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(07-27-2025, 03:06 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Cool thanks J24, if for some reason our young DT's don't work out I would be for Drafting Don Corleone. Good DT for the Bearcats.
As usual, thanks for the common sense post Sunset. Kris Jenkins was thrust around from Linebacker to End to DT at Michigan
and kicked ass in doing so, but we all know the transfer to the pros is hard for any rookie. Let alone one that was forced into
action with a broken thumb wearing a club. Jenkins has long arms for a DT and has all the athleticism and strength to be a force
as a 3-tech.
I think Kris Jenkins is a solid breakout candidate, almost as much as Ossai this year to me who is my #1 vote. I just expect Ossai
to have double digit sacks and maybe even more than Trey this year in Golden's system. We will see.
Nate, everyone is forgetting about Murphy. He was the Shemar of 2023 - athletic freak of an edge. Virtually identical height/weight/wingspan.
He had that preseason MCL injury last year, and started the year on IR. Took him half the season to get healthy.
I would add him on the list of breakouts this year. With Hubbard gone, I feel Murphy will get some true edge snaps and deliver on the promise.
Both Jenkins and Murphy have Hill and Ossai in front of them, but I think they both will shine this year.
I wouldn't be surprised to see Murphy starting by mid-year.
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(07-27-2025, 10:35 PM)XsandOs Wrote: Nate, everyone is forgetting about Murphy. He was the Shemar of 2023 - athletic freak of an edge. Virtually identical height/weight/wingspan.
He had that preseason MCL injury last year, and started the year on IR. Took him half the season to get healthy.
I would add him on the list of breakouts this year. With Hubbard gone, I feel Murphy will get some true edge snaps and deliver on the promise.
Both Jenkins and Murphy have Hill and Ossai in front of them, but I think they both will shine this year.
I wouldn't be surprised to see Murphy starting by mid-year.
True, I am forgetting about him till he shows me something. I saw some good things from Murphy as a rookie late in his first season but last
year he was slow, bad at stopping the run and pretty much invisible out there. Ossai on the other hand was our second best pass rusher by far
last season and should of started over hobbled Sam. Another reason why I am glad we moved on from most of our Defensive coaches.
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Ok more context on the Christian Wilkins saga. Apparently Wilkins playfully tried to kiss a teammate on top of his head lol. I guess the other player didn't like that.
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(07-27-2025, 01:22 PM)XsandOs Wrote: Murphy was on IR when the season started due to his MCL injury in preseason. Affected his get off even after returning. Ossai and Hubbard got most of the edge snaps and Murphy was also moved inside on obvious passing downs.
Also, the sophomore slump usually occurs with skill positions (QB, WR, CB, etc) - not D-line. D-line and O-line generally improve, as they adjust to physicality of the game.
I agree that Hill and Slaton are the starters and will get most of the snaps. Both Jackson and Jenkins will take the next step, and I feel Jenkins will take the bigger leap for the reasons I stated in my first response to you.
It may be that Jackson outshines Jenkins due to his pass rush repertoire, and I hope Bengals give him that opportunity, instead of just two-gap, zero tech responsibility.
But I am high on Jenkins.
The biggest concern for me with Jenkins was lack of proven pass rush coming out of college.
Many scouting reports mentioned it could limit his role in the NFL.
From the snaps I watched (which may have been less than you), I saw a guy with power and motor, but not overly lateral and getting into the backfield too often when rushing the passer without a straight line to the QB.
I didn't see enough pass rush pressure from him last year to make me think he'll be around 4 sacks, 30+ total pressures, which is about my mark for a solid pass rushing IDL.
He did have 3 sacks but only 11 total pressures.
While I think there will be an improvement on the total pressures, I am not willing to bet we're going to >4 sacks or >25 total pressures.
I predict 3-4 sacks, ~20 total pressures in a year where he will grow some, but not explode onto the scene.
Depending on how he develops this year, I may be willing to project him >4 sacks and >25 total pressures in his 3rd season.
Maybe you have paid closer attention to him than I have though and you'll end up being right.
Zac Taylor 2019-2020: 6 total wins
Zac Taylor 2021-2022: Double-digit wins each season, plus 5 postseason wins
Zac Taylor 2023: 9 wins despite losing Burrow half the season
Zac Taylor 2024: Started 1-4. Ended 9-8 but barely missed playoffs
Changes needed to do better in Sept/Oct moving forward.
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(Yesterday, 02:23 PM)ochocincos Wrote: The biggest concern for me with Jenkins was lack of proven pass rush coming out of college.
Many scouting reports mentioned it could limit his role in the NFL.
From the snaps I watched (which may have been less than you), I saw a guy with power and motor, but not overly lateral and getting into the backfield too often when rushing the passer without a straight line to the QB.
I didn't see enough pass rush pressure from him last year to make me think he'll be around 4 sacks, 30+ total pressures, which is about my mark for a solid pass rushing IDL.
He did have 3 sacks but only 11 total pressures.
While I think there will be an improvement on the total pressures, I am not willing to bet we're going to >4 sacks or >25 total pressures.
I predict 3-4 sacks, ~20 total pressures in a year where he will grow some, but not explode onto the scene.
Depending on how he develops this year, I may be willing to project him >4 sacks and >25 total pressures in his 3rd season.
Maybe you have paid closer attention to him than I have though and you'll end up being right.
I agree on Jenkins, though playing with a hand in a cast did not help him. At DT, 3 of the 4 guys we have are either NT types eith linited pass rush skills (Slaton, Jackson) or a DT who gradesout better vs the run than pass (Hill) or whose strengths/traits point to more of a run stopper (Jenkins).
We had a lot holes to plug in the offseason (OGx2, DE, run stopping DT, pass rushing DT, S, TE1, RB2, LB).
We chose to let Pratt walk & doubled/tripled down on some spots (G: Fairchild/Patrick; DE: Ossai/Stewart/Sample, LB: Knight/Burks/Barrett/Giles-Harris, RB: Perine, Moss, Boyd) and left others unaddressed (pass rushing DT, S, TE1).
I'd expect to see a lot of Stewart, Sample, Murphy, and Ossai lined up inside on pass rushing downs. Stewart & Sample have some straight up DT experience. Tevan Bryan had decent pass rush grades last year, too.
I'd expect Jenkins, Jackson, & Murphy to all improve this year. By how much is the question?
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(Yesterday, 03:59 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: I agree in Jenkins, though playing with a hand in a cast did not help him. At DT, 3 of the 4 guys we have are either NT types eith linited pass rush skills (Slaton, Jackson) or a DT who gradesout better vs the run than pass (Hill) or whose strengths/traits point to more of a run stopper (Jenkins).
We had a lot holes to plug in the offseason (OGx2, DE, run stopping DT, pass rushing DT, S, TE1, RB2, LB).
We chose to let Pratt walk & doubled/tripled down on some spots (G: Fairchild/Patrick; DE: Ossai/Stewart/Sample, LB: Knight/Burks/Barrett/Giles-Harris, RB: Perine, Moss, Boyd) and left others unaddressed (pass rushing DT, S, TE1).
I'd expect to see a lot of Stewart, Sample, Murphy, and Ossai lined up inside on pass rushing downs. Stewart & Sample have some straight up DT experience. Tevan Bryan had decent pass rush grades last year, too..
If Bengals start using DE more to swing inside to pull one of the DTs off the field in clear passing situations, I'm ok with that, personally.
Zac Taylor 2019-2020: 6 total wins
Zac Taylor 2021-2022: Double-digit wins each season, plus 5 postseason wins
Zac Taylor 2023: 9 wins despite losing Burrow half the season
Zac Taylor 2024: Started 1-4. Ended 9-8 but barely missed playoffs
Changes needed to do better in Sept/Oct moving forward.
Sorry for Party Rocking!
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(Yesterday, 04:01 PM)ochocincos Wrote: If Bengals start using DE more to swing inside to pull one of the DTs off the field in clear passing situations, I'm ok with that, personally.
Me, too. I think it was a pretty reasonable choice given that filling ALL the holes was unrealistic. FA pass rushing DT's were getting WAY more than they merited in FA (I would not have payed one). If we didn't love any of the Rd1 types in the draft, this solution was a decent one.
And while I hated the Stewart pick (too risky, likely needs a year), he does have a high ceiling and if he hits, he can help at DE and interior pass rush. Two birds with one stone. Which is always a tempting bet when you are trying to fill a lot of holes.
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(Yesterday, 04:30 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: Me, too. I think it was a pretty reasonable choice given that filling ALL the holes was unrealistic. FA pass rushing DT's were getting WAY more than they merited in FA (I would not have payed one). If we didn't love any of the Rd1 types in the draft, this solution was a decent one.
And while I hated the Stewart pick (too risky, likely needs a year), he does have a high ceiling and if he hits, he can help at DE and interior pass rush. Two birds with one stone. Which is always a tempting bet when you are trying to fill a lot of holes.
If Stewart can end up notching 6-8 sacks a year, help bolster the run defense, and have versatility to play base end and nickel DT, I can be happy with the pick.
I too was (am) worried he's a couple (or a few) years away from being overly impactful though.
Zac Taylor 2019-2020: 6 total wins
Zac Taylor 2021-2022: Double-digit wins each season, plus 5 postseason wins
Zac Taylor 2023: 9 wins despite losing Burrow half the season
Zac Taylor 2024: Started 1-4. Ended 9-8 but barely missed playoffs
Changes needed to do better in Sept/Oct moving forward.
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(Yesterday, 04:30 PM)Isaac Curtis: The Real #85 Wrote: Me, too. I think it was a pretty reasonable choice given that filling ALL the holes was unrealistic. FA pass rushing DT's were getting WAY more than they merited in FA (I would not have payed one). If we didn't love any of the Rd1 types in the draft, this solution was a decent one.
And while I hated the Stewart pick (too risky, likely needs a year), he does have a high ceiling and if he hits, he can help at DE and interior pass rush. Two birds with one stone. Which is always a tempting bet when you are trying to fill a lot of holes.
Stewart looks like a mismatch for Guards watching him, he is so quick he gets into the Guards chest immediately and he has long arms and
is strong. Saw him beat Fairchild a bit in some of the vids and everyone has been raving about Fairchild until Stewart got signed. Stewart at
DT on passing downs could be very effective. I like what I am seeing now that he is signed.
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(Yesterday, 04:39 PM)ochocincos Wrote: If Stewart can end up notching 6-8 sacks a year, help bolster the run defense, and have versatility to play base end and nickel DT, I can be happy with the pick.
I too was (am) worried he's a couple (or a few) years away from being overly impactful though.
My thought as well. I don't follow college football, nor have I watched more than a few of his highlights. He may not be getting sacks, but he does get wins. He get's pressure on the QB, and IMO, sometimes that's better than a sack if the QB throws desperately, gets picked, or offers another to get to him. Thinking maybe he's a complementary piece to Trey. Can't say for sure since the contract situation is just stupid as all hell.
I'm not sure how supportive his mates were in college either, so my theory could be bullshit. If they were uncomplimentary, then he had a lot on his shoulders. If they were and he still got that sack rate, that's concerning. I do like the pressure, though.
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(Yesterday, 02:23 PM)ochocincos Wrote: The biggest concern for me with Jenkins was lack of proven pass rush coming out of college.
Many scouting reports mentioned it could limit his role in the NFL.
From the snaps I watched (which may have been less than you), I saw a guy with power and motor, but not overly lateral and getting into the backfield too often when rushing the passer without a straight line to the QB.
I didn't see enough pass rush pressure from him last year to make me think he'll be around 4 sacks, 30+ total pressures, which is about my mark for a solid pass rushing IDL.
He did have 3 sacks but only 11 total pressures.
While I think there will be an improvement on the total pressures, I am not willing to bet we're going to >4 sacks or >25 total pressures.
I predict 3-4 sacks, ~20 total pressures in a year where he will grow some, but not explode onto the scene.
Depending on how he develops this year, I may be willing to project him >4 sacks and >25 total pressures in his 3rd season.
Maybe you have paid closer attention to him than I have though and you'll end up being right.
Your rationale makes sense. For our sake, I hope I am right.
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(Yesterday, 01:34 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: True, I am forgetting about him till he shows me something. I saw some good things from Murphy as a rookie late in his first season but last
year he was slow, bad at stopping the run and pretty much invisible out there. Ossai on the other hand was our second best pass rusher by far
last season and should of started over hobbled Sam. Another reason why I am glad we moved on from most of our Defensive coaches.
I know Nate. It was difficult to watch him at times. But knowing he was dealing with an MCL, some of it made sense to me.
I just realized that there may come some plays where we have Murphy and Shemar rushing from opposite edges.
I look forward to that!
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(Yesterday, 02:17 PM)Synric Wrote: Ok more context on the Christian Wilkins saga. Apparently Wilkins playfully tried to kiss a teammate on top of his head lol. I guess the other player didn't like that.
Yeah, I saw that earlier today. Didn't anybody see Sunshine in Remember the Titans?
Seems kinda "light" to prompt a release. I'd assume it's more of a pattern and this was the trigger
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I wanted to sign Wilkins so bad until I saw what kind of contract it would take. Glad I didn’t get my way
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(Yesterday, 04:39 PM)ochocincos Wrote: If Stewart can end up notching 6-8 sacks a year, help bolster the run defense, and have versatility to play base end and nickel DT, I can be happy with the pick.
I too was (am) worried he's a couple (or a few) years away from being overly impactful though.
To get 6-8 sacks he’s going to have to play a ton of snaps. I don’t see that.
Romo “ so impressed with Zac ...1 of the best in the NFL… they are just fundamentally sound. Taylor the best winning % in the Playoffs of current coaches. Joe Burrow” Zac is the best head coach in the NFL & that gives me a lot of confidence." Taylor led the Bengals to their first playoff win since 1990, ending the longest active drought in the four major North American sports, en and appeared in Super Bowl LVI, the first since 1988.
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