I know we wernt good at running last year, but dalton was sacked once in 1st 8 games I believe.

I know ced has struggled but andre smith wasnt awesome last year was he ?? Daltons most sacked qb this year I think.

It's bizarre. Whit is aging quickly ( why we drafted two tackles), Zeitler has regressed, Bodine is just so bad on some plays that it's almost laughable, and the rookie at RT is really scuffling. Interior pressure is a killer, and Dalton has been getting a ton of it

I know bodice sucks he sucked last year. But everyone was saying smith was terrible and ced hasn't been good either . I just don't see how we've become so bad when we were holding dalton up last year

Lack of balance on offense and the loss of both Marvin Jones and Tyler Eifert.

Both lines are almost the same as last year but yes it is bizarre how drastically different they are this season. Does anyone know if its schemes, play calling, or is it just plain not playing up to their potential. I'm at a loss how bad every position is. LB's suck, secondary sucks, ST is a joke, its pretty amazing. I know we have a harder schedule but damn this is pathetic. I couldnt even guess at this point what position we should pick with our first pick. If i had to choose right now with a gun to my head i would say C but this team needs so much more. So close yet so far away.

(10-10-2016, 01:21 AM)The Burfict Answer Wrote: I know bodice sucks he sucked last year. But everyone was saying smith was terrible and ced hasn't been good either . I just don't see how we've become so bad when we were holding dalton up last year

Last year (and indeed every year he has been in the league) Andy has had either the fastest or second fastest release in the NFL. Until this year it covered up pass blocking issues that were evident for a couple of years because bad as they were the line was just barely good enough to give Andy the 2.2 seconds (on average) he needed to get the ball out. Alas this year they are having MAJOR problems with unblocked rushers coming in which has lowered that snap to hit time to 2 or less seconds. Hence the issues. 

People will hate the suggestion I'm getting ready to make, but here goes: Did the Wild Card game last year suck the life out of this group? It was tough as shit to take as a fan. I'm still not over it. Can't imagine how it felt to actually be a part of it.

There was a diaspora of good coaches afterwards as well. They all chased promotions for the most part, but did the feeling of leaving a shit show internally play into it?

Maybe the guys that have been here throughout the Dalton era have finally been Bengalized. I sure as hell hope not, because it would be an absolute shame. They work their asses of year in and year out and meet the same end every single time. Maybe they've just stopped believing that they can do it. It sure looked like a lot of the fight and tenacity had gone out of them in Dallas.

Idk. I just remember getting smacked around by Seattle and coming back in the 4th. I thought we could turn game around until zeke broke that 60 yarder. But dalton can't make a comeback when he's constantly getting hit.

Dude has absolutely no time to throw.

(10-10-2016, 02:16 AM)samhain Wrote: People will hate the suggestion I'm getting ready to make, but here goes:  Did the Wild Card game last year suck the life out of this group?  It was tough as shit to take as a fan.  I'm still not over it.  Can't imagine how it felt to actually be a part of it.

There was a diaspora of good coaches afterwards as well.  They all chased promotions for the most part, but did the feeling of leaving a shit show internally play into it?  

Maybe the guys that have been here throughout the Dalton era have finally been Bengalized.  I sure as hell hope not, because it would be an absolute shame.  They work their asses of year in and year out and meet the same end every single time.  Maybe they've just stopped believing that they can do it.  It sure looked like a lot of the fight and tenacity had gone out of them in Dallas.

You may be right. I don't have a legitimate idea as to what needs to be done to fix the problem.  Maybe the players felt let down by the organization (I.e. FO and Coaches) when the 2-3 players who were primarily responsible for the playoff loss against Pittsburgh were not made to pay a price. There are definitely internal problems and the players seem to know it. Could be why so many players and (a few real) coaches leave at the first real opportunity. I for one, am tired of it.

(10-10-2016, 02:16 AM)samhain Wrote: People will hate the suggestion I'm getting ready to make, but here goes:  Did the Wild Card game last year suck the life out of this group?  It was tough as shit to take as a fan.  I'm still not over it.  Can't imagine how it felt to actually be a part of it.

There was a diaspora of good coaches afterwards as well.  They all chased promotions for the most part, but did the feeling of leaving a shit show internally play into it?  

Maybe the guys that have been here throughout the Dalton era have finally been Bengalized.  I sure as hell hope not, because it would be an absolute shame.  They work their asses of year in and year out and meet the same end every single time.  Maybe they've just stopped believing that they can do it.  It sure looked like a lot of the fight and tenacity had gone out of them in Dallas.

I think it's a legitimate question. And it will be answered as the season goes on.

But just on the practical side, I think we miss the following:

1. Marvin Jones and Tyler Eifert.  We should be getting Eifert back soon, but we've got to get Boyd more involved. Even he is not a deep threat, which Jones was.  Core is probably our best prospect to stretch the field other than Green and we need to get him in there. We may even miss Sanu a little. I'm ok with Lafell, but we've got to get other receivers going.

2. Reggie Nelson.  One of the best non-drafted players we've ever had, and we let him go. We're hurting at safety. Williams is not as good as Reggie, and it seems to me that Iloka is suffering from Nelson's loss, too.

3. Our offensive line is not performing, and I think Cedric O is really struggling.  Andre Smith had his flaws, but was a good right tackle. Cedric will improve.  He was extremely highly rated by everyone coming out of college, and he will come around. But right now he's having some rough snaps.  But this is essentially his rookie year, and he didn't really get a good summer camp at all, either year he's been on the team.  Bodine is Bodine and I think Zeitler is having problems coping with struggling players, now on both sides of him.

4. I think we're seeing a little rust with Burfict, but he'll get over that.  Michael Johnson seems to be in decline, and Geno doesn't seem to be the force we all expect him to be lately.  He's had some good games, but he was certainly neutralized Sunday.

So yes, we did seem a little lifeless Sunday, but I think there are also some practical personnel issues at work, too.

(10-10-2016, 04:43 AM)Thundercloud Wrote: I think it's a legitimate question. And it will be answered as the season goes on.

But just on the practical side, I think we miss the following:

1. Marvin Jones and Tyler Eifert.  We should be getting Eifert back soon, but we've got to get Boyd more involved. Even he is not a deep threat, which Jones was.  Core is probably our best prospect to stretch the field other than Green and we need to get him in there. We may even miss Sanu a little. I'm ok with Lafell, but we've got to get other receivers going.

2. Reggie Nelson.  One of the best non-drafted players we've ever had, and we let him go. We're hurting at safety. Williams is not as good as Reggie, and it seems to me that Iloka is suffering from Nelson's loss, too.

3. Our offensive line is not performing, and I think Cedric O is really struggling.  Andre Smith had his flaws, but was a good right tackle. Cedric will improve.  He was extremely highly rated by everyone coming out of college, and he will come around. But right now he's having some rough snaps.  But this is essentially his rookie year, and he didn't really get a good summer camp at all, either year he's been on the team.  Bodine is Bodine and I think Zeitler is having problems coping with struggling players, now on both sides of him.

4. I think we're seeing a little rust with Burfict, but he'll get over that.  Michael Johnson seems to be in decline, and Geno doesn't seem to be the force we all expect him to be lately.  He's had some good games, but he was certainly neutralized Sunday.

So yes, we did seem a little lifeless Sunday, but I think there are also some practical personnel issues at work, too.

I agree.....but Piano Man has WAY too many high round players and his HAND PICKED center on this unit for it to be this piss poor.  They need to send a message and shit can him today.  Some accountability is sorely lacking in this organization.....and that's as good a place as any to start.  

Don't worry Son of Paul......he can still play your dinner parties.

(10-10-2016, 02:16 AM)samhain Wrote: People will hate the suggestion I'm getting ready to make, but here goes: Did the Wild Card game last year suck the life out of this group? It was tough as shit to take as a fan. I'm still not over it. Can't imagine how it felt to actually be a part of it.

There was a diaspora of good coaches afterwards as well. They all chased promotions for the most part, but did the feeling of leaving a shit show internally play into it?

Maybe the guys that have been here throughout the Dalton era have finally been Bengalized. I sure as hell hope not, because it would be an absolute shame. They work their asses of year in and year out and meet the same end every single time. Maybe they've just stopped believing that they can do it. It sure looked like a lot of the fight and tenacity had gone out of them in Dallas.

I do hate the suggestion, but they sure did look to be Bengalized yesterday. Dalton looked furious. Green looked bored. The o line were turnstiles. The savior Burfict is fat, and looks like he could give a shit. The safeties look like the little kids chasing Rocky up the steps in Philadelphia. The other savior ain't coming back, and if he does, will be hurt again soon enough.


This season's gonna get ugly fellas. Early on, it felt like 2014.... It's gonna be closer to 2010.

I agree with Wyche.... A head needs to roll today. Somebody needs f****n' fired. Alexander, D line coach, Zampese, RB coach.... There are soany worthy candidates.

(10-10-2016, 07:10 AM)Wyche Wrote: I agree.....but Piano Man has WAY too many high round players and his HAND PICKED center on this unit for it to be this piss poor.  They need to send a message and shit can him today.  Some accountability is sorely lacking in this organization.....and that's as good a place as any to start.  

Don't worry Son of Paul......he can still play your dinner parties.

Marvin Lewis' playoff record certainly supports this statement.

I think Caretaker got into our oline's lockers and switched some stuff.......

Might be a factor since, after 5 games, they have not played good, not great or awesome, just even 'good', on both sides of the ball and special teams in the same game so far.

(10-10-2016, 02:16 AM)samhain Wrote: People will hate the suggestion I'm getting ready to make, but here goes:  Did the Wild Card game last year suck the life out of this group?  It was tough as shit to take as a fan.  I'm still not over it.  Can't imagine how it felt to actually be a part of it.

There was a diaspora of good coaches afterwards as well.  They all chased promotions for the most part, but did the feeling of leaving a shit show internally play into it?  

Maybe the guys that have been here throughout the Dalton era have finally been Bengalized.  I sure as hell hope not, because it would be an absolute shame.  They work their asses of year in and year out and meet the same end every single time.  Maybe they've just stopped believing that they can do it.  It sure looked like a lot of the fight and tenacity had gone out of them in Dallas.

Between the Wild Card game, and the Week 2 game in Pittsburgh, it seems like the team has given up.  Honestly, I can't blame them.  It seems pretty obvious that the league is happy to let certain teams get preferential treatment.

(10-10-2016, 04:43 AM)Thundercloud Wrote: I think it's a legitimate question. And it will be answered as the season goes on.

But just on the practical side, I think we miss the following:

1. Marvin Jones and Tyler Eifert.  We should be getting Eifert back soon, but we've got to get Boyd more involved. Even he is not a deep threat, which Jones was.  Core is probably our best prospect to stretch the field other than Green and we need to get him in there. We may even miss Sanu a little. I'm ok with Lafell, but we've got to get other receivers going.

2. Reggie Nelson.  One of the best non-drafted players we've ever had, and we let him go. We're hurting at safety. Williams is not as good as Reggie, and it seems to me that Iloka is suffering from Nelson's loss, too.

3. Our offensive line is not performing, and I think Cedric O is really struggling.  Andre Smith had his flaws, but was a good right tackle. Cedric will improve.  He was extremely highly rated by everyone coming out of college, and he will come around. But right now he's having some rough snaps.  But this is essentially his rookie year, and he didn't really get a good summer camp at all, either year he's been on the team.  Bodine is Bodine and I think Zeitler is having problems coping with struggling players, now on both sides of him.

4. I think we're seeing a little rust with Burfict, but he'll get over that.  Michael Johnson seems to be in decline, and Geno doesn't seem to be the force we all expect him to be lately.  He's had some good games, but he was certainly neutralized Sunday.

So yes, we did seem a little lifeless Sunday, but I think there are also some practical personnel issues at work, too.

Regarding Ogbuehi, I'm not sure he's all he's been cracked up to be.  If I recall correctly, his better years at A&M were spent as an interior lineman since they had both Matthews and Joeckel on the outside.  He didn't move to tackle until those two left for the draft.  When he did make the switch, he pretty much sucked, then he got hurt, missed the rest of the year and got drafted on measurables and footwork, not football ability.  

IMO there was a lot more risk in selecting him than we want to admit.  Everyone thinks we stole some top 5 lock of a talent because he was hurt.  In reality he was a player that needed a fair amount of work in addition to having the injury.  He doesn't look like a guy that carries the kind of bulk that we've traditionally had at the RT spot.   Lots of bust potential in him, I'm afraid.

Our offensive linemen just look... small compared to some of these defensive lines we're going up against. I don't know if its a strength issue, technique issue, or both, but they are all getting pushed back into the pocket. Consistently.

Ogbuehi looks bad. Has no business being a starter right now.

(10-10-2016, 08:19 AM)jason Wrote: I do hate the suggestion, but they sure did look to be Bengalized yesterday. Dalton looked furious. Green looked bored. The o line were turnstiles. The savior Burfict is fat, and looks like he could give a shit. The safeties look like the little kids chasing Rocky up the steps in Philadelphia. The other savior ain't coming back, and if he does, will be hurt again soon enough.


This season's gonna get ugly fellas. Early on, it felt like 2014.... It's gonna be closer to 2010.

I agree with Wyche.... A head needs to roll today. Somebody needs f****n' fired. Alexander, D line coach, Zampese, RB coach.... There are soany worthy candidates.

Yeah, I don't get how Maualuga and Burfict can allow themselves to turn into a couple of slobs in the offseason.  Maualuga's done this in the past and his play obviously suffered from it.  Burfict had an extra 3 weeks to get it together.  People make the Ray Lewis comparisons because he's a smart player, but Ray Lewis lived in the gym.  Pic of Vontaze make you wonder if he's ever seen the inside of one.