TE RODNEY HOLMAN.....3 time Pro Bowl ('88-'90). Bengal career 11 yrs, 318 rec, 13.6 avg, 34 td. Best season '89, 50 rec, 736 yds, 14.7 avg, 9 td.

TE TONY MCGEE.....Bengal career 9 yrs, 299 rec, 12.7 avg, 20 td. Best season '95, 55 rec, 754 yds, 13.7 avg, 4 td.

WR MARVIN JONES....Bengal career 3 yrs, 134 rec, 12.9 avg, 15 td. 2 yrs with Lions 116 rec, 2031, 17.5 avg, 13 td

Thinking Reggie Kelly should get a nod. But with those provided gimme Holman

Holman hands down. Marvin had that one year where he caught everything thrown to him in the end zone, but Holman was a beast.

(05-19-2018, 10:28 PM)Ravage Wrote: Holman hands down. Marvin had that one year where he caught everything thrown to him in the end zone, but Holman was a beast.

Tony McGee by far.

Aside from Blake for 3 years, who was throwing him the ball?

Not the HOFer(s) that threw Holman the ball.

AND he was a very good blocker too, something Holman was not.

I went with McGee as well. He was money on some pretty awful teams.

I liked Reggie Kelly. He was the kind of player you took for granted until he was gone.

Rolling with Tony McGee. Another gem that gets no love because he played through the lost decade. Great numbers, and he did it with some bad QB play mixed in there.

(05-19-2018, 11:20 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Tony McGee by far.

Aside from Blake for 3 years, who was throwing him the ball?

Not the HOFer(s) that threw Holman the ball.

AND he was a very good blocker too, something Holman was not.

Damn brother, you just about made me spit out my coffee with that comment. 

How in world did you come to the conclusion that Holman wasn't a good blocking TE?

As for the poll, it's a tough call between Holman and McGee. Both were very talented players and had good all-around games. I'll have to go Holman - just because of his value to some very good offenses, but McGee deserves a ton of credit for what he accomplished on some pretty bad teams.

Rodney Holman, for sure. Do not forget how many other great receiving threats were also on Holman's teams. Three time All Pro. McGee was a good player but he was no Rodney Holman.

(05-20-2018, 02:24 PM)McC Wrote: Rodney Holman, for sure.  Do not forget how many other great receiving threats were also on Holman's teams.  Three time All Pro.  McGee was a good player but he was no Rodney Holman.

Yep. As much as I liked and admired Tony McGee...Holman was a special cat.

(05-20-2018, 02:24 PM)McC Wrote: Rodney Holman, for sure.  Do not forget how many other great receiving threats were also on Holman's teams.  Three time All Pro.  McGee was a good player but he was no Rodney Holman.

McGee played with better receivers (Pickens and Darnay). Still produced similar numbers to Holman with inferior QB play.

Sports writers determine who makes the All Pro teams, so naturally the guy playing on the successful team is going to get more love from the press than the guy whose teams went 45-99 overall. Heck, Pickens didn't even make All Pro when he went for 1234 yards and led the league with 17 TDs. What's that tell ya?

I like Jones and McGee, but Holman was a better player in my mind.

(05-20-2018, 02:55 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: McGee played with better receivers (Pickens and Darnay). Still produced similar numbers to Holman with inferior QB play.

Sports writers determine who makes the All Pro teams, so naturally the guy playing on the successful team is going to get more love from the press than the guy whose teams went 45-99 overall. Heck, Pickens didn't even make All Pro when he went for 1234 yards and led the league with 17 TDs. What's that tell ya?

All you had to do to know who was better was watch both play, imo. 

McGee--good player.

Holman--fantastic player.  In my mind, it isn't even all that close.

Holman and it's not close.

Holman hands down

yet was a fan of each listed

(05-20-2018, 01:15 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: Damn brother, you just about made me spit out my coffee with that comment. 

How in world did you come to the conclusion that Holman wasn't a good blocking TE?

As for the poll, it's a tough call between Holman and McGee. Both were very talented players and had good all-around games. I'll have to go Holman - just because of his value to some very good offenses, but McGee deserves a ton of credit for what he accomplished on some pretty bad teams.

Prove me wrong

(05-20-2018, 04:28 PM)McC Wrote: All you had to do to know who was better was watch both play, imo. 

McGee--good player.

Holman--fantastic player.  In my mind, it isn't even all that close.

This.  Loved Tony McGee, but Holman was just on another level -- in the conversation of all-time great TEs, IMO.

(05-20-2018, 09:26 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Prove me wrong

Unfortunately no video clips/advanced stats since Holman pre-dated YouTube and PFF ... but the secondary sources all seem to agree with my recollection that Holman was, in fact, an excellent blocker.  

- Holman consistently posted solid numbers for the Bengals while being an excellent blocker. “His blocking is a pretty thing to watch.”[34] - Tiger Johnson.  http://highwaytohalloffame.blogspot.com/2014/01/road-to-hall-closed-to-tight-ends.html


- ``It`s hard to find a guy who can do both. Usually what you end up finding is a guy who is a real good blocker and an average receiver or a guy who is a pretty good receiver and not a very good blocker.``There are so few who can do both.  The best all-round tight ends, those who combine blocking and catching, are Steve Jordan of the Minnesota Vikings, Mark Bavaro of the New York Giants and Rodney Holman of the Cincinnati Bengals.  http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1989-11-19/sports/8903110422_1_tight-average-receiver-guy


- A 3-time Pro Bowl selection from 1988 to 1990, Holman's superb blocking and pass catching abilities were a great asset to his team, and assisted the Bengals to an NFL championship appearance in Super Bowl XIII.  https://upclosed.com/people/rodney-holman/


- A noted blocker and receiver ... https://allstatesugarbowl.org/classic/rodney-holman-hall-of-fame/


- Holman was noted as a superb receiver and blocker.  https://www.cincyjungle.com/2011/7/16/2278839/poll-best-bengals-player-to-wear-no-82-in-franchise-history


- Holman's superb blocking and pass catching abilities were a great asset to his team.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rodney_Holman


- Versatile player who was an excellent blocker and good pass receiver with speed and strength to make big plays.  http://www.bengals.com/first50.html


- Unlike many of the stars at the position today, Holman was both an able blocker and a great pass-catcher.  https://www.cincyjungle.com/veteransofcincinnati/2016/6/23/11998724/which-bengals-from-the-1980s-would-you-want-on-the-2016-roster


- He was an excellent blocker as well as a receiver.  http://bravestarrcards.com/rodney-holman-ttm-success/


- He gave the Bengals something extra as a receiver and blocker.  http://buffalonews.com/1989/12/22/reed-ritcher-thomas-make-felser-all-pro/


I was only able to find a single source claiming that Holman was not a good blocker -- your post.

Reggie Kelly

(05-19-2018, 10:07 PM)fredtoast Wrote: TE RODNEY HOLMAN.....3 time Pro Bowl ('88-'90).  Bengal career 11 yrs, 318 rec, 13.6 avg, 34 td.  Best season '89, 50 rec, 736 yds, 14.7 avg, 9 td.

TE TONY MCGEE.....Bengal career 9 yrs, 299 rec, 12.7 avg, 20 td.  Best season '95, 55 rec, 754 yds, 13.7 avg, 4 td.

WR MARVIN JONES....Bengal career 3 yrs, 134 rec, 12.9 avg, 15 td.  2 yrs with Lions 116 rec, 2031, 17.5 avg, 13 td

(05-20-2018, 09:26 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: Prove me wrong

As someone who watched every game that Rodney played as a Bengal and knows the respect he earned around the league as both a talented receiver and an very effective blocker - it was just weird to hear someone say he wasn't a 'good blocker'.

I've never talked to or heard any fan - who actually watched him play - question his blocking. As Shanebo posted, just about anytime you see a reference to Holman's play/career, his blocking is talked about in addition to his pass catching skills - and for good reason.

I think if you can find and watch some of his games online somewhere, you'll come away very impressed.

I would pick McGee as the best but I miss Reggie Kelly the most. It was heartbreaking watching him get injured and receiving the bad news on Hard Knocks.