(08-19-2023, 12:52 PM)impactplaya Wrote: The Bengals lost 2 safeties to free agency this year.
Of course Dax Hill his time is now to start and
they added Nick Scott from the Rams to give
Some veteran stability along side Hill.
But when Samaje Perrine departed for the Broncos
The same thinking was not applied to the RB position
The direction was to elevate Treyveon Williams to number #2 and add depth with a draft pick. (CHASE BROWN)
But Samaje Perrine had a very integral role in the Bengals
Offense that I don't think Williams or Brown is ready to
Step into.
With the value of RBs going south, the Bengals had the $$$$ to add a more seasoned replacement for Periine.
If Joe Mixon misses anytime defenses won't have a reason To load the box or even fear the run.

I like Chris Evans as a 3rd down back. I also think a healthy Williams is serviceable. They drafted a running back Chase Brown also who is playing well in preseason. I believe he had a great pass blocking grade in week 2 which is important for any running back.

Why didn't they?

They'd only be able to speak for certain, but it appears they felt Mixon was going to be the lead RB and they just needed depth guys.
They drafted a guy they liked and felt had strong potential down the line in Chase Brown. Brown has speed, he showed he could be a bellcow if needed/wanted, and he demonstrated a strong willingness to pass protect. They thought Trayveon Williams had enough talent and experience in the offense after 4 years that he was worth retaining. Chris Evans is showing like he might become a third-down guy that can not only catch (we knew that) but also (now) be able to pass protect.

In regard to losing Perine, Perine offered good value as a 3rd down guy, but he definitely wasn't fast. Taylor's crew clearly values speed, as evident by all the draft picks they've made.

With all that said, there are still some RBs out there to pick up if it's getting into the season and it's appearing that none of these backup RBs are getting it done.
In terms of rushing, I see both RBs rush for very little YPC against ATL. I wasn't able to watch the game (out of market, not on Sunday Ticket), but when multiple guys perform about the same, I tend to lean toward the OL not getting much push at the LOS and/or getting holes opened.
In the first preseason game against the Packers, Brown rushed for just 1.5 YPC. Evans ran for 2.67 YPC outside of his 33-yard gain, which had boosted his YPC to 7.0 that game.
In these games, the Bengals haven't had their starting OL in, and these backups just are not strong (run) blockers, for the most part.

I am optimistic that, at least from a rushing perspective, we'll see these backup RBs perform better once the actual real OL is out there.

(08-19-2023, 12:52 PM)impactplaya Wrote: The Bengals lost 2 safeties to free agency this year.
Of course Dax Hill his time is now to start and
they added Nick Scott from the Rams to give
Some veteran stability along side Hill.
But when Samaje Perrine departed for the Broncos
The same thinking was not applied to the RB position
The direction was to elevate Treyveon Williams to number #2 and add depth with a draft pick. (CHASE BROWN)
But Samaje Perrine had a very integral role in the Bengals
Offense that I don't think Williams or Brown is ready to
Step into.
With the value of RBs going south, the Bengals had the $$$$ to add a more seasoned replacement for Periine.
If Joe Mixon misses anytime defenses won't have a reason To load the box or even fear the run.

Are we really comparing replacing a starting safety that played every single snap to a backup RB that played on many 3rd downs?

Life is about to change for our team with the huge contracts coming. We should be very happy that our weaknesses today exist only in depth roles, we will eventually lose quality starters that we will not be able to easily replace.

(08-22-2023, 12:48 PM)casear2727 Wrote: Are we really comparing replacing a starting safety that played every single snap to a backup RB that played on many 3rd downs?

Life is about to change for our team with the huge contracts coming. We should be very happy that our weaknesses today exist only in depth roles, we will eventually lose quality starters that we will not be able to easily replace.

Get ready for Boyd and Reader.


I actually think we are resigning Reader but as of now it looks bleak.



Almost wondering if we should move Tee to the slot and just roll with Yoshi outside. Know the initial plan is to slide Jones in the slot role but i don’t trust him yet even tho he balled out against ATL

(08-22-2023, 12:54 PM)Housh Wrote: Get ready for Boyd and Reader.


I actually think we are resigning Reader but as of now it looks bleak.



Almost wondering if we should move Tee to the slot and just roll with Yoshi outside. Know the initial plan is to slide Jones in the slot role but i don’t trust him yet even tho he balled out against ATL

Reader may get re-signed like we think Higgins will, but that will take someone else off the table.

Spots we'll have to potentially worry about in 2024 (incumbent starter):
RT (Williams)
WR2 (Higgins)
WR3 (Boyd)
NT (Reader)
TE (Smith)
CB1 (Awuzie - is Turner the heir?)

Spots we'll have to potentially worry about in 2025:
QB (Burrow)
C (Karras)
RB (Mixon)
UT (Hill)
Slot CB (Hilton)

I can't see how Bengals would keep everyone, so we need to be prepared for some of them to get replaced with draft picks or cheaper veterans to accommodate big contracts for guys like Burrow, Chase, Higgins, and/or Reader.

Personally, I don't think Reader gets a multi-year extension by the Bengals, as he'll be 30 years old next year. Bengals don't typically sign older vets to be starters.

Jonathan Taylor is looking for a trade. We could trade Tee for him and then extend Taylor at a smaller number.

(08-22-2023, 12:54 PM)Housh Wrote: Get ready for Boyd and Reader.


I actually think we are resigning Reader but as of now it looks bleak.



Almost wondering if we should move Tee to the slot and just roll with Yoshi outside. Know the initial plan is to slide Jones in the slot role but i don’t trust him yet even tho he balled out against ATL

Why in the world would Tee go to the slot?  He is not that type of WR.  Chase would fit the slot much easier and likely be way more effective than he currently is.  

(08-22-2023, 02:14 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Jonathan Taylor is looking for a trade. We could trade Tee for him and then extend Taylor at a smaller number.

Would be down with that. Love the way Jonathan Taylor runs and plays, he can do it all and even pass protect.

Love Tee as well but I think his agent is such a doosh we might not get a deal done that is fair to the team.

(08-22-2023, 02:16 PM)casear2727 Wrote: Why in the world would Tee go to the slot?  He is not that type of WR.  Chase would fit the slot much easier and likely be way more effective than he currently is.  

Great question, Chase plays great in the Slot anyways. Keep Tee on the outside where he can abuse the Corners with his size.

Tee on the outside is nearly uncoverable.

Some FAs still out there if Williams, Evans, and Brown aren't cutting it:
Fournette
Hunt
McKissic
Gio
Dontrell Hilliard

As much as I don't think Bernard would come back, he really does have the skill set we want to replace Perine.
His career in TB never got off the ground, and he's 31 years old, so it'd truly be a one-year stopgap kinda contract if he were to play anywhere.

Fournette is probably who I would choose otherwise though.

(08-23-2023, 10:18 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Some FAs still out there if Williams, Evans, and Brown aren't cutting it:
Fournette
Hunt
McKissic
Gio
Dontrell Hilliard

As much as I don't think Bernard would come back, he really does have the skill set we want to replace Perine.
His career in TB never got off the ground, and he's 31 years old, so it'd truly be a one-year stopgap kinda contract if he were to play anywhere.

Fournette is probably who I would choose otherwise though.

Gio Bernard announced his retirement on April 28th.  

They can’t get Taylor. Too much invested with Mixon ( 9 million dead cap) they can’t put that much in RB

(08-22-2023, 01:20 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Reader may get re-signed like we think Higgins will, but that will take someone else off the table.

Spots we'll have to potentially worry about in 2024 (incumbent starter):
RT (Williams)
WR2 (Higgins)
WR3 (Boyd)
NT (Reader)
TE (Smith)
CB1 (Awuzie - is Turner the heir?)

Spots we'll have to potentially worry about in 2025:
QB (Burrow)
C (Karras)
RB (Mixon)
UT (Hill)
Slot CB (Hilton)

I can't see how Bengals would keep everyone, so we need to be prepared for some of them to get replaced with draft picks or cheaper veterans to accommodate big contracts for guys like Burrow, Chase, Higgins, and/or Reader.

Personally, I don't think Reader gets a multi-year extension by the Bengals, as he'll be 30 years old next year. Bengals don't typically sign older vets to be starters.

I think in 2024:

Williams is probably gone, unless we overpay to keep him. He may want to test FA regardless to go back to LT.

Boyd is 100% gone

Higgins will be tagged if not resigned then probably walk in 2025

Reader maybe could come back on a 1 year deal, but I think another team will overpay for him so unless he doesn't mind staying to less money he is probably gone.

Smith will be gone if he has a good year.

Awuzie is similar to Reader, except he is coming off an injury. If he starts slow we may be able to resign him cheaper then we would otherwise. If they think Turner is going to be the guy though, I think they let him walk.

For 2025:

Burrow- Not going anywhere
Karras- I think we could resign him for pretty cheap
Mixon- I think he will be gone/walk
Hill- We will probably let him walk, maybe resign for cheap
Hilton-I think will be gone

So for the next few years FA and the Draft will/should focus on OT, CB, and IDL mostly, with IOL, RB and WR depth a secondary issue.

(08-23-2023, 11:30 AM)Garrus Wrote: I think in 2024:

Williams is probably gone, unless we overpay to keep him. He may want to test FA regardless to go back to LT.

Boyd is 100% gone

Higgins will be tagged if not resigned then probably walk in 2025

Reader maybe could come back on a 1 year deal, but I think another team will overpay for him so unless he doesn't mind staying to less money he is probably gone.

Smith will be gone if he has a good year.

Awuzie is similar to Reader, except he is coming off an injury. If he starts slow we may be able to resign him cheaper then we would otherwise. If they think Turner is going to be the guy though, I think they let him walk.

For 2025:

Burrow- Not going anywhere
Karras- I think we could resign him for pretty cheap
Mixon- I think he will be gone/walk
Hill- We will probably let him walk, maybe resign for cheap
Hilton-I think will be gone

So for the next few years FA and the Draft will/should focus on OT, CB, and IDL mostly, with IOL, RB and WR depth a secondary issue.

Question - If Williams does well at RT, what would you consider overpaying?
The 10th-highest paid RTs (McGary, Havenstein) get $11.5 mill a year.
However, the 9th-highest paid RT (Conklin) gets $15 mill a year.

If Williams plays well, is $15 mill too high?
I would definitely be willing to do $10-15 mill APY for him if he's satisfactory.

(08-23-2023, 10:49 AM)Soonerpeace Wrote: They can’t get Taylor. Too much invested with Mixon ( 9 million dead cap) they can’t put that much in RB

What if they trade Tee AND Mixon for Taylor and some draft picks?

(08-19-2023, 03:54 PM)DYT_Bengal Wrote: Fournette with Burrow would have been interesting - he is a better version of Perine. I was high on the rookies but after last night, I'm taking a step back. Brown is showing promise but the regular season will tell.

id have to agree that we need anther proven workhorse to relieve Mixon
Perine was a beast at 5-11' 240# and is same build as Fournette

Because running backs do not matter and are a waste of money.

The Titans were fine 2 season ago without Henry, secured a #1 seed then when he returned they didn't get better and certainly weren't better last year with him.

That's just one example but it's always been that way. Adrian Peterson has a great year and the vikings are ehh. He gets injured vikings are ehh comes back and rushed for 2000 yards viking are ehh.

Running backs don't matter and that's why it's been such a big deal this year about them not getting paid. They are plug and play. Paying a 'proven' back is just burning money.

(08-22-2023, 02:26 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Would be down with that. Love the way Jonathan Taylor runs and plays, he can do it all and even pass protect.

Love Tee as well but I think his agent is such a doosh we might not get a deal done that is fair to the team.


Great question, Chase plays great in the Slot anyways. Keep Tee on the outside where he can abuse the Corners with his size.

Tee on the outside is nearly uncoverable.

It would be radical, but I'd want Alec Peirce back from them even if it means a pick goes out.  Then you have Mixon with his lowered number either being unhappy if he is dealt or benched. Maybe you get a lower pick back for him.

(08-23-2023, 12:15 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Question - If Williams does well at RT, what would you consider overpaying?
The 10th-highest paid RTs (McGary, Havenstein) get $11.5 mill a year.
However, the 9th-highest paid RT (Conklin) gets $15 mill a year.

If Williams plays well, is $15 mill too high?
I would definitely be willing to do $10-15 mill APY for him if he's satisfactory.

Honestly if he were to play well at RT (Which I expect him to do), I wouldn't mind paying to keep him around those numbers. I think OT is one of the positions your money should be invested into, however I just think he will think he could make more from another team who may/will sign him as a LT, and I don't think we will pay him LT money to play RT. 

Now he could test FA and see that no other team wants him as a LT since he did so well at RT which would help us resign him. 

If he does well I for sure wouldn't be upset if we resigned him even if it cost some decent money. 

(08-23-2023, 12:27 PM)PhilHos Wrote: What if they trade Tee AND Mixon for Taylor and some draft picks?

Then they could. But they won’t.

(08-23-2023, 12:27 PM)PhilHos Wrote: What if they trade Tee AND Mixon for Taylor and some draft picks?

I suppose, but why make someone else's headache yours? Taylor will still want to get paid and for the money, I think i'd rather have Tee.