(11-13-2018, 02:22 PM)fredtoast Wrote: The problem is that every "proven" head coach has "proven" that he is bad enough to get fired.  I'd love to have a former head coach who always won, but those guys are not looking for jobs.

If I were to actually start looking at who is available as a head coach I might come across a former head coach I would favor over a coordinator, but it all depends on why he lost his former job.

I am well aware that just being a good coordinator does not mean a guy will be a good head coach.

John Fox was fired after a 12-4 campaign in Denver.  John Harbaugh is going to be out in Baltimore because Ozzie Newsome is retiring and the new GM wants to bring in his own guy.  Carroll may be gone at year's end and hasn't had a losing record since 2011.

To me, it's a pretty easy fix.

1. We need to find a RT. If it's free agency, great, if its a draft day trade, great.
2. We need to find a RG. If it's free agency, great, if its a draft day trade, great.

Defensively we need a complete scheme change. With the new pass-happy offenses, you need to get rid of anyone who can't cover. Get me another safety with range like Bates. Get me a safety or undersized linebacker that can cover.

You truly need 7 guys on the back end that can cover.

(11-13-2018, 03:23 PM)Whatever Wrote: John Fox was fired after a 12-4 campaign in Denver.  John Harbaugh is going to be out in Baltimore because Ozzie Newsome is retiring and the new GM wants to bring in his own guy.  Carroll may be gone at year's end and hasn't had a losing record since 2011.

Fox and Carroll are exceptions.  I would definitely consider either of those guys.

Harbaugh has only had one winning season since his Super Bowl 6 years ago.  Not too impressed with him.

(11-13-2018, 04:11 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Fox and Carroll are exceptions.  I would definitely consider either of those guys.

Harbaugh has only had one winning season since his Super Bowl 6 years ago.  Not too impressed with him.

Agreed on Harbaugh, I wouldn't really be that excited to have him. His teams often seem rather underwhelming on offense.

I wouldn't have much care for Fox, but man if Carroll was let go, I'd be ALL over that. His teams are always fighting, and I love his energy. Definitely a SB caliber coach. I worry about the changing of the league to so much offense though, I wonder if guys like Carroll are getting phased out.

WE pool our money and buy mega millions and powerball tickets, win both multiple times especially when they're up to 500,000,000 plus and then buy out the Brown family and hire the best coaches and players money can buy.. Of course that's just throwing money away on our part since we don't get anything from the Bengals winning other than title of co-ownership of a small market team, but heck.. I really have little use for a billion dollars anyway . I wouldn't know what to do with myself. 

(11-13-2018, 07:18 PM)grampahol Wrote: I wouldn't know what to do with myself. 

You could hire some one to figure that out for you.

(11-12-2018, 12:45 PM)bengalfan74 Wrote: Sadly we're rounding 3rd on a rebuild. It's a lot closer than most of us want to admit.

What I'd really love to see is Marvin Lewis gone the day after the season is over. 100% offensive minded new HC

Retain the core with an eye towards rebuilding, but, try and give these guys one more shot. Get some REAL free agents in here over the off season. Top Shelf OT, LB, OG

Trade up and get a hot rookie QB and let him sit and learn behind Dalton for a season.

Draft another high round Olineman and LBer.

All of which would be building for the future QB.

Maybe they promote Lazor to HC and move Hue to OC.  Or, they may promote Hue to HC and keep Lazor as OC if Lewis leaves.  I prefer the former.  Either way, the fan base needs to prepare that Hue is in the plans in some capacity.  

(11-13-2018, 04:11 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Fox and Carroll are exceptions.  I would definitely consider either of those guys.

Harbaugh has only had one winning season since his Super Bowl 6 years ago.  Not too impressed with him.

Carroll would be a good fit, imo.  He has plenty of experience with trying to get players for his system as a college HC and I think his energy and attitude would go over well with the fans.

Harbaugh actually has 2 winning seasons since winning the SB, plus two .500 campaigns. In his case, he really hasn't had a lot of talent to work with in recent years.  They have been handcuffed against the cap with a mega deal for an average starting QB, key players got old, they haven't drafted well, and they've done a poor job of retaining their good players.  Still, the guy has a 10-5 playoff record and can actually beat the Steelers.

(11-13-2018, 07:53 PM)psychdoctor Wrote: Maybe they promote Lazor to HC and move Hue to OC.  Or, they may promote Hue to HC and keep Lazor as OC if Lewis leaves.  I prefer the former.  Either way, the fan base needs to prepare that Hue is in the plans in some capacity.  

What makes you think Lazor will be a good HC?

We're 21st in Pass Yards and 25th in Rushing Yards and 25th overall in total yards.

(11-14-2018, 12:09 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: What makes you think Lazor will be a good HC?

We're 21st in Pass Yards and 25th in Rushing Yards and 25th overall in total yards.

I think they will promote from within and Lazor or Hue are the logical choice given the Front Office history.  Between those two, I would prefer Lazor. Not saying it is the right thing to do.

I'd stock the team full of young talent, let Marvin coach them up to NFL standard while padding cap room for 1-2 years, and bet the farm on who I most anticipated to be the next Walsh/Belichick whilst making sure that that person had as many resources available to them to ensure that they would succeed(analytics dept. etc.)

But...with this team I wouldn't go for a rebuild.  I'd try to win with Dalton/Green/Dunlap/Atkins/Burfict(if he wants to)/Boling/etc.  This core deserves a win now approach.  If they were worse than they are, I could see a rebuild, but these dudes are grown men who have poured their hearts and souls into their craft.  I'd try to win with that core and worry about a rebuild later.

(11-14-2018, 06:31 AM)Bilbo Saggins Wrote: I'd stock the team full of young talent, let Marvin coach them up to NFL standard while padding cap room for 1-2 years, and bet the farm on who I most anticipated to be the next Walsh/Belichick whilst making sure that that that person had as many resources available to them to ensure that they would succeed(analytics dept. etc.)

But...with this team I wouldn't go for a rebuild.  I'd try to win with Dalton/Green/Dunlap/Atkins/Burfict(if he wants to)/Boling/etc.  This core deserves a win now approach.  If they were worse than they are, I could see a rebuild, but these dudes are grown men who have poured their hearts and souls into their craft.  I'd try to win with that core and worry about a rebuild later.

But still win the lottos and buy out the Brown family..

I think Lazor's offense (system) at least looks like it has future potential. Far more promising then Austins Defense was showing. We have to think like the Bengals and they aren't likely to be competitive with all the other openings expected after the season.

(11-13-2018, 01:26 PM)Whatever Wrote: Hue will never get another HC gig unless he's an interim HC for someone that gets canned mid season.

I dunno man, I have an uneasy feeling about this.......

(11-14-2018, 03:59 AM)psychdoctor Wrote: I think they will promote from within and Lazor or Hue are the logical choice given the Front Office history.  Between those two, I would prefer Lazor.  Not saying it is the right thing to do.

The problem with promoting from within is you need someone from outside who was in a good organization and can bring some of that structure here.

People within will just do things the same way.

On defense, I'd try to sign a mobile MLB like Denzel Perryman or Kwon Alexander (injured now). Then I'd sign an Outside LB like Deone Buchanon who used to be a Safety and is mobile.

I'd waive Burfict as he's eventually going to get banned anyways and he's always hurt. I'd also move on from Preston Brown.

We need fast, mobile LB's who can cover. I'm cool with starting Vigil at OLB.

Then the backups would be Jefferson and Evans.

(11-14-2018, 01:55 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: The problem with promoting from within is you need someone from outside who was in a good organization and can bring some of that structure here.

People within will just do things the same way.

But that's what the Bengals front office has done in the past and I assume they will do it again unfortunately. the exception of course was Marvin Lewis and that was because Katie insisted on it.

(11-12-2018, 02:39 PM)fredtoast Wrote: 1.  Hire that coach who has won a lot but never lost enough to get fired.

2.  Hire an OC who is young and aggressive with the pass game but who also sticks with the run.

3.  Hire the DC who is aggressive and blitzes, but also does not give up any big plays.

4.  Then I trade away our proven QB and take one of those guys in the first round that is a can't-miss sure-thing, not a first round bust like Rex Grossman, Kyle Boller, J.P. Losman, Jason Campbell, Jay Cutler, Matt Leinert, Brady Quinn, Jamarcus Russell, Josh Freeman, Mark Sanchez, Tim Tebow, Christian Ponder, Blaine Gabbert, Jake Locker, Branden Weeden, Robert Griffen, E. J. Manuel, Teddy Bridegwater, Johnny Manziel, Blake Bortles, or Paxton Lynch.

Or maybe spot the mid round QB like Montana or Brady? By the way.. that list of Bust QB's missed Ryan Leaf and Akili Smith.   David klingler also was a bit of a dud.

I remember the Niners floundering.... trading picks for has beens. Then? New Owner brings in Bill Walsh.   That went well.

Our 3 "starting" LB's ain't bad... but  we seldom had all 3.  We really have not got the O-line right but....made progress.   I THOUGHT we'd try to salvage Fisher and Ced Og, but...........under the bus.   Bill Walsh would have made those guys WINNERS.   Bengals don't SEE "talent".
I was STUNNED when Bengals left Jerry Rice on the board and took Eddie Brown. Brown was GOOD..............Rice was THE FRIGGIN BEST. 
Walsh...... could SHAPE a guy with some raw tools into a STUD.

our O-Line has NOT been as bad as last year, but Andy has  had to work fast.  Glenn?    At almost 350 he's BIG and not quick. More built for RT , but even so, has been okay at LT.   Face it........were not a lot of ideal options.

I  guess we COULD deal away guys but........I do NOT see teams paying for even pretty soliid veterans.  USED to be, a Big Name...you get several juicy picks.  Now? Maybe a rd 6.

Gut the management.
Retire Marv.
Create a staff with proven winners.


This team is not going to have a winning environment with the current personnel. The winning environment will come from the outside. But until then, nothing to do but go through the motions until there is absolute change.