(01-11-2018, 11:00 AM)ochocincos Wrote: It wasn't even about the drop for me. It was more the fact the Bengals already had Kroft, Uzomah, and Hewitt healthy by that point IIRC. What's the point of having Carter? Hewitt or Uzomah could have covered Carter's role and then some.

100%

But his gaffes were huge and he didn't see a snap on offense after the bye week, AFAIR.

Before then, he was getting a couple of snaps, here and there.

Could he have been a PA guy? And because of him losing grip over the team as time went on, he was played less and less? Makes sense to me...

When the ball was pooched in the Lions or Bmore game (can't remember) with a few seconds left, he picked it up at the 35 or 40, RIGHT AWAY and instead of running 10 yards (or more), he just sat on the ball in the fetal position.

We all know that AJ has had some Hail Mary magic before and that kind of weakness just pissed me off to high hell. Coupled with the drop, I hope he's gone yesterday, come OTAs.

(01-11-2018, 03:34 AM)treee Wrote: I disagree that we're set at safety. I'd even go as far as to say it is a need behind LB.

What makes you think safety is a need? Or that we aren’t good there?

People are high on our Safety's now that I mentioned their regression under Livinston. But I'm not fooled. Just a week ago when Austin was announced, everyone was quick to say hopefully it meant we'd draft James at 12, or a safety high. So that was a quick turnaround. Why draft James if we are so set at safety. Maybe we need to revisit that thread. Either way, before they got defensive about Williams they already made their feelings known.

(01-10-2018, 12:42 PM)pally Wrote: Robert Livingston who was Kevin Coyle's assistant working with the safeties has been promoted to Secondary Coach.  The team is seeking another person to take over Livingston's role.



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Marvin Lewis’ 2018 #Bengals coaching staff is moving toward completion: Rob Livingston is the team’s secondary coach. He was due.

Maybe Rod Woodson?

(01-10-2018, 04:07 PM)HarleyDog Wrote: Never heard of him but sounds like a car salesman.

Nah, more of an Irish poet who wrote about the great potato famine..
Doctor Livingston I presume? 

Edit: My mistake..Robert Livingston was a lawyer and diplomat who helped draft the Declaration of Independence and also known as "The
Chancellor"..
Might as well have a few more lawyers running the team.. What could possibly go wrong? 

(01-11-2018, 11:35 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: What makes you think safety is a need?  Or that we aren’t good there?

Well for one, I believe in having a true FS. Having a single high safety and have an extra man in the box increases the deadliness of the zone blitz so much more. Sure, Iloka and Williams are serviceable when used in a relatively conservative fashion, but you won't field an elite defense that way imo.

Another reason I think it is a need is that Iloka and Smith seem to refuse to tackle. They throw themselves around going for the big hit, which is nice every now and then. But they've missed some crucial tackles doing that.

And finally, they're just injured too much (specifically Williams). We need more consistency in the secondary.

(01-11-2018, 12:12 AM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Iloka can do both.

And well.


Oh shut up with this nonsense; what proof do you have that ANY team would be worse with this hire?

Miserable nonsense.

Hahaha very tough telling someone to shut up on the internet.  

The defensive coaching hires I feel our downgrades.  There is more stats and signs to point to that than there our that they are upgrades. 

Love the offensive line hire but that happened today.

(01-11-2018, 05:42 PM)treee Wrote: Well for one, I believe in having a true FS. Having a single high safety and have an extra man in the box increases the deadliness of the zone blitz so much more. Sure, Iloka and Williams are serviceable when used in a relatively conservative fashion, but you won't field an elite defense that way imo.

Another reason I think it is a need is that Iloka and Smith seem to refuse to tackle. They throw themselves around going for the big hit, which is nice every now and then. But they've missed some crucial tackles doing that.

And finally, they're just injured too much (specifically Williams). We need more consistency in the secondary.

1. Since Marvin got here he has always used his safeties as interchangeable. He wants hard hitters. We have hard hitters and tone setters.

2. Tone setters aren’t making conservative wrap up tackles. It’s not the style they were drafted to play.

3. Injuries happen.

Your complaints are more about scheme and style of play instead of these players. We just don’t play the boring conservative defense that you seem to want to play. No new safety will ever please you because we just play a style of defense that you don’t seem to want to watch. Dallas plays that awful and boring Tampa 2 so maybe that would be better for you to enjoy.

(01-11-2018, 08:38 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: 1. Since Marvin got here he has always used his safeties as interchangeable. He wants hard hitters. We have hard hitters and tone setters.

2. Tone setters aren’t making conservative wrap up tackles. It’s not the style they were drafted to play.

3. Injuries happen.

Your complaints are more about scheme and style of play instead of these players. We just don’t play the boring conservative defense that you seem to want to play. No new safety will ever please you because we just play a style of defense that you don’t seem to want to watch. Dallas plays that awful and boring Tampa 2 so maybe that would be better for you to enjoy.

What are you talking about? Our scheme, especially as it pertains to safeties, is extremely conservative. It looks like their only job is to prevent big plays; they haven't been, nor probably have they been asked, to be dynamic

(01-11-2018, 10:50 AM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: I still think we're good.

We weren't beat constantly in cover 2 or with a safety deep, this year (or the previous years, for that matter) thus I think we're set... but I can definitely see them draft one in the 3rd or 4th, to be our 3rd down/cover guy.


Oh GOD...

That drop is so infuriating, I think about it from time to time...

Yeah, we're in okay shape at Safety.  But a guy back there with a real nose for the ball wouldn't break my heart either.  Would be a huge boon to our defense.  Somebody who could do to offenses what Reggie did to the Steelers.  Give me another one of those, please.

(01-11-2018, 08:56 PM)N_B Wrote: What are you talking about? Our scheme, especially as it pertains to safeties, is extremely conservative. It looks like their only job is to prevent big plays; they haven't been, nor probably have they been asked, to be dynamic

Unless you are going straight man cover 0 the safeties stay back. Conservative isn’t what the bengals do compared to many other teams.

Playing safeties back isn’t conservative.... it’s what they do.

(01-11-2018, 09:04 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Unless you are going straight man cover 0 the safeties stay back. Conservative isn’t what the bengals do compared to many other teams.

Playing safeties back isn’t conservative.... it’s what they do.

In what ways are we aggressive? Huge mix of soft zone cover and we are in the bottom of the league on blitzing.

(01-11-2018, 09:10 PM)N_B Wrote: In what ways are we aggressive? Huge mix of soft zone cover and we are in the bottom of the league on blitzing.

Pretty aggressive up front. DL are active. Also zone does not equal a soft defense.

We have to protect the linebackers somehow.

(01-11-2018, 09:14 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Pretty aggressive up front. DL are active. Also zone does not equal a soft defense.

We have to protect the linebackers somehow.

Aggressive up front? How?

And yes, soft zone does indicate lack of aggression, particularly when it's paired with a lack of blitzing up front, which it often is.

Dude, our defensive philosophy was literally "ben but don't break." That's helpful in the redzone, but that is the definition of play
Not to lose

(01-11-2018, 09:14 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Pretty aggressive up front.  DL are active.   Also zone does not equal a soft defense.  

We have to protect the linebackers somehow.

What I wonder is, where the hell are the LB's on those days TE's are having career days against us?

(01-11-2018, 09:16 PM)N_B Wrote: Aggressive up front? How?

And yes, soft zone does indicate lack of aggression, particularly when it's paired with a lack of blitzing up front, which it often is.

Dude, our defensive philosophy was literally "ben but don't break." That's helpful in the redzone, but that is the definition of play
Not to lose

Who do you think is aggressive?

(01-11-2018, 09:18 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Who do you think is aggressive?

I don't follow other organizations nearly as closely, so I'm not sure.

What I do know is we are statistically and philosophically one of the more conservative defenses out there. The way our safeties are asked to play is a clear example of this; keep everything in front, looking for hitting/tackling more so than turnovers, etc

I'm not a big fan of our safety play honestly, but I would much rather have Iloka over Williams.

I honestly believe he hurts a teammate 4-5 times a year because he always leads with his shoulder and turns his head.

It does sound like Derwin James is a target for us.

(01-11-2018, 09:17 PM)McC Wrote: What I wonder is, where the hell are the LB's on those days TE's are having career days against us?

Ikr. Would love to get an LB who could cover a little.

(01-11-2018, 09:21 PM)N_B Wrote: I don't follow other organizations nearly as closely, so I'm not sure.

What I do know is we are statistically and philosophically one of the more conservative defenses out there. The way our safeties are asked to play is a clear example of this; keep everything in front, looking for hitting/tackling more so than turnovers, etc

“One of the” is not mentioning who you believe is aggressive. Our safeties play pretty much what the league plays . Are you saying overall the league is conservative? Every team in our own division plays a more conservative defense than we do...