I know that before Zac got here it sounds like they weren’t very aggressive. Not really going there. Obviously that’s changed. I’m so glad they haven’t overreacted on the OL and tied up a ton of money.

But watching so many cap strapped teams waste money. LA Rams are dumping Jalen Ramsey. Bills Brandon Beane wimpering like a 9 year old child. Arizona trying to do something With Metcalfe.

I realize our extensions coming up are going to cause us new problems but I don’t think we’ve been as reckless as other teams. I mean Cleveland? Denver? Rams? It’s going to be rough. I hope we stay smart.

(02-24-2023, 09:38 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: I know that before Zac got here it sounds like they weren’t very aggressive. Not really going there. Obviously that’s changed. I’m so glad they haven’t overreacted on the OL and tied up a ton of money.

But watching so many cap strapped teams waste money. LA Rams are dumping Jalen Ramsey. Bills Brandon Beane wimpering like a 9 year old child. Arizona trying to do something With Metcalfe.

I realize our extensions coming up are going to cause us new problems but I don’t think we’ve been as reckless as other teams. I mean Cleveland? Denver? Rams? It’s going to be rough. I hope we stay smart.

Not having better talent on the Oline has cost us two Super Bowl titles meanwhile the Rams added another one to their collection at our expense.  Everyone knew the Rams were going to face cap cuts in the future as the price to pay to win another Super Bowl title which they did while we still dont have 1.  Is that smart/not smart?  I dont know but they won the Super Bowl, while we watched them celebrate. 

You can be smart and fix the Oline without getting in cap trouble.  We dont need to go out and spend money to bring in guys like Orlando Brown and Mike McGlinchey but we do need to upgrade somehow from what we have with guys like Williams and Adeniji.  Thats not going to cut it. We cant keep putting out bad O-lines and calling it a smart move while Burrow gets throw around like a rag doll and expecting him to make miracles happen.

(02-24-2023, 09:38 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: I know that before Zac got here it sounds like they weren’t very aggressive. Not really going there. Obviously that’s changed. I’m so glad they haven’t overreacted on the OL and tied up a ton of money.

But watching so many cap strapped teams waste money. LA Rams are dumping Jalen Ramsey. Bills Brandon Beane wimpering like a 9 year old child. Arizona trying to do something With Metcalfe.

I realize our extensions coming up are going to cause us new problems but I don’t think we’ve been as reckless as other teams. I mean Cleveland? Denver? Rams? It’s going to be rough. I hope we stay smart.

They were gunning for a Super Bowl, which they won.

Rams, Bucs, Eagles, all pretty much knew they were going to have a rough year or two in the future, but I doubt any of them would do anything different. Having to cut some players or having a down year to reset your cap situation is 100% an acceptable downside if you hoist a Lombardi. 

Heck, the Chiefs have done it too to win 2 SBs which is why they have 2 DL who currently have a combined cap hit around $60m and a G with a cap hit of $22m. Kicking that can down the road to hoist more Lombardis now.

If the Bengals were a little more "reckless" with signing and trading for OL talent they have at least 1 and maybe 2 SB trophies right now instead of falling short. Awfully hard to win SBs when you're not maximizing the talent you can sign and fit onto a roster by manipulating the cap when other teams are.

I think the Bengals front office has been killing it lately and I would like to thank and applaud each one of them.

(02-24-2023, 10:42 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: They were gunning for a Super Bowl, which they won.

Rams, Bucs, Eagles, all pretty much knew they were going to have a rough year or two in the future, but I doubt any of them would do anything different. Having to cut some players or having a down year to reset your cap situation is 100% an acceptable downside if you hoist a Lombardi . 

Heck, the Chiefs have done it too to win 2 SBs which is why they have 2 DL who currently have a combined cap hit around $60m and a G with a cap hit of $22m. Kicking that can down the road to hoist more Lombardis now.

If the Bengals were a little more "reckless" with signing and trading for OL talent they have at least 1 and maybe 2 SB trophies right now instead of falling short. Awfully hard to win SBs when you're not maximizing the talent you can sign and fit onto a roster by manipulating the cap when other teams are.

The Rams aren’t getting back to the top. Yes they won a Super Bowl but they barely beat us and Super Bowl or bust is not my preferred path. The Chiefs did sign Orlando Brown and we signed 3 for more money. They are going to lose Brown. KC has won 2 and the second wasn’t because of FA it was the draft. Regardless I want to win a SB but I’d rather have an extended run and not a one year wonder. Philly didn’t win it. They’ve got a great team but they have a lot of FA’s so we will see.

(02-24-2023, 10:42 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: They were gunning for a Super Bowl, which they won.

Rams, Bucs, Eagles, all pretty much knew they were going to have a rough year or two in the future, but I doubt any of them would do anything different. Having to cut some players or having a down year to reset your cap situation is 100% an acceptable downside if you hoist a Lombardi. 

Heck, the Chiefs have done it too to win 2 SBs which is why they have 2 DL who currently have a combined cap hit around $60m and a G with a cap hit of $22m. Kicking that can down the road to hoist more Lombardis now.

If the Bengals were a little more "reckless" with signing and trading for OL talent they have at least 1 and maybe 2 SB trophies right now instead of falling short. Awfully hard to win SBs when you're not maximizing the talent you can sign and fit onto a roster by manipulating the cap when other teams are.

Agreed. I'm glad our team isn't tied down like others, but let's not forget that in order to build this championship roster we had to sit through 5 straight losing seasons and watch Burrow's knee get demolished.  Unless you find someone like Tom Brady at #199 it's really hard to put together a championship roster without paying before or after your major pushes for the Lombardi.

I think this team should win it all, but until we do win it all it's sort of middling smack to talk about what a wise position we are in.  At least it's better than 2013 or so when we were flexing about how Dalton took a team-friendly deal and Flacco didn't.  Sure, you just won a SB, but we have a more fiscally stable situation here, losers! 

Are we forgetting 3 OL were hurt going into the playoffs? The Bengals front office did "gun" or "go for it" but Collins, Williams, and Cappa got hurt. Add that collective trio back into the Chiefs game and we might have seen a different outcome.

(02-25-2023, 10:47 AM)TecmoBengals Wrote: Are we forgetting 3 OL were hurt going into the playoffs? The Bengals front office did "gun" or "go for it" but Collins, Williams, and Cappa got hurt. Add that collective trio back into the Chiefs game and we might have seen a different outcome.

No doubt about it.

(02-25-2023, 10:47 AM)TecmoBengals Wrote: Are we forgetting 3 OL were hurt going into the playoffs? The Bengals front office did "gun" or "go for it" but Collins, Williams, and Cappa got hurt. Add that collective trio back into the Chiefs game and we might have seen a different outcome.

This is the only part I disagree with, if Cappa is there we were one play or a few bad calls from playing Philly.  

The FO did their job and they'll do it well this year.  I expect them to lock in long term deals outside the OL and yet still find a way to improve the line beyond just getting healthy.  

That looks to be at least a drafted OT in the first 4 rds (draft looks deeper than IOL) and bringing in a fringe vet as healthy competition to Volson.  Hopefully we get at least one new starter grade player. Maybe a versatile backup at least especially if they have to redshirt a rookie.  We have a FO that has eyes on building chemistry on the OL long term. That's the bigger issue of losing 3 OL, not that the subs were so much worse (besides JC) but that the situation that dire.

The current front office has always been much more business smart than football smart.

As to the Rams-Bengals debate. I'd rather be a fan of the Bengals and a player for the Rams. Players get rings, bonuses, and titles. Fans get the joy of watching their team win. Doesn't look like the Rams are going to do much of that in the near future.

(02-25-2023, 10:47 AM)TecmoBengals Wrote: Are we forgetting 3 OL were hurt going into the playoffs? The Bengals front office did "gun" or "go for it" but Collins, Williams, and Cappa got hurt. Add that collective trio back into the Chiefs game and we might have seen a different outcome.

That's another unpleasant truth of the whole situation.  Our FO can kill it and Burrow can play for $15 an hour and we can still come up short because the football gods are a fickle bunch.

(02-25-2023, 12:07 PM)bfine32 Wrote: As to the Rams-Bengals debate. I'd rather be a fan of the Bengals and a player for the Rams. Players get rings, bonuses, and titles. Fans get the joy of watching their team win. Doesn't look like the Rams are going to do much of that in the near future.

Half a dozen of one and 6 of another, and all that.  Rams fans have to watch them lose for the next X amount of years, we had to watch the Bengals lose for 5 years and we saw Burrow's knee get caved in without having the immediate joy of knowing it would lead to us getting a top-tier WR.  As fans we've pulled our share of boulders up hill, and all that. 

What the Rams did has been done plenty of times before and did not result in a super bowl win. What the Rams did is a very low percentage chance at winning a super bowl because you get X number of years then you HAVE to rebuild with no draft capital.

(02-25-2023, 10:47 AM)TecmoBengals Wrote: Are we forgetting 3 OL were hurt going into the playoffs? The Bengals front office did "gun" or "go for it" but Collins, Williams, and Cappa got hurt. Add that collective trio back into the Chiefs game and we might have seen a different outcome.

That's a fact.  You never really know, but taking a line with Cappa and Collins healthy into KC very likely means we re-name that stadium Burrowhead until September.  

The media is pushing the narrative that the Bengals have somehow failed to address the line and many will buy it.  I'm not so sure.  It's not a top 5 line when healthy, but it's good enough.

It's been discussed, but IMO Volson is developing well.  Possibly even ahead of schedule.  It would be reactionary and probably detrimental to replace him.  He's a young, controllable player that needs to continue getting reps.  Karras and Cappa are terrific.  LT is undecided, but there is reason for hope with both Jonah returning (likely) healthy and Carman showing that he can more than hold is own.  

RT is the only real question to me.  There's no real public understanding of where Collins is health wise.  Adeniji sucks and I cringe at the idea of him getting into the lineup at any point.  The sample size is there and it's horrific.  

At the end of the day, as things stand, I look at Jonah and Carman and have a hard time leaving one of them on the bench to open the year.  I have no clue if Carman can play RT, but he damn sure took to LT like a duck to water.  Maybe he's just a guy that excels there and nowhere else.  I know if he comes into camp and has put in the right offseason work it's going to be tough to deny him.  

That leaves RT for Jonah, and he's not in a position to get butthurt about a move.  He's played RT in college and he's in a contract year.  He's got to put some work in if he wants to max out his second deal.  

Would I be mad if they brought in a good FA tackle?  Of course not.  I just doubt they see it as a huge need.  If they do, they likely will sign a stopgap like Eleanor and draft a young, controllable player early.  

They were talking about teams that load up to make a run on Sirius yesterday. According to them, the Rams and the Bucs fans should be ready for 5-8 years of mediocrity which they traded to bring in superstars to make more or less a one time run. While they said this is a legitimate formula to make, then repeat a Super Bowl, injuries like losing Stafford and Donald derail those plans. I'd rather do things the way the Bengals do and keep building the team in a manner that can be sustained over time.

LA Rams are in a bit of a bind they don't really have a loyal fan base. Los Angeles is a basketball town. The Rams have to compete against the 49ers, Raiders, and Chargers for fans in their own home city because of how teams have moved into and out of LA over the years.

(02-25-2023, 01:02 PM)Synric Wrote: LA Rams are in a bit of a bind they don't really have a loyal fan base. Los Angeles is a basketball town. The Rams have to compete against the 49ers, Raiders, and Chargers for fans in their own home city because of how teams have moved into and out of LA over the years.

But they have an enormous population to draw from.

(02-25-2023, 12:23 PM)Nately120 Wrote: That's another unpleasant truth of the whole situation.  Our FO can kill it and Burrow can play for $15 an hour and we can still come up short because the football gods are a fickle bunch.

I don't know if Jonah and La'el being hurt is about the football gods being fickle so much as it being a day that ends in y. They're not quite Tyler Eifert or Bob Sanders, but they're sure as hell not Andrew Whitworth or Domata Peko.

I fully understand the Bengals owner/FO have done so much more (the last few years) all the way around to produce a winner than they ever done before. And for that I'm very, very, happy and thankful. It's been fun to be relevant, finally.

And I get we had some bad injury luck towards the end of the season. But my question is, was it enough? Would we have seen the Lombardi even if the Oline had been fully healthy?

IMHO we've taken the steps to make it to the 11th rung on a 12 step ladder. Now is the time to make it up that final step, NOW. And again, in my opinion getting some more serious Oline help in here is the thing that's going to be the thing that puts us over the top.

It's not the time to have long term plans.

(02-25-2023, 01:33 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: I don't know if Jonah and La'el being hurt is about the football gods being fickle so much as it being a day that ends in y. They're not quite Tyler Eifert or Bob Sanders, but they're sure as hell not Andrew Whitworth or Domata Peko.

What a lot of people miss is the big picture.

(02-24-2023, 09:38 PM)Soonerpeace Wrote: I know that before Zac got here it sounds like they weren’t very aggressive. Not really going there. Obviously that’s changed. I’m so glad they haven’t overreacted on the OL and tied up a ton of money.

But watching so many cap strapped teams waste money. LA Rams are dumping Jalen Ramsey. Bills Brandon Beane wimpering like a 9 year old child. Arizona trying to do something With Metcalfe.

I realize our extensions coming up are going to cause us new problems but I don’t think we’ve been as reckless as other teams. I mean Cleveland? Denver? Rams? It’s going to be rough. I hope we stay smart.

Staying smart means not expecting La'el Collins to be healthy by the time the season starts. Add at least 2 OT's, one in FA and one 
in the draft and we will stay smart. Ignoring this will be stupid beyond belief.