(09-23-2015, 03:39 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: It still doesn't change the fact that recently we have been killing them (opinion). The last two years we played them we are 3-1 against them (fact), and the one lost that we did have it went to overtime (fact), so it was VERY close (opinion). You have to get games from 4 years ago when the team had very little offensive weapons (opinion), and was rebuilding (opinion) with a rookie QB (fact), and rookie WR (fact) for it to look like they have been competitive with us (opinion).

(09-23-2015, 03:45 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: All I use is facts, you just ignore them.

I'm pretty sure you don't understand the difference between a fact and an opinion. Just thought I'd let you know that you shouldn't say "all I use is fact" when your last post before that one was filled with plenty of opinions, if you want to get technical.

(09-23-2015, 03:45 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: All I use is facts, you just ignore them.

Are you 2 really husband and wife?

(09-23-2015, 03:54 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Sounds to me that Palmer has only won 8 games since 2013. Man he must suck.

See, this is where, were I like you, I'd start making excuses and coming up with reasons the injury wasn't his fault and then I'd mention that he is 15-2 in his last 17 games (I choose the cutoff point somewhat arbitrarily to bolster my point at the cost of fairness), and so on and so forth. Oh, he's also thrown like 30-some TDs to 11 INTs (only 7 if you take out that Seahawks game for no reason).  I'm not making an actual argument here, I'm just showing you what it's like to argue with someone who does.

(09-23-2015, 03:54 PM)djs7685 Wrote: I'm pretty sure you don't understand the difference between a fact and an opinion. Just thought I'd let you know that you shouldn't say "all I use is fact" when your last post before that one was filled with plenty of opinions, if you want to get technical.

We have been killing them. That's not an opinion. If a game that goes into overtime isn't close then I don't know what is. We didn't have very good offensive weapons in 2011. Our #2 was Simpson, who could barley get 700 yards as a #1. Being 3-1 against a team, and the only win they have went to OT is whooping their asses on a regular basis.

(09-23-2015, 04:01 PM)Nately120 Wrote: See, this is where, were I like you, I'd start making excuses and coming up with reasons the injury wasn't his fault and then I'd mention that he is 15-2 in his last 17 games (I choose the cutoff point somewhat arbitrarily to bolster my point at the cost of fairness), and so on and so forth.  Oh, he's also thrown like 30-some TDs to 11 INTs (only 7 if you take out that Seahawks game for no reason).  I'm not making an actual argument here, I'm just showing you what it's like to argue with someone who does.

That's where I would bring up that he was going against lousy secondaries, and only 5 teams in those 17 games with .500 or better record. We could go on and on about it.

(09-23-2015, 04:14 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: That's where I would bring up that he was going against lousy secondaries, and only 5 teams in those 17 games with .500 or better record. We could go on and on about it.

Yes yes, if only every QB were fortunate enough to go up against enough lousy secondaries to go 15-2!  My god, the luck of the Irish must run through Carson's veins!

(09-23-2015, 03:16 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Yeah, because making Carson look better isn't your agenda.

The QB's on the teams that Marvin has coached is irrelevant when talking about Marvin's success vs the Ravens. You have to look at Marvin's success as a whole. You didn't specify the "AD" or "CP" era's, Nately did, and Nately pointed out that Marvin and CP had a winning record whereas Marvin and AD are currently at .500.

(09-23-2015, 04:23 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Yes yes, if only every QB were fortunate enough to go up against enough lousy secondaries to go 15-2!  My god, the luck of the Irish must run through Carson's veins!

Yeah he's really lucky. I mean what QB wouldn't want to only go against defenses like the Bears, Saints, Redskins, Philly, Dallas, ect...

(09-23-2015, 04:13 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: We have been killing them. That's not an opinion. If a game that goes into overtime isn't close then I don't know what is. We didn't have very good offensive weapons in 2011. Our #2 was Simpson, who could barley get 700 yards as a #1. Being 3-1 against a team, and the only win they have went to OT is whooping their asses on a regular basis.

I hope you aren't serious. I honestly do think you're more intelligent than this.

Stuff like "killing them", "close game", and "lack of weapons" are subjective terms and are absolutely opinions.

I happen to agree with most of your points there, but it doesn't make them any less opinion based. Just sayin', it's bad to say that you only speak in facts when you had an opinion laced tirade just minutes beforehand.

The only thing I disagree with is about "killing them". Almost every single Ravens game in recent memory has been pretty close unless I'm forgetting one or two. Can't remember any real blowouts.

(09-23-2015, 04:48 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: The QB's on the teams that Marvin has coached is irrelevant when talking about Marvin's success vs the Ravens. You have to look at Marvin's success as a whole. You didn't specify the "AD" or "CP" era's, Nately did, and Nately pointed out that Marvin and CP had a winning record whereas Marvin and AD are currently at .500.

I think we should discuss why Marvin and Fitzmagic were 0-1 against those dastardly Ravens!

(09-23-2015, 05:12 PM)djs7685 Wrote: The only thing I disagree with is about "killing them". Almost every single Ravens game in recent memory has been pretty close unless I'm forgetting one or two. Can't remember any real blowouts.

We really killed them in 2013 when you take into account that we won despite 4 Dalton INTs that I'm sure were all due to AJ running lazy routes and bad playcalling and so on.

(09-23-2015, 05:12 PM)djs7685 Wrote: I hope you aren't serious. I honestly do think you're more intelligent than this.

Stuff like "killing them", "close game", and "lack of weapons" are subjective terms and are absolutely opinions.

I happen to agree with most of your points there, but it doesn't make them any less opinion based. Just sayin', it's bad to say that you only speak in facts when you had an opinion laced tirade just minutes beforehand.

The only thing I disagree with is about "killing them". Almost every single Ravens game in recent memory has been pretty close unless I'm forgetting one or two. Can't remember any real blowouts.

Agreed about "killing them." We've only beaten them by 10+ points 5 times since this rivalry started. 2013's season ending victory by 17 is our largest margin of victory ever against them.

(09-23-2015, 03:08 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Ok, have it your way.  Marvin is 0-0 against the Ravens!

thank you

(09-23-2015, 05:16 PM)Nately120 Wrote: We really killed them in 2013 when you take into account that we won despite 4 Dalton INTs that I'm sure were all due to AJ running lazy routes and bad playcalling and so on.

Actually at least 2 of those INTs wasn't his fault. I'm not on my computer so I can't give you the specifics until I get home.

(09-23-2015, 07:00 PM)Brownshoe Wrote: Actually at least 2 of those INTs wasn't his fault. I'm not on my computer so I can't give you the specifics until I get home.

The fact that you have a document saved on your home computer that shows (your opinion of) how to blame everyone but Andy for his INTs pretty much says it all.

Can't we do what we do for every other QB and let his statistics just be his statistics? You can't get much more ridiculous unless you start to claim his second half INTs aren't a bad thing because he wouldn't have thrown them if Bernard didn't fumble in the first half. Oh, wait...

(09-23-2015, 09:32 PM)djs7685 Wrote: The fact that you have a document saved on your home computer that shows (your opinion of) how to blame everyone but Andy for his INTs pretty much says it all.

Can't we do what we do for every other QB and let his statistics just be his statistics? You can't get much more ridiculous unless you start to claim his second half INTs aren't a bad thing because he wouldn't have thrown them if Bernard didn't fumble in the first half. Oh, wait...

I don't have any documents saved on my computer. I was just going to look up a highlight video to look at his INTs, and I remembered that game had at least 2 picks that wasn't his fault.

Daltons first INT was because Jones tipped the ball when he could have caught it.
Daltons second INT was on him
They didn't show the 3rd INT
Daltons third INT was because Green got the ball ripped out of his hands

0-3 for baltimore would be crippling. That would give the steelers a chance for the knockout punch the following week in pittsburgh.

(09-24-2015, 12:45 AM)Brownshoe Wrote: I don't have any documents saved on my computer. I was just going to look up a highlight video to look at his INTs, and I remembered that game had at least 2 picks that wasn't his fault.

Daltons first INT was because Jones tipped the ball when he could have caught it.
Daltons second INT was on him
They didn't show the 3rd INT
Daltons third INT was because Green got the ball ripped out of his hands

The "it's not my fault coach, he ... he did it" just doesn't work at this level. And anyone who was a leader would take responsibility for it and move on. Better ball placement and none of those would have been INTs, it's as simple as that.

The Bengals have always been solid against the Ravens under Marvin Lewis. There's been a few lulls here and there, but the Bengals look like they have their number again.

They've always owned Joe Flacco (69.6 rating, 13 TD's to 18 INTs) and Dalton - who used to struggle against the Ravens - posted a 94.7 rating against them last year. Obviously Dalton's initial struggles contributed to some of those early losses.

Now that Dalton is playing well against them while Flacco continues to struggle, I'm pretty optimistic that we'll at least split with them. Another sweep is a strong possibility as long as we stay healthy.

(09-23-2015, 02:24 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Marvin has won 3 in a row against his old team, and has an overall record of 14-10 head-to-head with the Ravens.

This weekend is a chance to really put a dent in the Ravens season.  I know it is early, but a loss at home to drop to 0-3 would be brutal.

The Ravens are going to play like a wild animal cornered in a room fighting for survival. They have that in them. The real question is do the Bengals have that hunger? We've seen all too often in the past how they mentally come out flat after a nice win the previous week. This would be a great win for us if we pull it off.