(08-24-2018, 08:24 AM)pdub2005 Wrote: Hunt was a 2nd rounder

Hunt was a real disappointment. I got one of his jerseys, as I just knew he was going to be a wrecking ball. All the physical gifts, but lacks the mean streak.....

(08-24-2018, 08:52 AM)Sled21 Wrote: Hunt was a real disappointment. I got one of his jerseys, as I just knew he was going to be a wrecking ball. All the physical gifts, but lacks the mean streak.....

I think it was more scheme fit. Hunt ended up playing pretty well last year for the Colts in their 3-4 as a DE.

(08-23-2018, 01:03 PM)fredtoast Wrote: No.  He means the opposite of that.  We drafted Carl Lawson based on his athletic ability, not his production.

We have tried drafting for production over athletic ability before (Roderick Muckleroy, Nick Vigil) and that has not always worked out either.

Good chance Malik has a better NFL career than Shaqueam.

As a fan, I would love that...as a skeptic, I would bet my house against that.  

(08-23-2018, 03:34 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Brother, Walton is the pick you ought to be crying over. We should of taken Shaq there, he was still available...

Malik has great talent, but he is a project we will see.

True, but I included them together as the guys that we could have had Orlando Brown and Shaq Griffin.   Not sure how Brown is faring in Baltimore, but I would be willing to bet on him over the dumpster fire we have at RT. 

(08-24-2018, 12:43 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: As a fan, I would love that...as a skeptic, I would bet my house against that.  

Weren't you the one betting your house that Ross was healthy and prepared enough to play last year?

Guys who have never set foot in an NFL locker room yet claim they are smarter than all NFL teams crack me up.

(08-23-2018, 03:52 PM)Synric Wrote: Actually it's not. 

The reason Griffin went in the 5th round is because he was too small to play 3-4 rush backer in the NFL like he did in college. Griffin had to switch to either a 34 inside backer or a 43 outside linebacker. If they had drafted him it would have been due to his freak athleticism and not experience at the position.

Jefferson on the other hand did play WILL and MIKE in college so he has experience and freak athleticisim.


Now if you want to mention that  OT Orlando Brown (I wasn't big on him) was taken a few picks after Jefferson you'd have an arguement. Of course I think it would been rd3 pick 13 for Brown Rd 3 pick 14 for Hubbard because giving Brown free pizza for a year probably wouldn't be the brightset move...

I have mentioned Brown instead of Jefferson, many times.  And Jefferson is not big enough to play MIKE in the NFL, either.  

Griffin is too small, huh?  Do you know he has the EXACT dimensions (sans one hand) of one Odell Thurman that was the most dominant rookie MLB I have ever seen?  Five INTs and five forced fumbles in one season!  No one said he was too small.  And your description about the positions and their so-called job descriptions is exactly what I am talking about with the Bengals brass.  The NFL is changing and there needs to be more speed at the LB position.  Griffin has the NFL record (I believe) for LBs in the 40 yard dash at the combine.  He also has what I believe Jefferson lacks...instincts.  

I want Jefferson to pan out.  I really, really do.  But Griffin was exactly the "I will show the world" attitude and speed freak that I wanted in that LB mold.  Or he could play the hybrid safety.  I absolutely love that kid and HATE that we lost out on drafting him. 

(08-23-2018, 11:39 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: You mean like taking Malik Jefferson, the athlete, over Shaq Griffin, that tackling machine?

Last year Shaquem Griffin averaged 5.7 tackles per game playing against American Conference competition.  Malik Jefferson averaged 9.3 playing against the Pac 12.

(08-24-2018, 12:54 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: I have mentioned Brown instead of Jefferson, many times.  And Jefferson is not big enough to play MIKE in the NFL, either.  

Griffin is too small, huh?  Do you know he has the EXACT dimensions (sans one hand) of one Odell Thurman that was the most dominant rookie MLB I have ever seen?  Five INTs and five forced fumbles in one season!  No one said he was too small.  And your description about the positions and their so-called job descriptions is exactly what I am talking about with the Bengals brass.  The NFL is changing and there needs to be more speed at the LB position.  Griffin has the NFL record (I believe) for LBs in the 40 yard dash at the combine.  He also has what I believe Jefferson lacks...instincts.  

I want Jefferson to pan out.  I really, really do.  But Griffin was exactly the "I will show the world" attitude and speed freak that I wanted in that LB mold.  Or he could play the hybrid safety.  I absolutely love that kid and HATE that we lost out on drafting him. 

Umm I said Griffin was to small to play 34 outside linebacker like he did in college. He had to switch to outside 43 linebacker for the Hawks which he had never played before...That is why he was a 5th round pick. I never mentioned he was to small to play off the ball linebacker.


PS: Which was exactly what Mike Maynock said about Griffin on draft day when Rich Eisen was throwing a hissy fit that no one had drafted Griffin yet.

(08-24-2018, 12:48 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: True, but I included them together as the guys that we could have had Orlando Brown and Shaq Griffin.   Not sure how Brown is faring in Baltimore, but I would be willing to bet on him over the dumpster fire we have at RT. 

Could of been the right way to go, but it is too early to tell IMO.

(08-24-2018, 12:54 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: I have mentioned Brown instead of Jefferson, many times.  And Jefferson is not big enough to play MIKE in the NFL, either.  

Griffin is too small, huh?  Do you know he has the EXACT dimensions (sans one hand) of one Odell Thurman that was the most dominant rookie MLB I have ever seen?  Five INTs and five forced fumbles in one season!  No one said he was too small.  And your description about the positions and their so-called job descriptions is exactly what I am talking about with the Bengals brass.  The NFL is changing and there needs to be more speed at the LB position.  Griffin has the NFL record (I believe) for LBs in the 40 yard dash at the combine.  He also has what I believe Jefferson lacks...instincts.  

I want Jefferson to pan out.  I really, really do.  But Griffin was exactly the "I will show the world" attitude and speed freak that I wanted in that LB mold.  Or he could play the hybrid safety.  I absolutely love that kid and HATE that we lost out on drafting him. 

Malik Jefferson is a big Linebacker, way bigger than Shaq Racer.

But you are correct about Shaq Griffin, would of loved to have him as you know he was my Linebacker i wanted in
the 4th round in almost all my mocks. But honestly was very surprised Malik fell to us in the 3rd, had a 2nd round
grade on him cause of his upside which is through the roof.

Shaq Griffin does have the greatest drive though, think he will do big things in Seattle, more than his bro.

(08-24-2018, 12:52 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Weren't you the one betting your house that Ross was healthy and prepared enough to play last year?

Guys who have never set foot in an NFL locker room yet claim they are smarter than all NFL teams crack me up.

I was the one that saw the admittedly immature "healthy scratch, LMAO" video and saw him torching our secondary when we didn't have a single other WR generating separation, yes.

As far as claiming I am smarter than all NFL teams is a bit of a leap.  It is like calling you a complete douchebag, when you only act like one 50% of the time.  BTW, care to look back at other draft analysis I made over the years and see how those players are doing?  I have actually been pretty good on talent evaluation....and it isn't hindsight.  It was before the draft.  

(08-24-2018, 01:06 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Last year Shaquem Griffin averaged 5.7 tackles per game playing against American Conference competition.  Malik Jefferson averaged 9.3 playing against the Pac 12.

And in 2016, Griffin had 32 more tackles than Jefferson...the year before Jefferson became the hybrid LB in that defense.  

Not to mention Griffin had way more sacks, passes defensed, and forced fumbles...if that kind of thing is important to you in your LB.  

(08-24-2018, 01:09 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Could of been the right way to go, but it is too early to tell IMO.


Malik Jefferson is a big Linebacker, way bigger than Shaq Racer.

But you are correct about Shaq Griffin, would of loved to have him as you know he was my Linebacker i wanted in
the 4th round in almost all my mocks. But honestly was very surprised Malik fell to us in the 3rd, had a 2nd round
grade on him cause of his upside which is through the roof.

Shaq Griffin does have the greatest drive though, think he will do big things in Seattle, more than his bro.

I think Jefferson is about 1" taller and 17 lbs heavier.  And he doesn't have good instincts.  If Shaq does better than his bro, he will be amazing.  His brother, as a rookie CB, played in 15 games, with 11 starts, had 59 tackles, one sack, one INT, and 15 passes defensed.  Pretty damn good first year.  

(08-24-2018, 06:51 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: I think Jefferson is about 1" taller and 17 lbs heavier.  And he doesn't have good instincts.  If Shaq does better than his bro, he will be amazing.  His brother, as a rookie CB, played in 15 games, with 11 starts, had 59 tackles, one sack, one INT, and 15 passes defensed.  Pretty damn good first year.  

True that, great rookie campaign.

One hell of a family that is for sure.

The Seahawks will do well picking both of those guys.

I just think the one handed one is very special in a great way.

(08-24-2018, 06:42 PM)SHRacerX Wrote:  BTW, care to look back at other draft analysis I made over the years and see how those players are doing?  I have actually been pretty good on talent evaluation....and it isn't hindsight.  It was before the draft.  

2016....Kevid Dodd or Mackensie Alexander in the first round?  Braxton Miller in the second?

2017....2nd round pick Adam Bisnowaty has racked up a total of one start in 2 years on a team with one of the worst O-lines in the league and 3rd round pick Tyler Orlosky has not even made an NFL roster.  Too bad we didn't have you drafting to fix our O-line, right?  Of course we could have been set at WR if we had taken Amara Darbroh in the 2nd round.  And Jaylen Myrick and Jake Butt in the third was a brilliant move.  How silly of the Jags to wait til the 7th round to take Myrick and Denver to take BUtt in the fifth.

(08-24-2018, 07:41 PM)fredtoast Wrote: 2016....Kevid Dodd or Mackensie Alexander in the first round?  Braxton Miller in the second?

2017....2nd round pick Adam Bisnowaty has racked up a total of one start in 2 years on a team with one of the worst O-lines in the league and 3rd round pick Tyler Orlosky has not even made an NFL roster.  Too bad we didn't have you drafting to fix our O-line, right?  Of course we could have been set at WR if we had taken Amara Darbroh in the 2nd round.  And Jaylen Myrick and Jake Butt in the third was a brilliant move.  How silly of the Jags to wait til the 7th round to take Myrick and Denver to take BUtt in the fifth.

Check out my predictions, they are pretty damn good if I do say so myself.

(08-20-2018, 12:05 PM)Go Cards Wrote: Hard to argue against anything said here. 

Except the fact that I saw Billings projected as a late first/ early second round pick in certain articles that year. To call him overhyped is 20/20 hindsight/ revionist history.

(08-24-2018, 08:57 PM)jason Wrote: Except the fact that I saw Billings projected as a late first/ early second round pick in certain articles that year. To call him overhyped is 20/20 hindsight/ revionist history.

Where he was projected means nothing. 

Unless you were actually reading a real NFL scouts report. 

But really never said he was overhyped but believe the ones who do say so are talking about on this message board.

(08-24-2018, 07:41 PM)fredtoast Wrote: 2016....Kevid Dodd or Mackensie Alexander in the first round?  Braxton Miller in the second?

2017....2nd round pick Adam Bisnowaty has racked up a total of one start in 2 years on a team with one of the worst O-lines in the league and 3rd round pick Tyler Orlosky has not even made an NFL roster.  Too bad we didn't have you drafting to fix our O-line, right?  Of course we could have been set at WR if we had taken Amara Darbroh in the 2nd round.  And Jaylen Myrick and Jake Butt in the third was a brilliant move.  How silly of the Jags to wait til the 7th round to take Myrick and Denver to take BUtt in the fifth.

Knew you would cherry pick the absolute best!  And was that before Butt was even injured?  Darboh was also injured.  

I will go back and pull up some of the ones you didn't cherry pick on actual mock drafts.  

Geno and Dunlap are two of my all time favorite Bengals after well over 30 years of watching. I feel like you can build a really good team around players like that, same as AJ. I hope we can sign both of them. I do understand that we are getting more depth at DE, but I still hope we keep Dunlap. Atkins should play here until he retires. He is a hall of famer, and its an honor to have a player of his caliber on our team. Same with AJ. These dudes are elite in the all time NFL picture. We need to get them a ring.

(08-24-2018, 07:41 PM)fredtoast Wrote: 2016....Kevid Dodd or Mackensie Alexander in the first round?  Braxton Miller in the second?

2017....2nd round pick Adam Bisnowaty has racked up a total of one start in 2 years on a team with one of the worst O-lines in the league and 3rd round pick Tyler Orlosky has not even made an NFL roster.  Too bad we didn't have you drafting to fix our O-line, right?  Of course we could have been set at WR if we had taken Amara Darbroh in the 2nd round.  And Jaylen Myrick and Jake Butt in the third was a brilliant move.  How silly of the Jags to wait til the 7th round to take Myrick and Denver to take BUtt in the fifth.

Yep, here's what good ol' Fred didn't share of the 2016 draft SIM:

24: R1P24  

CB WILLIAM JACKSON III
HOUSTON
- Has the great ball-tracking abilities (28 passes defenses last season alone).  A bit raw, but I like his play-making ability much better than that of Dre K when he came out of college.  


NAILED IT


55: R2P24  
WR BRAXTON MILLER
OHIO STATE
- I had other WRs ranked higher, but Miller provides the immediate help at slot receiver with the speed to help stretch the field if he moves outside.  He needs to improve his deep ball tracking ability, but I love his long term potential.  He also has the team-first mindset and maturity to make it in the NFL. 


Injured, not ready to shut the door on him at all.

87: R3P24  
S VONN BELL
OHIO STATE
- A steal here.  A very complete safety coming out of OSU.  Has the toughness needed to keep this secondary strong.   


Absolute stud for the Saints

122: R4P24  
DT D.J. READER
CLEMSON
- Boom or bust pick that many might not like, but this is our immovable object to replace Peko down the road.  Could rotate in this season.  I think with the right environment, Reader could be an early round value and fits our defense perfectly.  

So far, a much better career than Billings, and a very solid NT

161: R5P22  
DE BRONSON KAUFUSI
BYU
- Not the biggest fan of his, but he was BPA in this round and fits at RDE with the potential to slide inside on passing downs.  Relentless motor might push Hunt and Clarke in what is likely already their last shot.  


Ravens took him in the third round...what do they know?  He's been oft injured and a backup. 

199: R6P24  
WR MICHAEL THOMAS
SOUTHERN MISS
- A burner to develop out of Southern Miss.  Has outstanding YPC and ability to stretch the field.  If Miller stays in the slot, Thomas may be able to take Marvin's "X" receiver after being developed behind Lafell.

Rams took right here in the 6th round (what do they know) and he has had a slow start and a PED violation.

245: R7P24  
RB DEVON JOHNSON
MARSHALL
- Not my favorite back by any means, but I like the idea of a big, bruising back to finish games, move the chains, and catch the occasional dump pass.  A brute when healthy, and an outstanding b


Signed as UDFA by the Panthers.