(06-15-2016, 11:41 AM)samhain Wrote: I don't think Baelish is interested in her hand in marriage.  It would give away his position and compromise his alliances and cons with the crew in King's Landing.  I believe his interest is in Sansa as a puppet to cement control of 2 major houses.  His aspirations are too big for it to end with that.  

Also, does anyone ever wonder if Baelish secretly knows about R+L=J?  He clearly has some idea on the show after the scene with Sansa in the Winterfell crypts.  Perhaps his endgame has been to back Jon for the iron throne this whole time.  What better way to draw Jon into the conflict than to give his sister to the Boltons and draw him back south of the wall?

Very interesting...  In the books Varys has the young Aegon (baby that had his had smashed or so we were told)  and hes been working his way back into westros.

Varys has always been for the dragons but he doesn't seem to know anything about Jon


Littlefinger I doubt has much knowledge on jons parentage Only 2 people know the truth. well 1 and we have never met him.  Eddard and Holland  Reed.     he probly is trying to pull jon into the frey because its generally easier to get lords to follow a male lord(even though jons a snow hes eddards son in littlefingers eye) in this world at least in most of westroes.

But in the show they might have gifted him this knowledge If a character planned to reveal it is being written out.

Agree on littlefinger not taking sansa hand for the same reasons I thought would he be willing to expose his hand yet? idk... he is lord paralement of the riverlands lord of harrenhall   lord regent of the eryie...   

But if he married Sansa he could be warden of the north.  Although I believe he was already promised that by Ceresi (if shes in a position to honor it or not)  just for killing the boltons.  We know he is already in good standing with the tyrells if they take over kings landing.

so I think littlefinger will diffenately side with the starks...  but sansa marriage could be better used to unify some of the older houses in the north.


Sorry littlefinger is absolutely one of my favorite characters in this story.    and is one of the best 2 at playing the game of thrones.

(06-15-2016, 11:41 AM)samhain Wrote: Also, does anyone ever wonder if Baelish secretly knows about R+L=J?  

Seems like he would, then perhaps marry Sansa and become Lord of Winterfell (which is as far as anyone can hope to climb in one life).

I thought you were going somewhere else with that question re: Sansa.....is Baelish asexual?  Seems like he gets off on power...on the tv show, it's never shown him to have any relations or interest (aside from Cat)

Take that back...he did yeoman's work on the Lady of the Vale, but clearly viewed it as a necessary evil

(06-15-2016, 02:48 PM)JustWinBaby Wrote: Seems like he would, then perhaps marry Sansa and become Lord of Winterfell (which is as far as anyone can hope to climb in one life).

I thought you were going somewhere else with that question re: Sansa.....is Baelish asexual?  Seems like he gets off on power...on the tv show, it's never shown him to have any relations or interest (aside from Cat)

Take that back...he did yeoman's work on the Lady of the Vale, but clearly viewed it as a necessary evil

littlefinger has only loved 1 woman... and she died at the red wedding.   So he says. at least. outside of that and even owning brothels hes seemed more interested in accumulating money and power (or connections) than women...

He seems married to his career of string pulling.

Does anyone think Varys may be up to something more than "recruiting friends" in his secret mission to Westeros? One thing that was mysterious to me was that he took off right before the Masters attacked. He was the one who used his "little birds" to find out that the Masters were financing the Sons of the Harpy. Yet the Masters plan an all out attack on Mereen and he knows nothing of the impending attack? I just find him taking off right before the attack and apparently not knowing it was coming to be a little suspicious. Shouldn't that be something the freaking Master of Spies knows about?

(06-16-2016, 05:00 PM)Beaker Wrote: Does anyone think Varys may be up to something more than "recruiting friends" in his secret mission to Westeros? One thing that was mysterious to me was that he took off right before the Masters attacked. He was the one who used his "little birds" to find out that the Masters were financing the Sons of the Harpy. Yet the Masters plan an all out attack on Mereen and he knows nothing of the impending attack? I just find him taking off right before the attack and apparently not knowing it was coming to be a little suspicious. Shouldn't that be something the freaking Master of Spies knows about?

Varys serves the realm and only the realm. He's made that very clear. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if he is undermining Danys conquest of Westeros. Even more with his distrust of the religious types now that the red priestesses are talking up Dany.

Varys also really hates magic and the Lord of Light. I was rewatching season 2 and he tells Tyrion that only he can stop a man who is fueled by dark magic and an evil god.

(06-16-2016, 05:04 PM)CKwi88 Wrote: Varys serves the realm and only the realm. He's made that very clear. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if he is undermining Danys conquest of Westeros. Even more with his distrust of the religious types now that the red priestesses are talking up Dany.

he might now that danny has the red priestess backing... but he was there when tryion made that so.

He has been undermining westros in hopes of her return to power.  He was the one paying for her when she was in essos hiding before she was married off to the khal.  Of course he was also spying on her because that's what he had to do to survive.

But the show could turn a little different.  Since in the books he was secretly backing both Danny and Aegon.   but when danny wouldn't move to westroes Aegon purchased the golden company and landed in westros while Margery was in prison and the Tyrells refused to do anything till she was out.   (aegon was sieging Storms end...)   

So its possible he turns from danny but not likely    while Aegon had the name and being a male danny has the dragons.

(06-17-2016, 02:27 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: ....while Aegon had the name and being a male danny has the dragons.

Varys: "you make a strong case, Aegon....but f'n dragons!!!"

So battle of the bastards is coming...

And Jaime to the freys keep possibly... Would the battle for the north be a good time to intro lady stoneheart?

Or the alchemist with sam going to the citadel (if sam goes there)

They all but squashed Stoneheart last episode with Beric being alive. The show is better for it anyway.


A thought on Jaime and the Lannister army. Shouldn't the Lannisters be pissed that Roose married Ramsay and Sansa? Didn't that fly against the wishes of the crown? Don't they want Sansa back, or does all that go down the drain with Tudinho gone?

(06-17-2016, 03:16 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: Would the battle for the north be a good time to intro lady stoneheart?

Not sure how they can work her in at this point.  Awful lot of story left to tell and not much time just to show a few scenes of Lady Stoneheart reeking revenge.

Although I could see maybe Ramsey escaping and running into her.  She may run into a few of the Frey's, as well.  But then what do you do with her - is there a reunion, does she die and how....

(06-17-2016, 03:45 PM)JustWinBaby Wrote: Not sure how they can work her in at this point.  Awful lot of story left to tell and not much time just to show a few scenes of Lady Stoneheart reeking revenge.

Although I could see maybe Ramsey escaping and running into her.  She may run into a few of the Frey's, as well.  But then what do you do with her - is there a reunion, does she die and how....

I would say the Freys call for help from the Crown (the crown sends Jaime)   The freys need help because they are being hanged by the brotherhood without banners (who at this point is lead by stoneheart)  although they show the lightening lord alive.  Which he was when they resurrected cat.. but then died again and she took over. No reunion... no one wants to see her do anything besides destroy house frey.. A role that might be given to Jamie.

(06-17-2016, 03:58 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: I would say the Freys call for help from the Crown (the crown sends Jaime)   The freys need help because they are being hanged by the brotherhood without banners (who at this point is lead by stoneheart)  although they show the lightening lord alive.  Which he was when they resurrected cat.. but then died again and she took over.

Interesting.  Read some analysis that assumed him being alive meant no Stoneheart.  Certainly doesn't seem significant enough, to the show at least, to have to bring that character to conclusion.  Are the BWB even important to the show beyond being necessary to the scenes with The Hound?  It appears he may join them, but certainly an open question at this point.

Only having watched the show, the Freys getting weakened by the BWB isn't something I'd put together or suspect.  As only a show watcher, that entire scene seems necessary only for bringing Jaime and Brienne together.

They could show us Stoneheart through one of Bran's visions (which would be a jaw-dropping season finale).  But practically speaking, they really have to move on to larger plot lines in the final 16(?) episodes.

But maybe you can look at Coldhand, and perhaps even the Blackfish (he may not be dead, but as far as we know he is) and think the writers DO seem interested in giving readers some sort of closure.

On the other hand, Ramsey has been so, so, SOOOOOO horrible that only a particularly brutal death will do.  Lady Stoneheart might be the only truly satisfactory option there.

(06-17-2016, 04:24 PM)JustWinBaby Wrote: Interesting.  Read some analysis that assumed him being alive meant no Stoneheart.  Certainly doesn't seem significant enough, to the show at least, to have to bring that character to conclusion.  Are the BWB even important to the show beyond being necessary to the scenes with The Hound?  It appears he may join them, but certainly an open question at this point.

Only having watched the show, the Freys getting weakened by the BWB isn't something I'd put together or suspect.  As only a show watcher, that entire scene seems necessary only for bringing Jaime and Brienne together.

They could show us Stoneheart through one of Bran's visions (which would be a jaw-dropping season finale).  But practically speaking, they really have to move on to larger plot lines in the final 16(?) episodes.

But maybe you can look at Coldhand, and perhaps even the Blackfish (he may not be dead, but as far as we know he is) and think the writers DO seem interested in giving readers some sort of closure.

On the other hand, Ramsey has been so, so, SOOOOOO horrible that only a particularly brutal death will do.  Lady Stoneheart might be the only truly satisfactory option there.

Calling that ramsey Bolton meets his end at the teeth of Ghost... as he is about to finish jon snow... It would only be fitting with how he like to feed people to the dogs.

But all we know in the show about the BWB is that they are in the riverlands fighting for the people  and are or were king Roberts men.   its an angle they can use.  maybe the hound becomes the new leader of the BWB and they use his story line that way.  It seems hound vs mountain isn't gonna happen at ceresi's trail as we had hoped.  since no more trial by combat's...     

it could go a lot of ways but the freys need to go lol... they have to work that in as they broke guest right.   Only issue with stoneheart now is shes been dead a long time so if she hasn't already been resurrected and is out there somewhere not sure if they could pull it off now.   unless bran somehow interjects into the past.  but I don't think there will be time to set that all up in the next 2 episodes.  So I agree she might not be pausable.  But the role she was playing in the destruction of the freys should be handed to someone.

(06-17-2016, 04:39 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: Calling that ramsey Bolton meets his end at the teeth of Ghost... as he is about to finish jon snow... It would only be fitting with how he like to feed people to the dogs.

That's a good call, and the sort of artsy-irony writers often like to use.
I'm probably thinking it takes them longer to bring everything together than it actually will....but I'm struggling to see what role BWB is going to play.  Don't know how big they are, but seem to be kind of a decentralized vigilante group - so nothing major in the way of what they can bring to an army, or even the fight against the WW.
Maybe Arya will re-unite with The Hound and serve the role of Lady Stoneheart?  Leaving The Hound for dead could be a loophole to remove him from her list 

(06-17-2016, 05:00 PM)JustWinBaby Wrote: That's a good call, and the sort of artsy-irony writers often like to use.
I'm probably thinking it takes them longer to bring everything together than it actually will....but I'm struggling to see what role BWB is going to play.  Don't know how big they are, but seem to be kind of a decentralized vigilante group - so nothing major in the way of what they can bring to an army, or even the fight against the WW.
Maybe Arya will re-unite with The Hound and serve the role of Lady Stoneheart?  Leaving The Hound for dead could be a loophole to remove him from her list 

yeah I believe she stop saying his name before that day.

Alright. One day to go. Place your bets for dead or alive: (My picks in bold)

Jon Snow (Lives)
Ramsay Bolton (Dies)
Wun Wun (Lives)
Tormund (Lives)
Ser Davos (Dies)
Rickon (Dies, it's stupid, but he dies)
Ghost (Lives)
Sansa (Lives)

Not sure if these are there or in the battle:

Melisandre
Littlefinger
Brienne
Podrick


The only one I could see dying of these is Melisandre.

And maybe Ramsay lives, and I wouldn't mind it as long as Theon sets dogs on him somewhere down the line to kill him.

What a boring filler no action episode. jk. One of the best episodes in all the series imo, but Im a sucker for battles.

Awesome seeing Dany & her dragons in a battle for the first time.
Also liked her & Tyrion united with Theon and his sister. Best part of the show to me is when the various storylines come together like that.
The Winterfell battle echoed the Two Towers & Return of the King battles. I was just waiting to hear that horn blow in the distance.

CKwi88 pretty much nailed it. And Melisandre's time may be coming to an end soon now that Davos knows the truth.

(06-19-2016, 11:57 PM)Millhouse Wrote: CKwi88 pretty much nailed it. And Melisandre's time may be coming to an end soon now that Davos knows the truth.

And I don't think Jon wants or needs her.

I was actually pretty disappointed in the episode.  The Dany thing was cool.  The battle fell flat for me - and Jon taking the bait was pretty weak to have that character suddenly regress so far like that.  And that mountain of dead bodies - wtf?!?

Predictably, in like the most predictable thing ever, the Knights of the Vale come to the rescue at the last second just as everyone predicted. Pretty much everything of note, save maybe Wun Wun, that happened we all saw coming for weeks. Basically a forgettable transition episode (despite the lame attempts at dramatic action). Very disappointing for the traditionally strongest episode of the year.

And how dare they let that ***** Ramsay kill Wun Wun.

Three big northern houses are ******. The Boltons are done as a house. The Karstarks are done as a house. The Umbers are done as a house. I wonder if Jon eventually offer one of their holds to Tormund and his free people.