(04-20-2020, 08:31 PM)Synric Wrote: Don't forget it's not just Willie Gay Jr.'s off-field incendents that's an issue he also has on-field red flags. Lack of experience leads to a slow processor and only average instincts. Hes a hard hitter but doesnt have a very strong punch so he has issues stacking blockers. Poor vision scrapping laterally and bad angles lead to alot of missed plays.

He has a decent ceiling but his lack of experience means a low floor.

He also has a history of dumb personal fouls and was tossed from a game for fighting.  He's like Vontaze Burfict, except with off field issues to go with the on field ones.  You'd think people would learn after the Steelers playoff game.  He's undisciplined and exactly the type of guy opponents will goad into self destructing at the worst possible moment.

(04-21-2020, 12:20 AM)Whatever Wrote: He also has a history of dumb personal fouls and was tossed from a game for fighting.  He's like Vontaze Burfict, except with off field issues to go with the on field ones.  You'd think people would learn after the Steelers playoff game.  He's undisciplined and exactly the type of guy opponents will goad into self destructing at the worst possible moment.

Thanks for talking me back out of this pick.

(04-21-2020, 12:47 AM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Thanks for talking me back out of this pick.

I don't know, Nate.  I think that a player with his physical abilities would be a good value at the top of the 4th round.  But yes, red flags all over the place make him a very reckless selection in the top 100 picks.

(04-20-2020, 11:05 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Really changed my mind about Willie. He seems alright in the head.

Thanks for the vid Okeana. Sometimes I judge a bit early in the Draft.

Thanks again. I am for Drafting William Gay Jr now in the mid rounds.

glad to hear it.  He's for sure a developmental guy that your drafting for athletic upside.  Not a perfect player, but if he was he would be in the first not the late 2nd/3rd round.  He's also just turned 22 so he has a lot of upside.

(04-21-2020, 12:47 AM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Thanks for talking me back out of this pick.

" The third and last issue revolves around Gay being ejected from the Egg Bowl in 2018. A fight broke out while Mississippi State was playing Ole Miss, their biggest rival. Gay was ejected after incurring two separate “unsportsmanlike conduct” penalties.

This situation however, involves a little nuance, as every player during that game received an “unsportsmanlike conduct” following a brawl that saw the benches from both teams hit the field. During the fight, Gay was relatively reserved and did not instigate or continue the fight. But since he had already received a similar penalty, he and several other players were ejected from the game.
The Egg Bowl is a tradition in Mississippi, where the two biggest schools in the state play against each other. The stakes in this game are more than just bragging rights and pride. These two schools recruit heavily from the same areas and a recent win in the Egg Bowl can be what it takes to convince a high school recruit. "




This is what happens when people read a snippet but don't actually know or understand what happened.  AGAIN he doesn't have the issues on the field that make him like Burfict in any way.  He's never been considered a dirty player or someone who intentionally tries to hurt people.  Let's not forget that the thing everyone remembers about Burfict in the Steeler's game is the helmet to helmet hits and his inability to learn to tackle differently.

What I recall about that game is he created 2 turnovers and what should have been the game sealing interception. Had Jeremy Hill not fumbled, Burfict would have been the player of the game. They would not have been in a position to win that game had Burfict not been a Bengal. Burfict did some terrible things as a Bengal but he was also the reason the defense as a whole elevated.

Bottom line here.... the Bengals have the inside track on information on this kid in some ways, if he becomes a Bengal I am good with it. If he isn't on the Bengals board at all then I assume given their inside track with the former position coach has led them to that informed decision. I am good with that too. A lot of times the only difference between a good solid player and a draft flameout is a chip on their shoulder or that extra edge that other players don't have.

(04-21-2020, 12:52 PM)SErebel11 Wrote: What I recall about that game is he created 2 turnovers and what should have been the game sealing interception. Had Jeremy Hill not fumbled, Burfict would have been the player of the game. They would not have been in a position to win that game had Burfict not been a Bengal. Burfict did some terrible things as a Bengal but he was also the reason the defense as a whole elevated.

Bottom line here.... the Bengals have the inside track on information on this kid in some ways, if he becomes a Bengal I am good with it. If he isn't on the Bengals board at all then I assume given their inside track with the former position coach has led them to that informed decision. I am good with that too. A lot of times the only difference between a good solid player and a draft flameout is a chip on their shoulder or that extra edge that other players don't have.

exactly I like the guy, but i'm not going to cry if we don't get him.  I think ADG may be my favorite linebacker prospect in the draft just because of the style of play.

(04-21-2020, 12:31 PM)Okeana Wrote: " The third and last issue revolves around Gay being ejected from the Egg Bowl in 2018. A fight broke out while Mississippi State was playing Ole Miss, their biggest rival. Gay was ejected after incurring two separate “unsportsmanlike conduct” penalties.

This situation however, involves a little nuance, as every player during that game received an “unsportsmanlike conduct” following a brawl that saw the benches from both teams hit the field. During the fight, Gay was relatively reserved and did not instigate or continue the fight. But since he had already received a similar penalty, he and several other players were ejected from the game.
The Egg Bowl is a tradition in Mississippi, where the two biggest schools in the state play against each other. The stakes in this game are more than just bragging rights and pride. These two schools recruit heavily from the same areas and a recent win in the Egg Bowl can be what it takes to convince a high school recruit. "




This is what happens when people read a snippet but don't actually know or understand what happened.  AGAIN he doesn't have the issues on the field that make him like Burfict in any way.  He's never been considered a dirty player or someone who intentionally tries to hurt people.  Let's not forget that the thing everyone remembers about Burfict in the Steeler's game is the helmet to helmet hits and his inability to learn to tackle differently.

Uh, except it doesn't refer to the Egg Bowl.  You realize the Egg Bowl wasn't the only game he got tossed out of last year, right?  He got tossed out of his first game back against Kentucky for getting into it with an opposing player.

"Gay's second personal foul came after senior defensive end Chauncey Rivers came up with a sack on third down as Kentucky was threatening to score just before halftime. Gay, energetic as ever, celebrated the play a little too much, much to the chagrin of a Wildcat who engaged Gay in the minor altercation that ultimately was his last act on the field. 

"The ironic part of it is right before we left the sideline on the defensive huddle I told him that we needed to keep our composure and not respond back to any chippiness or anything like that," Moorhead said."


Dude literally went right out there and got himself ejected after his coach reminded him to keep his composure.  And this was his first game back after serving his supspension.  Dude has zero composure.  

Folks need to just stop. Most fouls he's gotten was because he was celebrating. he got kicked out of The Egg bowl because every player on both sides got flagged for a fight in which Gay took no part. The dude was a Sophomore.

He got kicked out of UK game because he took his helmet off to celebrate with the fans after he got a pick 6 and then pushed Logan Stenberg back after he was celebrating with a teammate.

Dude has the highest pass defense rating per PFF than any college LB since 2017. He's big, fast, and brings to wood.

(04-21-2020, 05:23 PM)Whatever Wrote: Uh, except it doesn't refer to the Egg Bowl.  You realize the Egg Bowl wasn't the only game he got tossed out of last year, right?  He got tossed out of his first game back against Kentucky for getting into it with an opposing player.

"Gay's second personal foul came after senior defensive end Chauncey Rivers came up with a sack on third down as Kentucky was threatening to score just before halftime. Gay, energetic as ever, celebrated the play a little too much, much to the chagrin of a Wildcat who engaged Gay in the minor altercation that ultimately was his last act on the field. 

"The ironic part of it is right before we left the sideline on the defensive huddle I told him that we needed to keep our composure and not respond back to any chippiness or anything like that," Moorhead said."


Dude literally went right out there and got himself ejected after his coach reminded him to keep his composure.  And this was his first game back after serving his supspension.  Dude has zero composure.  

And then Moorhead went on to say Gay loves hisv team and he would take 100 Willie Gay's on his roster if he could. So yeah there's that. 

(04-21-2020, 07:48 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Folks need to just stop. Most fouls he's gotten was because he was celebrating. he got kicked out of The Egg bowl because every player on both sides got flagged for a fight in which Gay took no part. The dude was a Sophomore.

He got kicked out of UK game because he took his helmet off to celebrate with the fans after he got a pick 6 and then pushed Logan Stenberg back after he was celebrating with a teammate.

Dude has the highest pass defense rating per PFF than any college LB since 2017. He's big, fast, and brings to wood.

And finally, the ban, has been lifted...

(04-21-2020, 07:57 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: And finally, the ban, has been lifted...

Yep!
Welcome back Bfine

(04-21-2020, 07:57 PM)Fullrock Wrote: And then Moorhead went on to say Gay loves hisv team and he would take 100 Willie Gay's on his roster if he could. So yeah there's that. 

College HC's almost universally talk up their guys for the draft.  If they put out highly drafted players, they have an easier time on the recruiting trail.  

(04-21-2020, 07:48 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Folks need to just stop. Most fouls he's gotten was because he was celebrating. he got kicked out of The Egg bowl because every player on both sides got flagged for a fight in which Gay took no part. The dude was a Sophomore.

He got kicked out of UK game because he took his helmet off to celebrate with the fans after he got a pick 6 and then pushed Logan Stenberg back after he was celebrating with a teammate.

Dude has the highest pass defense rating per PFF than any college LB since 2017. He's big, fast, and brings to wood.

Yeah, who cares if he hits his QB in non contact drills?  Who cares if he breaks the QB's face, even? Who cares if he gets himself suspended?  Who cares if he takes dumb personal fouls and gets himself ejected?  He can cover...at least when he's not suspended or banished to the locker room.  He's liable to give the offense a cheap first down by celebrating excessively if he makes the stop, but hey, he can cover.

I can overlook one or two isolated incidents, but the kid has had problem after problem and his defenders seem to think he's always a victim.  When you cause that much trouble, it's because you're the problem, not because you're just unlucky.  

(04-22-2020, 01:23 AM)Whatever Wrote: Yeah, who cares if he hits his QB in non contact drills?  Who cares if he breaks the QB's face, even? Who cares if he gets himself suspended?  Who cares if he takes dumb personal fouls and gets himself ejected?  He can cover...at least when he's not suspended or banished to the locker room.  He's liable to give the offense a cheap first down by celebrating excessively if he makes the stop, but hey, he can cover.

I can overlook one or two isolated incidents, but the kid has had problem after problem and his defenders seem to think he's always a victim.  When you cause that much trouble, it's because you're the problem, not because you're just unlucky.  

I would really like to take the chance on this kid in the 5th round if he drops and is still there just for his high motor and talent alone. 
But, I would imagine, that with all the trouble they had with Burfect, Mike Brown and Tobin have crossed this player off their board most likely. 

(04-21-2020, 09:35 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I don't know, Nate.  I think that a player with his physical abilities would be a good value at the top of the 4th round.  But yes, red flags all over the place make him a very reckless selection in the top 100 picks.

Would have to be a mid round pick, just don't take this guy early.

(04-21-2020, 12:23 PM)Okeana Wrote: glad to hear it.  He's for sure a developmental guy that your drafting for athletic upside.  Not a perfect player, but if he was he would be in the first not the late 2nd/3rd round.  He's also just turned 22 so he has a lot of upside.

(04-21-2020, 12:31 PM)Okeana Wrote: " The third and last issue revolves around Gay being ejected from the Egg Bowl in 2018. A fight broke out while Mississippi State was playing Ole Miss, their biggest rival. Gay was ejected after incurring two separate “unsportsmanlike conduct” penalties.

This situation however, involves a little nuance, as every player during that game received an “unsportsmanlike conduct” following a brawl that saw the benches from both teams hit the field. During the fight, Gay was relatively reserved and did not instigate or continue the fight. But since he had already received a similar penalty, he and several other players were ejected from the game.
The Egg Bowl is a tradition in Mississippi, where the two biggest schools in the state play against each other. The stakes in this game are more than just bragging rights and pride. These two schools recruit heavily from the same areas and a recent win in the Egg Bowl can be what it takes to convince a high school recruit. "




This is what happens when people read a snippet but don't actually know or understand what happened.  AGAIN he doesn't have the issues on the field that make him like Burfict in any way.  He's never been considered a dirty player or someone who intentionally tries to hurt people.  Let's not forget that the thing everyone remembers about Burfict in the Steeler's game is the helmet to helmet hits and his inability to learn to tackle differently.

Man, this is getting hard to judge lol

For him in the mid rounds though now.

Before had him completely off my board.

(04-21-2020, 12:52 PM)SErebel11 Wrote: What I recall about that game is he created 2 turnovers and what should have been the game sealing interception. Had Jeremy Hill not fumbled, Burfict would have been the player of the game. They would not have been in a position to win that game had Burfict not been a Bengal. Burfict did some terrible things as a Bengal but he was also the reason the defense as a whole elevated.

Bottom line here.... the Bengals have the inside track on information on this kid in some ways, if he becomes a Bengal I am good with it. If he isn't on the Bengals board at all then I assume given their inside track with the former position coach has led them to that informed decision. I am good with that too. A lot of times the only difference between a good solid player and a draft flameout is a chip on their shoulder or that extra edge that other players don't have.

Nice post.

(04-21-2020, 05:23 PM)Whatever Wrote: Uh, except it doesn't refer to the Egg Bowl.  You realize the Egg Bowl wasn't the only game he got tossed out of last year, right?  He got tossed out of his first game back against Kentucky for getting into it with an opposing player.

"Gay's second personal foul came after senior defensive end Chauncey Rivers came up with a sack on third down as Kentucky was threatening to score just before halftime. Gay, energetic as ever, celebrated the play a little too much, much to the chagrin of a Wildcat who engaged Gay in the minor altercation that ultimately was his last act on the field. 

"The ironic part of it is right before we left the sideline on the defensive huddle I told him that we needed to keep our composure and not respond back to any chippiness or anything like that," Moorhead said."


Dude literally went right out there and got himself ejected after his coach reminded him to keep his composure.  And this was his first game back after serving his supspension.  Dude has zero composure.  

A lot of going back and forth on this pick ha ha

(04-21-2020, 07:48 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Folks need to just stop. Most fouls he's gotten was because he was celebrating. he got kicked out of The Egg bowl because every player on both sides got flagged for a fight in which Gay took no part. The dude was a Sophomore.

He got kicked out of UK game because he took his helmet off to celebrate with the fans after he got a pick 6 and then pushed Logan Stenberg back after he was celebrating with a teammate.

Dude has the highest pass defense rating per PFF than any college LB since 2017. He's big, fast, and brings to wood.

Welcome back Bfine.  

Right in time for the Draft.

(04-22-2020, 01:23 AM)Whatever Wrote: Yeah, who cares if he hits his QB in non contact drills?  Who cares if he breaks the QB's face, even? Who cares if he gets himself suspended?  Who cares if he takes dumb personal fouls and gets himself ejected?  He can cover...at least when he's not suspended or banished to the locker room.  He's liable to give the offense a cheap first down by celebrating excessively if he makes the stop, but hey, he can cover.

I can overlook one or two isolated incidents, but the kid has had problem after problem and his defenders seem to think he's always a victim.  When you cause that much trouble, it's because you're the problem, not because you're just unlucky.  

The multiplicity is what concerns me about this guy no doubt.

(04-21-2020, 07:57 PM)Truck_1_0_1_ Wrote: And finally, the ban, has been lifted...

(04-21-2020, 10:58 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Yep!
Welcome back Bfine

(04-22-2020, 07:55 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Welcome back Bfine.  

Right in time for the Draft.

Thanks. We'll see how long it lasts