I'll be surprised if we dont finish .500 or above if this draft pans out and we can stay relatively healthy.