(09-03-2019, 10:33 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: I think we'd like to believe that.

Reality is he was an Assistant WR coach 2 years ago and a QB Coach last year. Most teams would not hire a guy that inexperienced as a HC. So it's not like he had a ton of leverage.

It was a weird coaching search this year for all of the vacancies. Usually 2-3 teams compete to hire the same guy. This year, it seems like all of the teams had different targets.

Miami did.  The Bears did.  The Rams did.  The Packers did.  The Cardinals hired a guy who was a loser in college.  The Browns did.  Every HC was a new HC at one time or another. 

All you have to do is look at how different things are this year.  He got here and immediately renovated all the offices.  He let most of last year's staff go.  Mike Brown paying two coaching staffs?  The hell you say.  He has the largest coaching staff ever for a Bengals team. 

Practices are very different.  Listen to the players.  They know way better than any of us.  Most everything is different. 

Allow me to quote, or, at least, paraphrase Lap on ZT's interview--He blew them away.  BLEW THEM AWAY.  That's why he got the job, because he knew exactly how he wanted to do things and that is exactly how things are being done.  That speaks directly to how much power he has.  Any fool can connect those dots  

(09-03-2019, 11:04 AM)McC Wrote:  Any fool can connect those dots  

Lighten up, Francis.

We have no idea how much power he has.  You apparently have never seen any team bring in a new coach because every single one of them makes some changes.  And every single one gets praised by the players to the press.

Just because Zac got to pick a new color of paint for the office walls does not mean he has control over the players we signed or drafted.

I think Marvin 2003 was given more power than ZT 2019. We've really started over from where Marvin took us.

Look at the FA classes and legit players Marvin was allowed to bring in to establish his program compared to what ZT is working with (same players outside of the draft and Miller).

ZT is far behind the road Marvin traveled as a starting point. Marvin was given an opportunity to succeed from year 1. ZT has to make passable chicken salad from the same leftovers that gave folks food poisoning the last time they ate it.

(09-03-2019, 12:21 PM)jj22 Wrote: I think Marvin 2003 was given more power than ZT 2019. We've really started over from where Marvin took us.

Look at the FA classes and legit players Marvin was allowed to bring in to establish his program compared to what ZT is working with (same players outside of the draft and Miller).

ZT is far behind the road Marvin traveled as a starting point. Marvin was given an opportunity to succeed. ZT has to make passable chicken salad from the same leftovers that gave folks food poisoning the last time they ate it.

I completely disagree.  I believe ZT walked in the door with as much power as Marvin ever had.  Read the tea leaves.

(09-03-2019, 12:19 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Lighten up, Francis.

We have no idea how much power he has.  You apparently have never seen any team bring in a new coach because every single one of them makes some changes.  And every single one gets praised by the players to the press.

Just because Zac got to pick a new color of paint for the office walls does not mean he has control over the players we signed or drafted.

The Raiders weren't saying good things about Bill Callahan...

(09-03-2019, 12:19 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Lighten up, Francis.

We have no idea how much power he has.  You apparently have never seen any team bring in a new coach because every single one of them makes some changes.  And every single one gets praised by the players to the press.

Just because Zac got to pick a new color of paint for the office walls does not mean he has control over the players we signed or drafted.

He didn't just paint the walls.  They tore it all down and redid it.

He gutted the coaching staff, including many still under contract. 

Look, I know how your bizarre Mervin man love works.  But ZT changed pretty much everything.  That is not a shot at Merv, so put your goofy little radar away.

But any fool can see the changes, unless, of course, they refuse to.

(09-03-2019, 08:47 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: When you say "Marvin left" do you mean "Marvin was fired?"

Know I mean Marvin left it was a mutual decision between him & Brown.

(09-03-2019, 12:47 PM)McC Wrote: But any fool can see the changes, unless, of course, they refuse to.

And any fool who can read will know I said this

(09-03-2019, 12:19 PM)fredtoast Wrote:  You apparently have never seen any team bring in a new coach because every single one of them makes some changes. 

Just because Zac got to pick a new color of paint for the office walls does not mean he has control over the players we signed or drafted.

(09-03-2019, 01:00 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: Know I mean Marvin left it was a mutual decision between him & Brown.

Link please.

(09-03-2019, 12:26 PM)McC Wrote:   Read the tea leaves.

The tea leaves tell me that the Bengals did almost nothing in free agency to improve the talent level on the roster.

That tells me Zac does not have as much power as you believe.

(09-03-2019, 01:03 PM)fredtoast Wrote: The tea leaves tell me that the Bengals did almost nothing in free agency to improve the talent level on the roster.

That tells me Zac does not have as much power as you believe.

Or there weren't really any answers out there who fit what he wanted that were worth the price tag.  I guess it really just comes down to how the individual wants to look at it.

(09-03-2019, 01:00 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: Know I mean Marvin left it was a mutual decision between him & Brown.

Like, he agreed that he should be fired?

(09-03-2019, 01:23 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: Like, he agreed that he should be fired?

No, but maybe he agreed that he had lost his desire or had just plain fallen too far behind the rest of the league, that he had just run out of answers.

Answer: Enough.

(09-03-2019, 01:03 PM)fredtoast Wrote: The tea leaves tell me that the Bengals did almost nothing in free agency to improve the talent level on the roster.

That tells me Zac does not have as much power as you believe.

Exactly my point! McVay goes to the Rams and adds several starters.

ZT comes here and gets several depth guys.

No coach would be happy with this free agency period.

(09-03-2019, 01:22 PM)McC Wrote: Or there weren't really any answers out there who fit what he wanted that were worth the price tag.  I guess it really just comes down to how the individual wants to look at it.

There absolutely were free agents out there that could upgrade teams. It's absurd to think otherwise.

(09-03-2019, 01:27 PM)McC Wrote: No, but maybe he agreed that he had lost his desire or had just plain fallen too far behind the rest of the league, that he had just run out of answers.

Link?

(09-03-2019, 01:22 PM)McC Wrote: Or there weren't really any answers out there who fit what he wanted that were worth the price tag.  I guess it really just comes down to how the individual wants to look at it.

So you choose to believe that there were no free agents available that could have upgraded the talent for a team whose defense was dead last in the league with a 26th ranked offense? 

(09-03-2019, 01:49 PM)fredtoast Wrote: So you choose to believe that there were no free agents available that could have upgraded the talent for a team whose defense was dead last in the league with a 26th ranked offense? 

This is apparently a borderline Super Bowl-caliber roster in some of these posters minds apparently waiting for ZT's brilliance to come in and put them over the top.

(09-03-2019, 01:02 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Link please.

(09-03-2019, 01:23 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: Like, he agreed that he should be fired?

1.I)pretty much common sense that him an Brown had a great relationship.
2.) dude was here for 16 years I think it's fair to say that Marvin just wanted a new opportunity.
3.) Marvin had a going away news conference how many guys do that after being fired.