(05-25-2022, 02:36 PM)ochocincos Wrote: While Alexander can give his opinion to Mike Brown, he's not employed by the Bengals. So if Mike Brown (and Bengals staff) values Alexander's opinion still and chose to make a decision on that, that's on them.

Right. 

The argument was that Alexander didn't have any influence on the pick. Which was 100% false. 

(05-25-2022, 03:28 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Right. 

The argument was that Alexander didn't have any influence on the pick. Which was 100% false. 

I mean if he did, it's only because Mike Brown/the Bengals organization allowed him to.
His opinion *shouldn't* have any influence on it though.
That decision should 100% be owned internally.

(05-25-2022, 03:35 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I mean if he did, it's only because Mike Brown/the Bengals organization allowed him to.
His opinion *shouldn't* have any influence on it though.
That decision should 100% be owned internally.

Why? 

Companies hire outside consultants all the time to help with decision making. 

(05-25-2022, 03:41 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Why? 

Companies hire outside consultants all the time to help with decision making. 

Did Alexander say he was hired as a consultant? Or was it actually just reached out to by Mike Brown to ask for his thoughts?
The way it was phrased, it sounded more like the latter.

To me, that's like you reaching out to your friend, who is a vet but not the vet you take your pet to, asking about whether you should be concerned about your pet eating something.
The vet friend says no, so you choose not to and something bad happens to your pet.

Are you going to blame your vet friend just because they gave you their opinion when asked and you trust them?
Or is the onus on you because you chose to go that route for advice compared to actually talking with your own vet that you pay?

(Maybe that's a bad example, but it made sense in my head lol)

(05-25-2022, 01:44 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: I thought Jackson gave a pretty good interview, despite the fact that even going back to Clemson, he's never seemed super comfortable doing interviews. I like that he's worked with Duke M and that he's making changes to his diet, as well as talking about wanting to become more professional in his approach.

Carman has the talent and athleticism to be a very good NFL lineman. It's just a matter of nailing the fundamentals and technique required at LG. I think moving back to left side will benefit him greatly, and he said himself, he's much more comfortable there. 

I feel like a lot of fans are rushing to write this kid off, and I'm not sure why. 

That's what I'm hoping 

(05-25-2022, 11:15 AM)fredtoast Wrote: You don't remember correctly. Alexander liked Carman but he had no influence on the pick at all. Carman was scouted and evaluated by current Bengal staff.

Our drafts are controlled by Taylor and Tobin.

(05-25-2022, 02:36 PM)ochocincos Wrote: While Alexander can give his opinion to Mike Brown, he's not employed by the Bengals. So if Mike Brown (and Bengals staff) values Alexander's opinion still and chose to make a decision on that, that's on them.

(05-25-2022, 02:43 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: are we trying to Say Carman is not who Pollack wanted? whats it matter what Alexander did. What did Pollack want?

It is really no secret anymore that Carmen wasn't the unanimous selection of everyone in the building. Pollack was hired 3 months before the draft. The Carmen pick was all Mike Brown, hopefully it is the last time he exerts his influence on draft day.

Despite our most recent great season, Mike Brown will never relinquish the title as worst owner in pro sports ever in my opinion on the basis of not providing proper support features, lack of facilities, extreme cheapness, ego, and absolutely terrible decision making. Again, just my opinion.

(05-25-2022, 09:03 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Sorry, but I do not see this at all.

What exactly did he say that brought this quote to mind?  Seems like something you just made up in your head because you don't like Carman.

Where have I EVER said I don't like JC? Hell, I defended the pick last year when folks said we should have stayed pat and selected Tevin Jenkins. Every thread we have that discusses the matter I said I hope JC lives up to the draft status. 

IMO it was lack of ownership. He never really said I'm the MFing LG on this team..I can't watch the vid now but it seems I remember him being asked point blank was it his job to lose and he kinda skirted it. 

(05-25-2022, 02:43 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: are we trying to Say Carman is not who Pollack wanted?  whats it matter what Alexander did. What did Pollack want?

Yeah, I think we ought to put more stock in our current OL coach don't yah think?

(05-25-2022, 04:36 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Where have I EVER said I don't like JC? Hell, I defended the pick last year when folks said we should have stayed pat and selected Tevin Jenkins. Every thread we have that discusses the matter I said I hope JC lives up to the draft status. 

IMO it was lack of ownership. He never really said I'm the MFing LG on this team..I can't watch the vid now but it seems I remember him being asked point blank was it his job to lose and he kinda skirted it. 

That's not really his decision though, so I can understand why he wouldn't have answered it.
The best he can do is go out there and perform. If coaches choose to go with someone else, that's their choice.

(05-25-2022, 11:25 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Many times it goes back to the draft.  If they don't like the guy when he was drafted then it takes a while before they will accept him.

Granted, it's just my opinion and how i perceive him but i'm not a big fan of how he comes across. Like a guy just saying "the right words". Things he thinks people want to hear. 

I could be 100% wrong. Words don't matter in the end. What he does when he gets out there is what matters. I did like a lot of what i saw from him last year and i think he's going to be more comfortable on the left side. 

Paul Alexander isnt the O-line coach for the Bengals anymore. He should have no say in who the Bengals draft. Brown going to Alexander for advice is ridiculous. Let the current coaching staff decide who they should draft, not Alexander. Alexander had far more misses than hits drafting for the Oline.

(05-25-2022, 05:48 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: Granted, it's just my opinion and how i perceive him but i'm not a big fan of how he comes across. Like a guy just saying "the right words". Things he thinks people want to hear. 

I could be 100% wrong. Words don't matter in the end. What he does when he gets out there is what matters. I did like a lot of what i saw from him last year and i think he's going to be more comfortable on the left side. 

I get that and I'm not overjoyed by his words/how he comes across either. And how it's all been with him so far coming in overweight and so on.

But like you say all that really matters is how it goes on the field from here on.

Like Big Whit said "put it on tape"

2 things:

Firstly, do you guys really think the well-respected, veteran OL coach they brought in last off-season to fix the OL didnt have much say in who they picked in the 2nd round? That is a ludicrous claim to make.

https://www.pff.com/nfl/players/jackson-carman/52575

Secondly, I think Carman's "bad rookie year" is very overstated. He had some moments where he looked great mainly when told to go downhill and run block. In pass pro he did have some moments where he lost his balance and got beat but really that is to be expected for any rookie OL (still gave up 0 sacks in 500 snaps). 6 penalties isn't great but again, rookie. I would classify his rookie year as "inconsistent" which is pretty normal.

(05-25-2022, 03:28 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Right. 

The argument was that Alexander didn't have any influence on the pick. Which was 100% false. 

As much as Bengals fans hate to admit it Paul Alexander is very highly respected Offense Line Coach in the NFL. Agents are going out of their way to get PA to evaluate their draft prospects so he can give the information to NFL Front offices its not just the Bengals.

(05-25-2022, 10:39 PM)Synric Wrote: As much as Bengals fans hate to admit it Paul Alexander is very highly respected Offense Line Coach in the NFL. Agents are going out of their way to get PA to evaluate their draft prospects so he can give the information to NFL Front offices its not just the Bengals.

Dallas fired Alexander halfway through the season. Respected my ass

(05-25-2022, 11:51 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: Dallas fired Alexander halfway through the season. Respected my ass

Coaches get fired all the time even good coaches.

(05-25-2022, 01:52 PM)WeezyBengal Wrote: No Fred, I do remember correctly. Alexander had input and talked specifically to Mike Brown and recommended and endorsed the pick. 

"Yeah, I talked to Mike about it. I go straight to the top. Mike wanted to talk about Jackson, and obviously I gave him (Carman) a strong endorsement and I think he's going to be terrific" - Paul Alexander

Watch the video below: 

Paul Alexander on the Bengals' Pursuit of Jackson Carman - Bing video

I guess you must have missed that tid bit when you put every piece of Bengals information (mainly assumptions) in that all knowing head of yours. 

Well, you dinged Ketchup Paulie, so......

(05-25-2022, 03:56 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Did Alexander say he was hired as a consultant? Or was it actually just reached out to by Mike Brown to ask for his thoughts?
The way it was phrased, it sounded more like the latter.

To me, that's like you reaching out to your friend, who is a vet but not the vet you take your pet to, asking about whether you should be concerned about your pet eating something.
The vet friend says no, so you choose not to and something bad happens to your pet.

Are you going to blame your vet friend just because they gave you their opinion when asked and you trust them?
Or is the onus on you because you chose to go that route for advice compared to actually talking with your own vet that you pay?

(Maybe that's a bad example, but it made sense in my head lol)

It doesn't matter if he was hired or not. He CONSULTED Mike on the pick. Mike obviously respected his opinion enough to take advice from him. At this point I don't really care who to blame. The point I was trying to make is that Alexander did indeed give input and consulted Mike/Bengals on he pick. 

(05-25-2022, 05:57 PM)007BengalsFan Wrote: Paul Alexander isnt the O-line coach for the Bengals anymore.  He should have no say in who the Bengals draft.  Brown going to Alexander for advice is ridiculous.    Let the current coaching staff decide who they should draft, not Alexander.  Alexander had far more misses than hits drafting for the Oline.

Mike has his "boys" (PA) and he still meddles in the football operations more than some fans would like to believe. No he doesn't do it as much as he used to and I'm sure he's given up a lot of control, but he definitely stays in the loop.  

(05-26-2022, 10:34 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Mike has his "boys" PA and he still meddles in the football operations more than some fans would like to believe. No he doesn't do it as much as he used to and I'm sure he's given up a lot of control, but he definitely stays in the loop.

Oh I'm quite sure of it. He still has the final say in many things.