(07-18-2024, 09:36 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Ok, so this is all money in. Now someone do a money-out comparison. Stadium upkeep and renovations, insurance, taxes, player and coach salaries, plus salaries for medical and training personnel, scouts, analysts, security, regular employee salaries and benefits for all those employees, advertising, and who knows what else is on that ledger. They're making money no doubt or they would fold, but it would be interesting to see the books and how they balance to get a real idea of profit.

Travel expenses have to be high as well. 

Still though it is good to be an NFL owner when the final tallies are made. 

(07-19-2024, 02:42 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: When I added two season tickets this year they had a message saying something to the effect of "if we catch you buying these tickets just to resell them we will take your season ticket privilege." No idea how many games you would have to not personally attend to piss them off. The way the tickets are controlled they know if you sell them.

I like that... I have nothing against someone selling their tickets to one or two games to pay for the package, but buying them just to scalp them is wrong and is what used to fill the stadium with Stealers fans etc....

(07-19-2024, 06:18 AM)Go Cards Wrote: Travel expenses have to be high as well. 

Still though it is good to be an NFL owner when the final tallies are made. 

I didn't even think about travel. So there's a charter airliner and hotel rooms for everyone (and not at the Motel 6). And insurance on that stadium property +liability has to be a huge ticket.

(07-18-2024, 04:17 PM)pally Wrote: yes they do

No, they don't. You think Patrick Mahomes and Travis Kelce give 1 flying F about the chairs in the KC locker room?

If a team is going to give you $2mm more as a free agent but they have bad food, guess what, the FA is still going to that team.

This isn't college recruiting pre NIL. Cash is king. 

(07-19-2024, 06:18 AM)Go Cards Wrote: Travel expenses have to be high as well. 

Still though it is good to be an NFL owner when the final tallies are made. 

I mean, sure they are "high" but in the grand scheme of things? Not really. Let's assume $1mm per away game (doubt its that high, but lets go even higher). Let's say $10mm per season for travel expenses. Most teams are doing upwards of $1B in revenue per year. This is a tiny line item. And it's a write off anyway.


Remember, these owners entire lives become write-offs when they own a team. That's why they rarely ever hit the open market. 

(07-19-2024, 08:40 AM)Sled21 Wrote: I didn't even think about travel. So there's a charter airliner and hotel rooms for everyone (and not at the Motel 6). And insurance on that stadium property +liability has to be a huge ticket.

Insurance is probably expensive. But again. As a % of profits? Tiny amount. I know what my small business pays in insurance, and it's "a lot" but it's still only about 8% of my top line. 

Running an NFL team from a numbers perspective is insanely easy, they print cash. You're working with a gross profit margin of 40%+ if you count players salaries as COGS and you don't get a single dime from Ticket sales or merchandising. 

(07-19-2024, 04:08 PM)TCUBengal34 Wrote: I mean, sure they are "high" but in the grand scheme of things? Not really. Let's assume $1mm per away game (doubt its that high, but lets go even higher). Let's say $10mm per season for travel expenses. Most teams are doing upwards of $1B in revenue per year. This is a tiny line item. And it's a write off anyway.


Remember, these owners entire lives become write-offs when they own a team. That's why they rarely ever hit the open market. 




Insurance is probably expensive. But again. As a % of profits? Tiny amount. I know what my small business pays in insurance, and it's "a lot" but it's still only about 8% of my top line. 

Running an NFL team from a numbers perspective is insanely easy, they print cash. You're working with a gross profit margin of 40%+ if you count players salaries as COGS and you don't get a single dime from Ticket sales or merchandising. 

Why do you think most teams are doing upwards of 1B in revenue, we literally know a pretty renowned franchise in GB did $654 Million this year. We also know they only made about 10% net on that. 

(07-19-2024, 04:11 PM)Au165 Wrote: Why do you think most teams are doing upwards of 1B in revenue, we literally know a pretty renowned franchise in GB did $654 Million this year. We also know they only made about 10% net on that. 

Because I've seen financials from an AFC South team from circa 2015 and and an NFC South team Circa 2022. The real numbers, not the numbers the Packers show to the public.

Again, most aren't a $1B, I think the Cowboys def are. But most are close 3/4 of a B range. And 10% Profit margin. Right. That's what their accountants show. That's what mine shows too. Most businesses unless publicly traded (and even then) try to minimize their tax liability.

Trust me. The teams are fineeeee. The Panthers. The PANTHERS sold a few years ago for what, $6B? On the open market. You think they sold for 50x EBITDA? No way. These teams are under reporting 100% and don't blame them.

(07-19-2024, 08:38 AM)Sled21 Wrote: I like that... I have nothing against someone selling their tickets to one or two games to pay for the package, but buying them just to scalp them is wrong and is what used to fill the stadium with Stealers fans etc....

I do too. Keeps some rich person from treating the tickets as an investment and hoarding them just to resell.

(07-19-2024, 04:20 PM)TCUBengal34 Wrote: Because I've seen financials from an AFC South team from circa 2015 and and an NFC South team Circa 2022. The real numbers, not the numbers the Packers show to the public.

Again, most aren't a $1B, I think the Cowboys def are. But most are close 3/4 of a B range. And 10% Profit margin. Right. That's what their accountants show. That's what mine shows too. Most businesses unless publicly traded (and even then) try to minimize their tax liability.

Trust me. The teams are fineeeee. The Panthers. The PANTHERS sold a few years ago for what, $6B? On the open market. You think they sold for 50x EBITDA? No way. These teams are under reporting 100% and don't blame them.

You are claiming the Packers are committing fraud? That’s a bold statement. They present their financials because they legally have to. They are in fact audited and certified by an independent accounting firm.

You can’t do valuations on unique companies using standard EBITDA multiples, for one the NFL as a league controls who can even buy in. What we do know is the last expansion team with no brand, players, or revenue sold for $700 million in 2002. Since then the salary cap has gone up 5x. Also worth noting in your EBITDA multiple calculation how they handle add backs could be massive so it probably is much lower when they account for such.